A typical lockdown puppy....

BBP

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I’m so frustrated. I have a Facebook friend, we know each other from school. This year with lockdown she decides she’s going to get a puppy as the kids want one and she now works from home. But she doesn’t want one that sheds or gets dirt and fur everywhere. So it needs to be a poodle type. Lots of people were suggesting breeds and how their poo is the best poo ever. So I put a reply talking about how to select a breeder when looking for a puppy, ask about the genetic health tests for the breed, see the mum with the puppies, watch out for those who have bred to their male pet (as it might be because they can not because it’s a carefully thought out pairing), how many litters has the bitch had, his have they socialised it, all that stuff. Watch out for backyard breeders and puppy farms basically.

Puppy, a chihuahua x miniature poodle, is a pretty enough little thing and has been with her 2 months now. It is sick for the second time. Swollen tummy, loads of fluid and retained feaces and enlarged heart. I suggested she give the breeder a call to see if there is anything genetically in the pups background that might give the vets more info. ‘Oh, I could try them, but to be honest they weren’t proper breeders and it was an ‘accidental’ little (the inverted commas are mine), and it was a pretty rough place.’

It makes me really sad that she seems to be another one who has fed the back yard breeder regime with cash because she wanted a cute fashionable ‘chi-poo’ right now.

Another Facebook friend did the same with a pug and bought one where it’s eyes are too big for its sockets. It looks a happy little thing but so so deformed, they eyes are always pointing different directions to each other.

I know I’m not one to talk, I don’t have a perfect dog. He’s probably harder work than these two pups will ever be. But at least he had the advantage of being from sound, healthy, health tested lines.
 

Clodagh

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That is so sad. Poor pups.
My husbands aunt and uncle, both mid 80s, he with cancer, got a springer spaniel x poodle. They only ever had show labs before, and no dog at all for 10 years. They can’t do a thing with it and it is now biting them.
 

meleeka

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People are stupid. A friend wanted a puppy. she bought a Husky x Pomeranian, hoping it would be more Pomeranian. Of course it’s just a small Husky! To be fair he’s a lovely dog but barely gets walked and is one of those uncontrollable dogs that’s “just being friendly” when it’s running riot. At least he’s healthy, unlike another friends Pug. How anyone chooses to buy a puppy that’s a walking vet bill is beyond me. I couldn’t cope with the stress of a sick dog. Of course we all take that chance, but knowing it’s going to happen is very different.
 

SOS

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The majority of people don’t care about where they come from and don’t seem to even do any research. Especially when finding a good breeder takes time, patience and often comes at a greater cost (rightly so).

This year I’ve seen NUMEROUS people:
- Buy a dog without meeting any of the parents or even going to the breeders house. In some case couriered in lockdowns.
- Buy a dog despite knowing it was from a puppy farm as they “felt sorry” and were rescuing it
- Ask why their 10 week old puppy is “crazy” and biting their children... to which I responded have they even read a book.
- Present very poorly, unwormed and unvaccinated puppies and not seem to be concerned by this. To then complain about the price of treatment.
-Many under age or unmicrochipped puppies
-Lots of nervous poorly socialised animals which are already presenting a handful and being rehomed

Why any first time dog owner would chose a poo breed is beyond me. Poodles can be notoriously stubborn and difficult hence why they are quite a niche breed to own. To then cross with working line spaniels leads to a very high energy, intelligent but stubborn animal. And they are not truly hypoallergenic in any shape or form, just don’t moult as much.

I got a puppy this year, after pausing my search during the first lockdown as global pandemic didn’t scream stable home life to me. It took a LOT of time and work and the majority of breeders advertising were awful. In the end the breeder found me which I was lucky for but if you were naive (or more likely ignorant), dodgy breeders were having a field day.
 

BBP

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That is so sad. Poor pups.
My husbands aunt and uncle, both mid 80s, he with cancer, got a springer spaniel x poodle. They only ever had show labs before, and no dog at all for 10 years. They can’t do a thing with it and it is now biting them.
That doesn’t seem a good choice at all! I got a collie as a first dog, which was equally daft, but I was prepared to put in the work and change my life to suit the dog.
 

deb_l222

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The first part of your post speaks volumes; she doesn't want a dog that gets dirty of sheds hair. Hmmmm that's what dogs do, it's a fact of life. Just because it's a 'poo' won't miraculously make it super clean :)

It's so very sad but these lockdown pups and dogs must be doing OK because rescues are fairly empty at the moment, as are the stray kennels. At least in this neck of the woods they are but only time will tell how long that will last when things get back to 'normal' next year.

Clodagh - that's very sad. Sad for the couple but also sad for the dog because he just sounds frustrated and not living his best life. They probably need to give him up now before the situation gets much worse and they get really hurt. Poodles are highly intelligent dogs and combined with the idiocy of some springers, it's a recipe for disaster, just like it is with some cockerpoos.
 

Mrs Jingle

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All this puppy mill stuff breaks my heart. I can't tell you how ashamed I am of all the Irish puppy mills that flood the Uk and European market every single day of the year...how do they even smuggle that many in????

It isn't always the buyers fault though - Even after decades of owning and buying and even breeding pups (they both came to me accidentally in pup not intentionally bred I hastily add!) And I have worked in rescue here.

I was caught myself in recent years. I researched as much as I could at that time a breeder offering chocolate labs for sale - they ticked all the right boxes for being a responsible dog breeder, we went to see the pups and saw both parents and spent time with the woman and the litter. Within a short few months we were concerned about the on/off limpin from our new pup.

After a lot of vet work, including going to UCD Dublin for full xrays and consulting with an expert in the field, at less than a year old she was already showing significant signs of hip displacia on both sides and on one front elbow. The expert opinion was she had not been bred from health checked parents and probably was not from a responsible breeder. Her life span was going to be short and all we could do was keep her as comfortable as possible in that time. Against all the odds with the help of our wonderful vets we kept her going almost pain free and very happily enjoying life until she just turned 6. At that point she became very ill and was taken in to be operated on and it would appear all the meds she had to be on over the years had literally eaten away half her stomach, it was inoperable and we took the decision to let her go while under anesthetic.

Time had marched on, and over those 6 years we had all become more aware of puppy farms and to my horror when I did more research Coco's outwardly reputable and responsible breeder was now on a long list of scammers, churning out pups regardless of any health checks and illegally without licence. I was devastated I had unwittingly added to their profit and help them fund yet more illegal and unscrupulous breeding of poorly sick pups destined for just a short and painful life.

So don't just assume these breeders are all scruffy little sheds on untidy and filthy premises, believe me they are not - some of them and their very convincing owners put up a first class front that can scam even the more experienced of us. All I can advise is now the internet is more open acccess to licensed premises, searching thoroughly online etc. etc. before you even bother to go and look. OH - and don't trust the parents pedigree either - we suspect neither of the ones we were shown for Coco's dam or sire were even genuine for those particular dogs. Heartbreaking. Word of mouth from someone you trust who has some experience in breeding is probably a good first point of call.

sorry so long - but it is something I feel very, very strongly about as you may have noticed lol!
 

CorvusCorax

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Private boats are being used and hidden compartments in large vehicles on commercial ferries/dogs sedated.

General advice re hip/elbow scores, with the BVA, you can only search EKC registered dogs online on the public KC Health Checker service. If you have an IKC registered dog or a dog from any other registry you want to search, you can't find it. A lot of people use this as a dodge, unfortunately, oh yeah the dog is scored, but the score is high, and you can't find out about it.
If you are shown hip and elbow score paperwork, make sure it tallies to the actual parents (name, microchip or registration number).
If you don't know what you are looking for you could be shown a white sheet and a yellow sheet with good scores but not relating to either of the parents of your dog.
 

QuantockHills

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i've been looking for a dog.... had 7 GSD's and a Great Dane in the past. I've recently lost my 14 year old GSD and have a 12 year old GSD bitch left. I consider myself to be very experienced and knowledgeable, and have served on canine society committees and shown at championship level. However, i cant find a suitable puppy anywhere.... i'm not prepared to pay £3000 for something bred without any health checks, hip / elbow certificates etc, kc reg, from a 'backyard / pet breeder, who's just cashing in on the lockdown puppy period..... looks like i'm going to have to wait a year or two and hope these 'breeders' disappear again....
 

Bellasophia

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I’ve had 3 standard poodles in my life since 2000....beautiful dogs.I’ve been complimented wherever I go...people want “a dog just like that”
I try to explain the breed needs..they often glaze their eyes and walk away..
8DEA9549-3A4A-4D7B-88F0-D31691B1805B.jpeg

Poodles don’t shed.. not true..they do shed into their coat..if they are not brushed,then combed every day,this hair will become knotted or worse matt into a felt.
5641C5BD-B819-4437-8249-99B761774207.jpeg

Poodles are easy keepers...hmm..poodles are happy if they rule your world...try to keep a poodle apart from the family..they actually pine/ suffer terribly.

Poodles have a long memory..if they don’t like something they can become phobic to avoid repeating the bad experience...they need a lot of understanding..with kind handling and positive reinforcement you can undo a bad experience,but it takes time.

Poodles are high maintenance..you will spend as much in one year,on grooming equipment as the cost of buying your pedigree ,well bred ,pup if you groom at home...if not ,the costs are ongoing as the coat grows continuously and will need daily grooming care and monthly clipping/ scissoring at the very least.

poodle temperament will differ according to their lines..
my first was high prey drive,uk dog,was a show pick pup,..had epilepsy at 3 yrs..but managed with constant attention to her thunder phobia etc..
my second ,German dog was all about work ethic..her litter siblings were search and rescue,guide for the unsighted,therapy hospital dog etc.. this pup had an old soul..my heart dog ,never needed a lead,...but had lifelong health issues due to auto immune ilness..cost me 200 e a month for her meds.
third and current..top show lines..intensively health tested, lovely healthy dog..third time lucky.
B3A4BC30-2C76-4CE3-B2F5-4E3760BD4B52.jpeg

so to consider an apoo...cross breed...you really don’t know what you are going to end up with.. no two,pups in a cross bred litter will 100 percent resemble either parent ...often well bred pup from a same breed litter will cost less than a designer mix., and you will at least have an idea of what you are taking on.
 
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BBP

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All this puppy mill stuff breaks my heart. I can't tell you how ashamed I am of all the Irish puppy mills that flood the Uk and European market every single day of the year...how do they even smuggle that many in????

It isn't always the buyers fault though - Even after decades of owning and buying and even breeding pups (they both came to me accidentally in pup not intentionally bred I hastily add!) And I have worked in rescue here.

I was caught myself in recent years. I researched as much as I could at that time a breeder offering chocolate labs for sale - they ticked all the right boxes for being a responsible dog breeder, we went to see the pups and saw both parents and spent time with the woman and the litter. Within a short few months we were concerned about the on/off limpin from our new pup.

After a lot of vet work, including going to UCD Dublin for full xrays and consulting with an expert in the field, at less than a year old she was already showing significant signs of hip displacia on both sides and on one front elbow. The expert opinion was she had not been bred from health checked parents and probably was not from a responsible breeder. Her life span was going to be short and all we could do was keep her as comfortable as possible in that time. Against all the odds with the help of our wonderful vets we kept her going almost pain free and very happily enjoying life until she just turned 6. At that point she became very ill and was taken in to be operated on and it would appear all the meds she had to be on over the years had literally eaten away half her stomach, it was inoperable and we took the decision to let her go while under anesthetic.

Time had marched on, and over those 6 years we had all become more aware of puppy farms and to my horror when I did more research Coco's outwardly reputable and responsible breeder was now on a long list of scammers, churning out pups regardless of any health checks and illegally without licence. I was devastated I had unwittingly added to their profit and help them fund yet more illegal and unscrupulous breeding of poorly sick pups destined for just a short and painful life.

So don't just assume these breeders are all scruffy little sheds on untidy and filthy premises, believe me they are not - some of them and their very convincing owners put up a first class front that can scam even the more experienced of us. All I can advise is now the internet is more open acccess to licensed premises, searching thoroughly online etc. etc. before you even bother to go and look. OH - and don't trust the parents pedigree either - we suspect neither of the ones we were shown for Coco's dam or sire were even genuine for those particular dogs. Heartbreaking. Word of mouth from someone you trust who has some experience in breeding is probably a good first point of call.

sorry so long - but it is something I feel very, very strongly about as you may have noticed lol!
Oh absolutely, I can understand people getting caught still, as the scammers get smarter too. It’s more that this person just didn’t seem to do any research at all. Don’t get me wrong, she loves this puppy and it will get all the care it needs, it just grinds me that the ‘breeder’ has just cranked out a few puppies with by the sound of it no real care for the dog once the cash is handed over.

I have the same issue with people lining the pockets of dodgy horse dealers too. It might be a nice horse but I’m not handing over my cash to someone who kicks their dogs across the yard, drugs up horses and has them flinch every time he goes near them. It’s just supporting people who treat animals badly to restock with a few more. Anyway, I’m off tangent!
 

meleeka

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That doesn’t seem a good choice at all! I got a collie as a first dog, which was equally daft, but I was prepared to put in the work and change my life to suit the dog.
So did I. I loved the bones of him and put in the work to make him fairly normal and he lived to a ripe old age. Never again will I own a collie though 😂
 

misst

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My hairdresser told me last week they were looking for a cavapoo as cavaliers are good with children but her husband did not want hair in the house. I said they might still shed depending on genetics and that I would either get a really well bred cavalier if that is what they want or a well bred poodle where they could also be sure of the "size" they were buying.
Oh No! she said we want a cavapoo as they are so cute and as a cross they will not have health problems... I spoke about the syringomylia (spelling??) problems - no that will be fine if cross bred. I spoke about researching health checks needed for poodles. She said not to worry her husband had researched it all and they had found someone who guaranteed to breed healthy non shedders. She was adamant I was wrong. I gave up at that point and let her witter on until she said if they couldn't get a cavapoo the breeder could offer cockerpoos?! I suggested this was quite a high energy mix and could be less easy with small children but apparently this breeder breeds specially calm ones!!! They "definitely" will not be buying from a byb...
 

Clodagh

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My hairdresser told me last week they were looking for a cavapoo as cavaliers are good with children but her husband did not want hair in the house. I said they might still shed depending on genetics and that I would either get a really well bred cavalier if that is what they want or a well bred poodle where they could also be sure of the "size" they were buying.
Oh No! she said we want a cavapoo as they are so cute and as a cross they will not have health problems... I spoke about the syringomylia (spelling??) problems - no that will be fine if cross bred. I spoke about researching health checks needed for poodles. She said not to worry her husband had researched it all and they had found someone who guaranteed to breed healthy non shedders. She was adamant I was wrong. I gave up at that point and let her witter on until she said if they couldn't get a cavapoo the breeder could offer cockerpoos?! I suggested this was quite a high energy mix and could be less easy with small children but apparently this breeder breeds specially calm ones!!! They "definitely" will not be buying from a byb...
Sometimes you just have to sit back and let it happen. Well done for trying.
 

maisie06

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The first part of your post speaks volumes; she doesn't want a dog that gets dirty of sheds hair. Hmmmm that's what dogs do, it's a fact of life. Just because it's a 'poo' won't miraculously make it super clean :)

It's so very sad but these lockdown pups and dogs must be doing OK because rescues are fairly empty at the moment, as are the stray kennels. At least in this neck of the woods they are but only time will tell how long that will last when things get back to 'normal' next year.

s.
It's because they are so easy to sell on at the moment for £££££'s to other idiots, one lady I know has just aquired a cocker that has been sold on 5 times since lockdown in march......luckily he now has a great home for life and she didn't pay a penny, the poor thing was given away for chewing furniture and nipping a child, no wonder as it has never even been walked let alone had any training, showing promise as a gundog though!
 

Clodagh

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It's because they are so easy to sell on at the moment for £££££'s to other idiots, one lady I know has just aquired a cocker that has been sold on 5 times since lockdown in march......luckily he now has a great home for life and she didn't pay a penny, the poor thing was given away for chewing furniture and nipping a child, no wonder as it has never even been walked let alone had any training, showing promise as a gundog though!
That is all you can hope for for these dogs, that eventually they end up loved and well treated in a suitable home.
 

misst

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Well our village website has just had a post asking if anyone knows if there are any puppies for sale... would prefer a small one as the children are not very old.... so far all sensible ideas/suggestions/instructions have been ignored and the poster seems to be happy with any random puppy as long as she can have one NOW. I am watching it with a facinated horror.
 

Amymay

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Well our village website has just had a post asking if anyone knows if there are any puppies for sale... would prefer a small one as the children are not very old.... so far all sensible ideas/suggestions/instructions have been ignored and the poster seems to be happy with any random puppy as long as she can have one NOW. I am watching it with a facinated horror.
Dear god 😒
 

misst

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Well Amymay it is Christmas!! It's been pointed out that any reputable breeder will not be letting any puppies go this side of Christmas. She is still adamant she wants one. Still no specific breed/type etc. People have been really good with advice but it is being ignored. No doubt she will find one if she looks hard enough sadly.
 

Landcruiser

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That is so sad. Poor pups.
My husbands aunt and uncle, both mid 80s, he with cancer, got a springer spaniel x poodle. They only ever had show labs before, and no dog at all for 10 years. They can’t do a thing with it and it is now biting them.
Oy! I have a springer-poo, my lovely faithful clever boy Neville. He's a super dog, does tricks, and is an excellent lorry dog. I met both his parents, saw springer mum with the litter and met pathetic looking apricot mini poodle dad who lived on the same farm - a racing stable. Nev's 9 now, I think things have changed a lot in those 9 years. But I had to jump in to defend the breed. We also have a fair few springerpoos coming into our vets, they don't stand out as a problem breed.

I was remarking only yesterday about the number of labradors we are seeing with problems, especially behavioral..
 

Clodagh

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Oy! I have a springer-poo, my lovely faithful clever boy Neville. He's a super dog, does tricks, and is an excellent lorry dog. I met both his parents, saw springer mum with the litter and met pathetic looking apricot mini poodle dad who lived on the same farm - a racing stable. Nev's 9 now, I think things have changed a lot in those 9 years. But I had to jump in to defend the breed. We also have a fair few springerpoos coming into our vets, they don't stand out as a problem breed.

I was remarking only yesterday about the number of labradors we are seeing with problems, especially behavioral..
I’m absolutely not blaming the breed other than being of inappropriate high energy ness. 😊
 

ownedbyaconnie

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My hairdresser told me last week they were looking for a cavapoo as cavaliers are good with children but her husband did not want hair in the house. I said they might still shed depending on genetics and that I would either get a really well bred cavalier if that is what they want or a well bred poodle where they could also be sure of the "size" they were buying.
Oh No! she said we want a cavapoo as they are so cute and as a cross they will not have health problems... I spoke about the syringomylia (spelling??) problems - no that will be fine if cross bred. I spoke about researching health checks needed for poodles. She said not to worry her husband had researched it all and they had found someone who guaranteed to breed healthy non shedders. She was adamant I was wrong. I gave up at that point and let her witter on until she said if they couldn't get a cavapoo the breeder could offer cockerpoos?! I suggested this was quite a high energy mix and could be less easy with small children but apparently this breeder breeds specially calm ones!!! They "definitely" will not be buying from a byb...
Please tell me they are not getting it from a well known cavapoo/cockapoo breeder in Cheshire. This particular breeder churned out something like 200+ litters in 2019 😢.
 
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