Advertising on horse trailers

[Haphazardhacker]

Just a musing really but I work for a shop and at a branch level we are allowed a budget for advertising. The other day I was at an event and thought that it would be worthwhile to advertise the company (more specifically the branch) i work for on my trailer as we have many many horsey customers.

Are there any implications as to insurance for example for popping a simple sticker advertising my shop and what we offer?

 

[Equi]

Not that i know of. Nearly every stud i know has stickers on theirs. You can stick them on cars too with no extra insurance needed.

 

[Haphazardhacker]

I was pretty sure putting adverts on cars would affect insurance. I will approach my employer and offer a bit of my trailer up for advertising (as long as they pay for the sticker and maybe become her carrot sponsor)

 

[cootuk]

Could you fall foul of VOSA if they stopped you and expected an operators licence as part of the business, and deemed you to have sponsorship?

 

[popsdosh]

VOSA are your main enemy here and HMRC , the former will look very carefully at your set up and deem you will need a Tachograph on the towing vehicle good luck with that . HMRC have their own axe to grind over professional use . The mere act of putting advertising on your trailer makes it a commercial operation. Your insurance will be affected as well as you will need business cover.

 

[Dry Rot]

VOSA are your main enemy here and HMRC , the former will look very carefully at your set up and deem you will need a Tachograph on the towing vehicle good luck with that . HMRC have their own axe to grind over professional use . The mere act of putting advertising on your trailer makes it a commercial operation. Your insurance will be affected as well as you will need business cover.

I have "Ifor Williams" on mine....!!!

 

[Haphazardhacker]

Exactly, I have cheval liberte on mine.

 

[Theocat]

I'm sure there is an exception for the maker's name, but I agree anything else opens you up to problems - I'm sure you'd need to check with your insurers at the very least.

 

[Cowpony]

My lorry has an advert for a showing and dressage team on the back. It was there when I bought it and doesn't even relate to the previous owner, but the one before that. Does that mean I need a tachograph and extra insurance? If so, its coming off this weekend!

 

[Haphazardhacker]

Does make you wonder doesn't it. I mean what if I was given a free sticker with a purchase from an equestrian retailer, and put it on my trailer. Would that be advertising?

 

[popsdosh]

Yes if it mentions the name of any business .

 

[bluedanube]

I shall take off the 'pass horses wide and slow' that Also advertises the BHS....

 

[Cowpony]

Yes if it mentions the name of any business .

But if I'm not receiving any payment or other benefit from the fact that the name is on the back of my lorry how does that make me a professional driver?

 

[trailer guy]

Only if you're towing for hire or reward. You're not - it's your horse and your trailer used for personal use only. I don't think you'd have an issue.

 

[Cowpony]

Only if you're towing for hire or reward. You're not - it's your horse and your trailer used for personal use only. I don't think you'd have an issue.

Thanks, I prefer this answer!

 

[ROG]

http://www.vosa.gov.uk/guide-for-horsebox-owners

Horses and/or associated kit and provisions
are deemed to be transported for hire or
reward if that transport is done as part of a
commercial equestrian activity, if there is an
expectation of receiving more than just modest
prize-money, or if any kind of significant
corporate sponsorship is received. In other
words, if transporting horses is done as part of
an equestrian activity which goes beyond what
could reasonably be considered a hobby – ie it
is designed to make a profit, or be at least cost
neutral, then it should be considered to be a
hire or reward operation.

Advertising for a horse related shop on the side of a horsebox or trailer is deffo an advert for a commercial business with an intention to make money above what would be deemed just a hobby so in my opinion it would come under all the rules and regs that go with a commercial operation

Ford etc put their badges etc on car but that is not done by the driver so the driver cannot be deemed to be advertising to make money from it - Ford etc will be deemed as advertising but then that is why they have to be under the commercial laws

 

[trailer guy]

It's the towing of the horses for hire or reward or the towing of the trailer for hire or reward which is the pertinent point, I think. Also, I don't believe carrots would fall under the category of "significant corporate sponsorship".

I still maintain it'd have to be a pedant, working for VOSA, that would nab you for that. If you did get a tug it'd be for brakes / lights / secure load etc.

I'd like to think they have better things to do with their time. It's all down to interpretation, at the end of the day. You have conflicting views - the beauty of choice...!

 

[Haphazardhacker]

I've put it to my company so will see what they have to say.

 

[LouisCat]

I still maintain it'd have to be a pedant, working for VOSA, that would nab you for that.
I'd like to think they have better things to do with their time.

Unfortunately I think pedant sums up most of VOSA!!

 

[fairyclare]

What about sticking a magnetic logo board type thing on the trailer when you AT the show?
Take it off for travelling to and from the venue?

Just a thought.....

 

[trailer guy]

Good idea, providing your trailer sides aren't aluminium.

 

[popsdosh]

It's the towing of the horses for hire or reward or the towing of the trailer for hire or reward which is the pertinent point, I think. Also, I don't believe carrots would fall under the category of "significant corporate sponsorship".

I still maintain it'd have to be a pedant, working for VOSA, that would nab you for that. If you did get a tug it'd be for brakes / lights / secure load etc.

I'd like to think they have better things to do with their time. It's all down to interpretation, at the end of the day. You have conflicting views - the beauty of choice...!

Surely towing a trailer with a commercial advert on it is for hire and reward.

VOSA had a crack down a couple of years ago on riders mainly with lorries carrying advertising and that is why you see few about nowadays with advertising on. Advertising is advertising its deemed a commercial operation within the term hire and reward ,it always has been as they assume probably quite rightly that nobody puts it on there for nothing. Even if its benefits in kind it still comes under hire and reward and HMRC will probably look at it as well.
Several well known riders actually now have sponsors and advertising on the ramp gates so only seen at venues.

 

[trailer guy]

Sounds like I'm not quite up to speed then, best ignore my thoughts on it. Have a grand weekend. All the best, Ben

 

[Farmer Chalk]

Think there's quite a lot of misinformation on here....

If you own a commercial yard and are transporting horses for hire and reward then it will be considered a commercial enterprise. If you are considered a professional rider and attending events is regarded as part of your professional lifestyle then it is also deemed for hire and reward. If you charge a friend to transport a horse to an event then this is also seen as hire and reward.

If you are a total amateur who can demonstrate that attending the event is only a hobby and any prize money is totally insignificant then this is NOT seen as hire and reward.

Therefore if you receive just minimal sponsorship which helps you afford to attend the event this is not hire and reward!
So crack on and put your stickers on without fear!

I know this as I have specifically challenged the Traffic Commissioner's office regarding exactly the above. We are hopefully getting some minimal sponsorship to assist with fuel costs on our 12 tonne lorry. As such we are putting the sponsors logos on the truck. This is not our business we are not charging anyone to transport their horses and we are not carrying any commercial goods.
The response from the TCO was that we do not need an operators licence and we are not considered a business.
This is the fundamental difference that VOSA and the TCO are interested in!

 

[Haphazardhacker]

Thanks for all the responses. I am most certainly not a professional rider and so far my outings have only been to sponsored rides, hunts and boxing up to hack out as well as the occasional trip to the vets. Not looking for any money from my company, just think our product is of interest to people, especially horsey people and the more customers I can bring in the better my shop will do.

 

[popsdosh]

Think there's quite a lot of misinformation on here....

If you own a commercial yard and are transporting horses for hire and reward then it will be considered a commercial enterprise. If you are considered a professional rider and attending events is regarded as part of your professional lifestyle then it is also deemed for hire and reward. If you charge a friend to transport a horse to an event then this is also seen as hire and reward.

If you are a total amateur who can demonstrate that attending the event is only a hobby and any prize money is totally insignificant then this is NOT seen as hire and reward.

Therefore if you receive just minimal sponsorship which helps you afford to attend the event this is not hire and reward!
So crack on and put your stickers on without fear!

I know this as I have specifically challenged the Traffic Commissioner's office regarding exactly the above. We are hopefully getting some minimal sponsorship to assist with fuel costs on our 12 tonne lorry. As such we are putting the sponsors logos on the truck. This is not our business we are not charging anyone to transport their horses and we are not carrying any commercial goods.
The response from the TCO was that we do not need an operators licence and we are not considered a business.
This is the fundamental difference that VOSA and the TCO are interested in!

Hope you are correct as many riders have been stopped on the way to events and been told and treated differently by VOSA and HMRC they have been very adamant any advertising makes it a commercial operation . At the time it had nothing to do with Operator licences but all to do with drivers hours and tachos for under 7.5s

 

[Farmer Chalk]

Hope you are correct as many riders have been stopped on the way to events and been told and treated differently by VOSA and HMRC they have been very adamant any advertising makes it a commercial operation . At the time it had nothing to do with Operator licences but all to do with drivers hours and tachos for under 7.5s

Here is the official Government stance on this... if you read the example on page 8 it sets it out quite clearly...if you're an amateur and this is not your occupation then you are not acting commercially.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...6/A_guide_for_horsebox_and_trailer_owners.pdf

Due to the grey area of sponsorship I challenged the Traffic Commissioner on the ruling. In the circumstances described they stated this was not operating commercially. I have the printed email in the truck ready for any VOSA officer who believes differently.

The reason they were stopping trucks with logos is because at face value they appear to be commercial vehicles.....

 

[popsdosh]

Well good luck ! It was made very clear to us as soon as you put any form of advertising for a commercial operation on the side of your vehicle it then classifies it as commercial maybe you asked the wrong question as thats about advertising(a commercial activity) nothing to do with sponsorship dont think having sponsorship allows you to advertise on your lorry it is two totally different things.

 

[Farmer Chalk]

Well good luck ! It was made very clear to us as soon as you put any form of advertising for a commercial operation on the side of your vehicle it then classifies it as commercial maybe you asked the wrong question as thats about advertising(a commercial activity) nothing to do with sponsorship dont think having sponsorship allows you to advertise on your lorry it is two totally different things.

Made clear to you by whom? I understood the Traffic Commissioner was the most senior authority in the Uk to do with commercial vehicles?.... was this VOSA or HMRC? Or some other authority?

Trust me I was very specific with my question...

 

[popsdosh]

Made clear to you by whom? I understood the Traffic Commissioner was the most senior authority in the Uk to do with commercial vehicles?.... was this VOSA or HMRC? Or some other authority?

Trust me I was very specific with my question...

Our interaction was not to do with a horse box but the principal and rules are the same.
It sounded from your previous post as if you had asked about sponsorship ? We were told by HMRC and Vosa and a legal advisor who deals with them that when somebody uses the space on your vehicle to promote their commercial business your vehicle is then treated as being for commercial use whether they pay for it or not. Im just saying if you had asked specifically about sponsorship their reply may have been different however they look on them as totally different things when you are actively advertising a business rather than just getting sponsorship from them.