Accuracy in dressage? Please help :)

Firewell

Firewell

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I'm having a bit of a problemo with my dressage at the moment and it's totally pilot error. Accuracy.

J and I did some more BD on Sat and while it went very well really. The problem is I am letting my scores down massively with accuracy. We've just stepped up to Novice and it is a big leap from Prelim, everything happens so much faster and i'm just way off the markers.

After my first test the judge actually came and spoke to me afterwards :o. She was VERY nice but she basically said that i'm losing about 2 marks on nearly every movement due to not being accurate. She said even if things dont feel like they are going perfect to still be accurate as I will then get much higher marks.

It's a shame as watching the video back the quality of his trot and canter ect is actually not bad at all, he is lovely and rythmical and round and moving forwards. He does get a bit flustered in the trot/canter transitions which is just practice I think and I look like I need to relax a bit more, I go a bit tense and foetal like but really Its the test riding that is letting us down the most.

Is it a case of just preparing really early? Also HOW am I meant to ride a blimin 20m circle? I've been taught to do it like a diamond touching the sides of the school inbetween the markers, e.g between E and H ect but on my test sheet it says my 20m circles were a funny shape :(. Also do you go right up to between H and M when doing a 20m circle at B and E in a short arena or is that too far?

Also when a transition happens at a marker, say trot at E or halt at A, I always thought that you had to be sort of passing the marker when you make the transition but my mum says the shoulder should be level with the marker at the point of the transition...


Gaaah, who would have thought this would be so HARD, getting the movements accurate should be the least of my worries not the bane of my life. Also one of the movements was to canter across the diagonal and change through trot over X. On the video I canter up to X then I ask for trot so it takes him a stride to come back to trot, then by the time Ive changed my diagonal and put my leg back to ask for the new canter lead we were at the corner!! So i'm guessing I should ask for trot a bit before X?

Sorry for all the numpty questions but Ive got the same test to do next Saturday (Novice 30) and i'm in the process of trying to find a new dressage instructor at the moment. Any little tips and advice on accuracy would be very much appreciated!!!

To say thank you here are a few little piccies from the weekend :).

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Coffee and chocolate for getting this far :).
 
Do you have an Instructor? They would be the best to help you. You could ask for a lesson covering all your queries. Where are you? There may be someone on here who lives nearby who may also help.
 
Im on the surrey/hants/west sussex border. I havent found a dressage instructor iv'e clicked with yet. I had a super lady but she moved away and no-one else really helps, they just come and confuse me, collect my money and then go.
I really want a dressage instructor who won't just teach me but who will help me to train my horse also. The good ones around here also charge a good £55 to come to me for 45 mins and it's just too much when I don't feel they are making a real difference.

Also I know this may sound a little silly but they come and I feel they don't really take me seriously?! J is a TB and I don't look that classical and I don't have all the gear and I feel they dont teach 'me' and my horse, the pair in front of them to get the best out of us.

Maybe I was spoilt with my old lady but I just haven't found anyone who's even compared and it's really depressing!

Also I don't have time to find someone before next weekend so thought i'd see if I could get any tips on here which might help :).
 
If you can find a trainer that also judges at BD the difference between a trainer that is trying to train you to ride better and one that can get you those extra marks is amazing. I had lessons from an International level judge/rider and the difference in accuracy in my tests and how I now teach others means never chucking away silly marks. You still need to ride correctly but test riding is a different skill, you have to ride the movement at the marker during a test often in training you are not quite ready so do it later.

The change of rein in canter should be transition to trot just before x no rising trot so no need to think of diagonals, two steps to change bend, this starts during the downward transition, and canter aid.

Other movements I half halt just before the horse reaches the letter and ask for transition as they get there, you need a stride for them to react so it should happen as you, the centre of the horse, are on the marker.

Changing rein always ride slightly to the side of the letter furthest from the corner so that they are turning on a less acute angle then there is more time to ride the corner.

Circles should be round not diamonds, no wonder it looks strange if you are trying to ride straight lines between the points, turn your head to look at the next point but keep thinking round on a constant bend, supported by your outside rein/leg.
 
Be very disciplined with yourself at home, don't swan around with no actual plan because your horse will get used to everything being vague and gradual. Ride square corners for one, I always get yelled at for cutting them.

If on the test it says for instance canter across the diagonal change leg through trot @ X, you should be preparing to trot virtually as soon as you turn onto the diagonal as like you said, things do come up fast! Be very vigilant when riding at home, pick a place to do a transition, prepare and do it on that spot!
 
Have you asked your old instructor who she'd recommend? We found Al's instructor through word of mouth having struggled to find someone who she 'clicked' with, by asking people who Al enjoyed being taught by (they don't teach though, just do occasional one off sessions).

For accuracy, I think it's just being so strict with yourself. You don't need an instructor but a willing friend to stand and let you know how late each trans was and where you missed the corner, etc. I have footage of Al and Reg turning across the long diagonal and being told to turn across and do it again as soon as they're turning about 8 times in a row until they were doing it right and then they did it repeatedly from different corners until it was correct every time. It works though- marks lost for inaccuracies are decreasing rapidly and the test looks a lot less rushed.

Jae looks, as ever, super smart! Have you considered lessons with someone who events and gets a decent dressage on every horse?
 
Ha, thank you be positive thats a fab answer! Do you know what, I never ride to the markers at home ever, so thats something I will start doing tomorrow! Ok, I am going to practice the simple changes better and my circles won't be diamonds anymore ;).

I'd just love to find a decent instructor! I want one to come and get excited by my horse and I. Someone who will understand us. I know we won't ever be world beaters but he's got beautiful paces for a Tb and I think we could be rewarding for someone who actually takes an interest instead of going through the motions, taking the money and thats it as I do really want to learn.

I have a few names of people to try so will see about that :).
 
Preparation is the key!

For every transition, every movement, you need to be thinking about it a marker before. So you are cantering across the diagonal to X, as someone says above, you need to be sitting up, using your core muscles, and preparing to trot before X so that you are actually IN trot as you hit X.

It's better to be a fraction early than be a fraction late, because you are effectively messing up the next movement as well - late to trot means late to the next transition, 2 + 2 marks lost, whereas trotting a stride early, well a kind judge might not even penalise that and it gives you hugely more time to PREPARE for the next movement!

Just hear someone in your head yelling PREPARE all the time - it helps me. Also if he is a tb, does he bowl on a little? If so, have you been taught to half halt (sorry if teaching you to suck eggs), but that might just be what you need more of, to give yourself time to prepare.

I like to just touch the HM line on a circle, I have also been told to ride a square shape to improve my circle, but you do need to round it off - touch the line, curve away again.
 
Thanks BEundertheinfluence and Lolo. I'm going to really practice with the markers this week and see if it makes a difference before Saturday :D.
I Have spoken to my old lady via text since she left but she hasn't really said anything about who I could try.
If I could find a good event rider then that would be even better as they could help our jumping as well but again its just finding someone who is good, doesn't cost the earth and has the time! I am pretty picky as both J and I are quite sensitive and we need someone sympathetic but methodical and calm. We aren't good with bossy or loud, shouty people lol :).
 
Llewelyn - Thank you also for your response. No I don't think i'm preparing nearly soon enough.. He can do half halts but I'm not using them in my test :o, actually I did use one once before the medium trot :). Yes he can bowl on, especially in canter.. he does have long paces and even though he is fine boned and sensitive he is a lot of gangly legs for me to hold together. :). He is also learning as well :).
 
I can't really offer advice but I do remember when R was with her trainer pre some particularly important test he told her to sit down and write out a plan of exactly what she would be doing and where for the whole 5 minutes (or whatever it was). So not just 'change rein at X' but 'at C, gather up reins, sit up and xyz in prep for changing rein at X'. This example is completely hypothetical and will make no sense because I don't understand dressage but I hope you can see what I'm trying to say.

Anyway, she did it (filling up several sheets of A4) and ended up in 7th place at Weston YR 2* if I remember correctly.

Eta: think Llewlelyn has said it above - preparation ;)
 
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Yep I understand Rosiefan, when I learn the test I can learn how i'm going to ride it at the same time... e.g when I'm changing rein at canter, 'sit up round the corner, collect the canter, half halt and then trot, sit and ask for new canter, ask for the correct bend before the corner' ect. Thats helpful, thank you
 
a couple of poss helpful points :)

20m circle in the middle does not reach H/M that would be 28m egg
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as you dont have an instructor to walk one for you can you get a long tape measure anchor it and draw some 20m circles in your school? the more you ride the better you will get.

I don't know if you do or not but I am often better not having a caller as it means I can concentrated more on preparing for the movement ahead.

I have always been told that if the movement is at a certain marker it is when the rider passes that marker (not far off your mum's shoulder).

do you ride through the tests much when doing them, if you can and be really strict with yourself and highlight all the things you need to do, a bit like rosiefans suggestion. If you do a turn on to the diagonal line but are a bit sloppy and the horse falls out you take note of remembering that is your horses worse rein so will need a better corner/more preparing etc.

with the change over x even with my 14.2.. so more strides ;) I would be thinking trot as I came onto the diagonal, ask for trot one or two strides before, trot over x and then ask for canter again straight away. You must be trotting over x
 
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I find that I have to exaggerate looking for my next marker ie B 20m circle, start looking at E as soon as you hit B, then at E start looking at B (for example) I find if I'm looking at the 'next' marker I ride decent circles / corners instead of what I normally do at home which is look down.
 
Its amazing when you are writing how many people are inaccurate. Ester's diagram is excellent, and try and memorise it.

The other thing that might help is to sit in with the judge and watch some tests from that angle. You'll soon notice those who do circles and those who do eggs!

Defo do the movement as your shoulder passes the marker. accuracy costs nothing but will win you lots of extra marks. I learnt to be mega accurate, as my original horse was not a dressage creature in any shape way or form, so being precise was the only way I could grab some extramarks.
 
practise your half-halts at home until they are very smooth and almost imperceptible (to an observer... you and the horse should feel them!) and then in the test do a half-halt before EVERY corner, turn, and transition. this helps hugely.
try to ride the test a little slowly, because the adrenalin you feel in the test will make it feel as if you are going faster than you are (hence feeling that it all comes up very fast.)
at home, practise and count strides, see how long it takes you to get what you want. so, say you need to go from trot to halt at C, at home, try asking just as you come out of the corner, and see if you get the halt early, late, or spot on. keep practising, and get a feel for how early you need to ask.
in tests, REALLY use your corners, if the going permits, it makes a huge difference.
hope those ideas help a bit.

oh, just remembered another good one, i think it was Chloe_GHE who had the idea of putting kids' beanbags down on the points of a circle, exactly measured out so you go between them, and then counting the number of strides between the points, so it stays even and gives you a perfect circle.
 
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A bit of a revelation to me was the need to really ride the whole test, not just the markers if that makes sense.

So, for example you are working trot EHCM and then change the rein BXE, you really need to be constantly leg on and keeping the horse in the contact coming round the C end, and really ride the corners rather than just letting them happen, and concentrating on the rein change, which is what I used to do! (If that makes any sense at all). You can easily throw away marks by being sloppy on the "easy" bits like trotting down the long side or round the end.
 
From your photos your lovely horse is going well, which is more than half the battle. Accuracy just needs practice. As has been said, transitions on a marker should be made when your shoulder is level with the marker. When changing rein across the diagonal look at a point just before the marker you are aiming for, eg FXH aim to reach the track just before H so that as you turn, your horse will be straight when your shoulder passes H. When riding a 20m circle between B & E you should aim to touch B & E for only 1 stride, again your shoulder level with the marker. Use your corners, remember a straight centre line makes a good first impression so when starting to turn look towards C to ensure you are on the centre line - if your horse has a tendency to swing his quarters out put your leg slightly back on that side to keep him straight. Don't get so hung up on accuracy that you become tense - remember to keep breathing, which I know to my cost is easier said than done!!! Good luck at the comp & enjoy.
 
I had a major lightbulb moment recently when my DR trainer told me to think about the DR movements as a series of imaginary "gates" that you had to aim for and ride through- each gate was just like a skinny SJ fence- you had to be accurate, plan your line to it and make the turns between each "gate" smooth, just like when SJ! ;) You can actually use little markers (like kerilli says, beanbags, or those wee plastic blob markers rugby/football coaches like to use!) to mark out your gates to start with, then take them away when you've got the feel for it.

I'm very lucky that my trainer is very keen to teach "test riding" as much as working on the horse's/rider's way of going, it really does help. Also, try make a noticeable difference between a 20m circle at A or C and going round the end of the arena on the track at the ends- really use your corners and ride into/out of them rather than cutting corners. :)
 
And breathe and relax.! There will always be better and worse riders than you.In dressge you compete against yourself. Therefore logicaly you never win:D. the winning is when you reallyfeal it happen. That moment! It never lasts for long enough , But you practice in hope. Forgive me , I love dressage but hate dressage people.
 
Your horse looks very correct in the photos, I am sure that as soon as you have the movements more accurate you will get massive marks!

20m circles at C or A: riding this as a diamond is a different exercise from riding it as a circle. Try practicing both to feel the difference. In the diamond you go straight from A heading for the track (no particular marker as there isn't one at the right spot there), when you get to the track you turn the shoulders round and head for X again straight. This is a super exercise for promoting straightness. In the circle the horse should keep turning all the time, briefly touching the track at the same four points, but the bend in the body stays the same through-out the circle.

To find a 20m circle anywhere in the arena, level your arena so you can 'draw on it', measure out a 10m piece of string, go to one point in your circle, e.g. A, get someone to hold one end of the string there, walk a straight line to the middle of your circle and peg the other end of your string, the person at A now walks and draws in the surface a circle around the pegged end. You can do the same with 10 or 15m circles (varrying the length of the string!). Once you see the circle on the ground it may be easier to ride it.

Transitions: sounds like you could be preparing more in advance, but it depends on the transition. Your mum is right the marker should be about level with the horse's shoulder, but if you need to to a canter/trot/canter transition you need to start preparing quite a bit before the marker and begin the trot a tiny bit before the marker so you have time to get those 3-5 strides in.


Good luck, next weekend and doing the same test is a very good idea!
 
Haven't read all the replies so apologies if I repeat anything.

It does sound like you are being innacurate if you are waiting until you pass the markers to make the transitions and waiting til X to prepare the for trot.

As soon as your horses shoulder is level with the marker BAM that is when the transition needs to happen. If you have to come back down to trot or walk at B say you must be preparing for that way before. So half halting in the canter or trot and if its walk then sitting trot a few strides before and a couple of half halts.

He looks lovely so it'd be a shame for you to chuck marks away through accuracy.

My advice would be to NOT do a novice next time out, drop it down to Prelim, ONLY do the one test and practice, practice, practice it until it is test perfect and everything is happening exactly when and where it should.

You're right, movements come up so quickly once you get to Novice and it can be hard to think forward and prepare for next movement. I think if you can have a couple of goes at forward planning and preparing something like a prelim which will allow you time to do so you will then have developed a bit more of a knack for accuracy and will find Novice easier.

Remember there are no straight lines on a circle. Good luck hun, at least you have a horse who will work nicely so you can just concentrate on the test which always helps!
 
Thank you all so much! Iv'e read each of your replies throughly and i'm very excited to start practising. Yep I know how it all feels when he's properly connected into the contact and I ride him like that most of the time. He finds dressage easy and he enjoys concentrating which really helps :D.
I don't however practice my test riding or riding to markers at all ever really! I was cutting the corners last weekend as well. Thanks as I really feel much more knowledegable about it now, I just need to not let myself get sloppy!! So much to work on :D. I'm doing a prelim next week first, just to give us both a bit of an easier time and then Novice 30 again which I did find quite hard. I find doing Novices a great help as it gets us to up our game, otherwise I would just swan around in pretty trot and canter round the outside of the areaa forever lol.
I don't ever compete against anyone else really, I would probably be depressed if I did! I was happy last weekend as he was really working and trying hard and he felt lovely. I'm not too cross that I let us down on accuracy, it's just something I have to learn :).
Figjam thats amazing about the gates! I had never thought about it like that before! I would NEVER slop around the corner to a skinny, I always walk my line thoroughly, check a point in the background where I have to turn to get straight (like a fencepost or something) then sit up and really keep him chanelled into the fence... Must do more of that in the dressage!!!

Thank you everyone honestly you have all been SO helpful :)
 
You've had a lot of useful help in this thread! And it mainly sounds to be a lack of preparation on your part and a lack of understanding about the measurements of arena/markers in relation to certain movements/circles etc. Both very easy to fix!!!!!

One tip I have is when you learn your dressage test the actual learning of the sequence of movements is only a small part of it. I break it down even further and envisage exactly where I want to half-halt, always say 'ride the corner' if I have to go round a corner etc. etc.

So for example I might learn the following ...
Enter at A
Head up and look proud
After X subtly start to indicate to the horse which direction of turn and just put a fraction of flexion in
G small half halt, right leg on, keep left contact
C turn right
Ride into corner
M ....

In terms of instructors is Alton do-able for you? I can reccomend someone really good there.
Or my current instructor does regular training in Chobham and he is excellent
 
Thanks Ihatework, actually Alton is pretty close, its about 10/15 mins away :). Does that person travel as I have to hire the lorry so I only really use it for shows.

Thank you :)
 
Have you tried walking the test? I draw out the diagrams accurately measuring everything including how far apart the markers are etc, draw everything to scale so I know where it is, and then walk the test on foot. At driving trials everyone walks the test on foot despite doing the same test all year- I obv walk it at home for BD to avoid funny looks ;) But knowing mathematically where I should be at each point and then having walked it on foot really helps me, even when it doesn't always go to plan on the day. When learning it I also draw it out continuously so I learn the shape and flow of the whole test rather than learning the indiv movements- I can't remember the movements as separate things, I just know the shapes and directions of the whole thing!
 
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