ADVICE NEEDED ON PREGNANT STAFF

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IANB

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My head girl has just announced she is pregnant and under health and safety policy she can no longer do various jobs which include mucking out,riding,lunging,turning horses out etc,she is now only allowed to do light duties.My problem is that i have no light duties for her to do ? I have been told that i must then suspend her on full pay until her maternity leave kicks in which is in about 5 moths time !! I dont under any circumstances want to fall out with her but cannot afford to employ a replacement as well as pay her.any legal advice or ideas gratefully recieved .PM if you prefer.
 
Not sure you can do anything else but pay her. You cannot sack her for being pregnant and you cannot make her redundant. I would contact employers helpline and get some advice. Try looking online.

Very difficult situation, unfortunately one a lot of small employers are in.

Hope you get it sorted out.
 
Who's health and safty policy is this? Jus been told by reliable source that that when someones prenant you have to risk assess everything and decide what can and can't and repeat process in each trimester, but theres no hard and fast rules until maternity leave.

Try the HSE website
 
Jesus.....Cant muck out or turn out???
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,what the hell.....that is health and safety gone mad and a head girl that is happy to milk it!sorry i cant be of more help but that is outrageous......have you not got HUGE amounts of tack that need cleaning on a daily basis???bore her out of the job??
surely there has to be some other legal way of getting rid??
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Good luck,hope someone can help,horrid situation to be in!
Has she horses of her own??
 
Bloody hell!!!
Unless she is having a problem pregnancy, I don't see why she should have to do light duties. There have been plenty of posts on here regarding women riding/doing in their pregnancies.
Maybe she's just being a little dramatic about it all. From a H&S point of view, I think (tho I may be wrong, it's along time since I did my exams) you can do risk assessments on her various tasks and pass each one off, or not as the case may be.
How long has she been working for you? If it's less than a year, you don't have to pay maternity pay, so you could just get rid of her.
 
Dig deep mediate and do a deal. Hopefully she has a horse on livery and you stand a stronger position for an easy settlement. Otherwise you can get a bill for loss of earnings...employ a male next time, like a gelding they're a lot less trouble
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I would be checking out HSE rules very carefully, this really sounds OTT to me. She is newly pregnant, not sick or injured.
 
Poopicking
haynet filling
scrubbing out feed bowls/water buckets, refilling (with a hose)
making/mixing feeds
tack cleaning

I hope there's lots of horses!

There must be other light duties she can do.
As a mother of 2, I understand the not shifting bales and sacks of feed around and maybe even riding, but lunging, mucking out and turning out/bringing in? Whose H&S policy is she working to?
 
I cant see any reason why she cant muck out either....I mucked out with all 4 of my kids until after my due dates.....some people take the pee......
 
I started a new grooms job in Oct 2006 and by end of oct begining of Nov I was pregnant (these things happen) I didnt know when I started the job, but told my employer as soon as I found out...they were very understanding at the time.

I carried on handling youngsters, mucking out, turning out bringing in lunging, and riding a 12hh pony all the daily jobs really!!

(I did actually fall off the pony so stopped riding)

I lost the job due to problems with the pregnancy and me dealing with the problem badly
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I can see that your head girl may be worried about getting MP and even having a job at the end of the day. but not doing alot of BASIC chores is daft!!

working in the horse industry is difficult if you ever want a family as you can replaced by a younger,enthusiastic groom who ISNT pregnant!! We grooms dont get job security so i can see from both points of view really. no help sorry
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Hope you sort your problem soon!!
 
Risk assess what she will be doing.
Can't see hpw mucking out will be bad for her if she has been doing it up till now.
My doctor always said carry on with what you have been doing until you feel unable to do it.
If she has been mucking out her body will still be able to cope with it.
Perhaps reduce slightly more risky jobs and direct contact with horses.
Get her to sign all risk assessments that she agrees
 
I've just had a bad pregnancy, with twins (so double the size, sickness etc!) and i have a livery yard, and was also working as an assistant manager in retail at the time.
My Risk assesment for the retail job (international company) never seemed to happen... after a while i was told i couldnt sit on the comfy office chair as it had wheels and i could fall off, i also near the end wasnt allowed to do the banking incase i slipped etc when carrying out a task for my job - however.... i was allowed to move a hell of a lot of stock, had to climb up ladders to get stock down/stuff in the office (was told i shouldnt do it, but then the area manager would call asking me to get her stuff down - knowing i was the only member of staff there to do it! it really didnt make sense! i was then told i couldnt work alone (yet some days they never arranged for someone else to be in)
with the yard, hubby and my parents banned me from certain task, ie feeding a herd of horses hard feeds in a muddy field in case i slipped, but i still mucked out, filled nets, turned in and out etc, but i tended to always have someone around on the yard when i was there. bloody hell, i was washing out a 18hh mares abbcess when my waters broke! 2 hours later, i had two sons!
IMO - i would say that as a risk assessment, there will always be someone on the yard with her when she carries out certain task (stuff she says is a risk) such as when handleing horses etc. Give her loads of bad jobs to do, grooming, dusting in the office, tack cleaning, etc - could you expand your business and offer a tack cleaning service so she has plenty to do? ok, you may not make much doing it but if you are having to pay her.... or could you not reduce her hours? maybe use the excuse that its summer, less work to do? also use the excuse of the current economic conditions for having to reduce her hours??
you could do with somehow finding the stats on what really is the risk, how many people get kicked when turning horses out etc, and then say well its just say a 3% risk hence too low for her to not carry out her jobs?
its a tough one!
 
You should have to do a risk assessment before hand to then see what jobs she is suitable for.

Every pregnant person is different, but I am high risk and still manage to turn out, muck out, poo pick etc. However, I know my limits. I cannot lift bales of hay or straw, I can't build a muck heap, I can't carry very heavy water buckets around, etc.
 
This gets me so, so cross. I had a dreadful pregnancy, and by month 5 I could no longer do my job, which solely entailed sitting at a computer most of the time, but PSD and other things meant I was in agony. I resigned, as I knew such a small company could not afford to pay me and replace me - I did this because I have morals!
 
Weezy I applaud you, we are a tiny company, one girl has been out on maternity leave since November, she has negotiated coming back on 4 days on the same pay, was only going to take a couple of months off, then 9 months - now insisting on taking her full year and not wanting to do the 10 days back to work - I have been doing her work and mine, and do not seem to have managed to work an extra day off - my breasts are not as big as hers
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Right so she can't undertake equine work - redeploy her - admin work, you can have the cleanest house in the world, cleanest tack, cleanest cars - take ironing in for money and get her to do it?
 
Your member of staff is tacking the mick. Ask for a doctors letter to explain why she can not continue working normally. Carry out a Health and Safety risk assesment once you have got the letter. May be worthwhile contacting the Association of British Riding Schools and asking if they have any experience of these issues. Otherwise if it can't be resolved get some expert legal advice from a practice that specialises in employment law.
 
...and then when she has the baby and demands to come back to work on a part time basis....and needs you to provide a creche....it is possible to stretch out your maternity leave to nearly a year (on reduced SMP etc)...its hell when you have this happen. My dad employs a girl in his racing yard who has just had her baby but even The Jockey Club couldn't offer any advice, it seems there's little written in stone about it. This particular girl had nowhere to live a few years back and dad said she could stay in this little flat above the barn at the yard so she moved in and now apparently can stay there indefinitely with the baby as the accommodation comes with the job (he was only doing her a favour!). So now he's got a baby on the yard, the girl's two dogs on the yard, slob sitting round all day, had to employ someone else to cover her but nowhere for any new staff to live (racing yards often get staff from all over the country). Ever get the feeling that being the boss isn't the best place to be?!

Good luck with it, hope you reach a happy conclusion soon.
 
There are light duties - and light duties. For heavens sake, it doesn't sound as though she will be doing anything during this pregnancy. I think YOU need to research what is safe for her to do, and maybe you should start with your insurers and find out what they consider to be an acceptable risk. If she is really ill with her pregnancy then she will have to go off sick for some of the time and claim SSP although she would probably still be entitled to the maternity leave.

Comfort yourself with the knowledge that she is unlikely to want to return to work there after the baby arrives

Agree with whoever said you can find alternative work, anything, to keep her busy and justify her wages.
 
You should contact or join the Federation of Small Businesses - although not equine specific, they will have lots of advice on the ins & outs of maternity leave, and H&S assessments etc.
 
I am 18 weeks pregnant and whilst I dont work with horses, I do still manage to look after my two. I do everything except ride, empty heavy wheelbarrows, fork the muck heap and lfit bales of hay!

I still muck out, turn out, poo pick the field, groom, lunge, make feeds etc etc. There is plenty she can be doing. H&S has gone mad.

Sadly legally if her Dr says she shouldnt be doing the job then I dont think there is anything you can do. Friend of mine was a debt collector. Got pregnant and her company could not let her carry on with her job as it was dangerous. She then had 7 months on full pay and is now on maternity pay
 
Sack her for taking the piss
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Seriously though, I agree with the other suggestns of doing small bits and pieces like offering a tack cleaning/ironing service etc.....Bore her out of a job
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Take good advice and be very careful. Changing her job spec could be construed as constructive dismissal and employment tribunals take a very dim view of anything they consider to be discrimination.

It may be that you can both sit down and agree the tasks she is happy to carry out, do a risk assessment on them and review it on a regular basis. Make sure that all meetings etc are well documented and that she signs to agree to any changes.
 
QR to be honest I am quite appalled by some of the posts on here regarding having children and working with horses.
And they say that males are chauvinists.
Bloody hell some of these posts are so anti women having kids and being a working mum it is unbelievable.
Whilst it may be true that the lady in the original question may be exaggerating her condition and can most probably do more than what she is stating she can do, it all depends on advice from the doctor.
I suggest that proof is gained from a GP that this lady has some medical condition or is highly likely to abort hence the reason she is saying that she cannot do thisthatandtother.
Otherwise I would seek legal advice as others have rightly pointed out about the issue.
No one likes mickey takers in any form that is true but comments like bore her out of a job and others, unless tongue in cheek are so way out of line.
If she can only do light work and that is agreed upon by the appropriate people then let her. I am sure that there are plenty of light work jobs such as admin, tack cleaning and so on. Jobs that I assume a lot of people who work with horses would actually hate to do. I am not suggesting to bore the lady at all but if she can do jobs that others don't necessarily like doing and she is happy to do so, is that such a bad thing?
But if were a complete stranger who came across this thread on this forum I would gleam from it that the general consensus is that if you want children and either own horses or work with them then don't bother. No one should ever have to feel that they would be unwelcome in any profession if choosing to have children and that includes the horse industry.
I really thought what with paternity leave for fathers, Sure Start areas being formed, more help available with childcare and working mums that we had turned a corner. From what it sounds after reading this thread the horse industry has a lot to learn and a hell of a lot of catching up to do!
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I think that most of us on here have had children, and are not aniti pregnancy, however we carried on with our jobs whilst pregnant and are really just conveying that the world should not stop because you are pregnant, unless of course under doctors orders because your pregnancy is at risk. And as I stated if you are an employer of a very small company/team it does put a real strain on finances and other employees who are expected to pick up the work.
 
as a small business owner the thought of having to pay someone to sit on their arse all day pregnant is a nightmare! we could never afford to do that and employ someone else to do their job in the meantime.

fair enough if it a big company that can take the hit, but a small business can be crucified financially this way.

good job I am the only female here and have no intention of getting pregnant.........
 
If I am a male chauvinist then so be it!

WHY WHY WHY should small businesses have to struggle because an employee decides to have a baby? Why should business owners have to face going under or have their own lifestyle severely curtailed because an employee gets pregnant? I had horrible pregnancies, I could hardly walk, I couldn't sit for very long, I spent a lot of money on Chiropractors to try and continue in my job, but when push came to shove I resigned because I could no longer carry out my role. WHY should business owners have to create another job for someone when more than likely there isn't anything else for that person to do?

I know someone who has been off on maternity for 9 months....she is now preg again, but has gone back this month to work until November when she will be off again for 9 months!!!!!!!!!!! Luckily she works for a company that is happy with this, but that would put a lot of businesses under.

As far as I am concerned there are some pregnant women are very good at taking the pee. I struggle to understand why businesses are law-bound to pay someone who cannot work, or goes off to have a baby if the business truely cannot afford it - it is madness.
 
Yes I can understand all that but what about the financial strain on small companies paying out for legit maternity leave and so on? Perhaps if it is too much of a financial risk if an employee dares to get pregnant then either male only staff should be employed, or else women who have been sterilised or had a hysterectomy?
Surely employing any woman of child bearing age should not be sneered at. But by the sounds of it, it is being.
If these small companies are struggling to cope with all the financial ins and outs of women who decide to have children then don't employ them in the first place? No woman should ever have to feel that they cannot have children because their employer could not afford them or that they should have to quit their job to save them from paying out maternity leave. Gosh this makes me so angry! It is these bloody archaic views that I made me decide to concentrate on a career after I had had my child so no employer would look at me and think 'oh give her a couple of years and she will be having children'. It should not have to be like that. But it seems as though in the last twenty years outdated views have still not changed. To hear such views from men is bad enough but to hear them from women makes my blood boil even more.
My argument about the woman in question was that she should only be allowed to do light duties if there is medical evidence from her GP to support that idea or else there were legal guidelines for employers about such a situation in that employment. If not then it is at the employer's discretion as to what duties this lady is asked to do.
If the lady was indeed ps taking then fair enough she should be dealt with accordingly.
 
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