Advice on buying foal/yearling

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soloequestrian

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I'm in a position to look at buying a young quality horse. I have two riding horses in their teens, who have both got loads left to give, but I'd like to have something coming up behind them. I'd like to get a good quality dressage horse, but wouldn't want to spend more than about 2K - I'll never get to the Olympics or anything, but would like to have something with good balance and paces. I've never done this before, and could do with some advice. What is the best way to go about finding a youngster? I've looked on a few websites, and many don't show prices. If I have to ask, do I just assume I won't be able to afford it? I live in the north of Scotland, so obviously it would be easier to look up here, but should I consider country wide? Any other general advice about doing this sort of thing?
Thanks in advance!
 
I got my first youngster from a Stud that bred the type and breed I wanted and the second came from a private breeder.

I would definitely recommend going down the Stud route for a first youngster purchase, as it was very informative and interesting being able to meet not only the dam, but the sire too. The breeder was very open to my questions and didn't mind me enquiring about what her dam had done before becoming a brood mare, how her siblings were doing etc...
 
I would look at morayfirth stud as they have lots of lovely quality foals and youngstock for sale. They will be more than £2k I would think but they always seem reasonably priced for the quality. They're also the right area of the country!
 
I have a yearling for sale who is a superb mover and he is well bred. His half brother was sold to a Junior dressage rider. He is a total bargain and I am on the cusp of deciding to keep him until broken and riding http://www.blacklaw-stud.com/horses for sale.htm

I think even if there is no price you could email and say this is my budget do you have anything in it? I don't always put prices on and I don't mind people asking as long as they are polite :-)
 
MFS have lovely horses, good horses for the money.

I would suspect your budget may be a little tight. I had mine for sale, but I've decided to keep him now. He was up for £2.5k, certainly not much for the type of horse he will become.
 
I've got an 18 month old gelding for sale in your price range.
Bred for a friend out of my PSG mare but the beggar is going to be too tall for her (she is only 5'1" :D ). Someone else had reserved him in the summer and has now decided she can't afford to go ahead due to her pregnancy. He was actually bred more to event but has come out with amazing paces, I would expect him to have the ability to go at least as far as his Mum.
I'm in NE England. If you might be interested PM me for further details.
 
I think if you are going to buy that young, for such a specific purpose and you can't really afford to have a couple of tries at it, you really need to research and know what you're looking for. Do you know what lines you like? Have you worked backwards from older horses you like that fit your remit, to see where they came from originally?
 
Avoid yearlings unless you really can judge it. they are very difficult to assess and most likely will be a chuck out as most breeders if they keep to yearling will take right through to 3-4yo.Clssy looking yearlings invariably turn into ugly ducklings and vice a versa.
Dont forget that although breeding has an influence on the finished article no amount of breeding will overcome inherent weaknesses in conformation or temperament!!!Most studs will be over the moon if you place to much credence on the breeding and miss the obvious. If you are unsure take somebody experienced in assessing horses of that age with you! Never forget buying a horse that age is not a cheap way of getting a horse its better to save your money for three years and buy what you want then.
I say all this as a breeder!
 
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Yes, sorry, I did not mean to imply that breeding should be held over more obvious factors! It is no guarantee AT ALL. But at that age it is extraordinarily difficult to even guess with any accuracy at the finished product, so, if you're going to gamble like that, best to have as much information as possible. I've seen, for instance, people buy a young horse of the 'right stamp' completely ignoring that it comes from a line of horses that jump like wheelbarrows.

I'd agree, if you're not very experienced, find someone who is!
 
Sorry ,I didnt disagree with your approach! Its like roulette and it looks the logical thing to do to some, however you need to go into it with your eyes open!
That why I will only sell foals or 3-4yos.
 
Thanks, all of this is helpful. What counts as a 'foal' in terms of being able to assess anything with any hope of accuracy? Everything for sale at the moment is obviously around 7 months old, is that getting too close to the 'yearling' stage? The ones I'm planning to go and look at all come from quite high-power dressage lines, and I'll be able to see their dams.
 
Have a look at mon competition stallions website, they are also on facebook. I've bought 4 foals from photos from Sue and have been very pleased with all of them. They are reasonably priced too!!
 
They will still be easier to judge than yearlings ,the best age to judge a foal at is 6-8wks however its in the spring of their yearling year they can go a bit awry.
I think your budget is to tight to be shown anything with serious potential as it cost more than that on average before they are born.
 
But where is the line between 'serious potential' and just having a nice horse. I'm not massively competitive, I just want something with good balance and nice paces (perhaps that's not 'just' though!). The ones that are around £2.5k (which seems to be a fairly standard price for one of this year's foals) look very nice, and seem to have robust breeding. This one for instance: http://www.mkmsportshorsestud.com/foal2_13.htm - is it possible to say much from the photos from May, when it was a month old? I'd prefer to look locally, at least in the first instance, so if I find something nice I can go back a few times. I also think it must be massively stressful to travel even a short distance at that age, having just been weaned, so the closer the better for that too.
 
The chestnut foal looks worth viewing. If he's a fair bit cheaper than their foals normally sell for, it's worth asking why. When I was looking, I saw a really stunning youngster that was reduced in price because she had a superficial scar, so the reason can be genuine.
 
Faracat said:
The chestnut foal looks worth viewing. If he's a fair bit cheaper than their foals normally sell for, it's worth asking why. When I was looking, I saw a really stunning youngster that was reduced in price because she had a superficial scar, so the reason can be genuine.
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With out pulling it to bits that foal to me has obvious shortcomings for the purpose the OP wants it for, probably the reason for the lower price.
 
You'll never be able to predict how far a baby horse will go, you're only looking at elements that will predispose it to certain jobs or make it more difficult to perform certain tasks.

I am not a fan of judging horses on the internet, but, for the sake of discussion, two comments on the filly.

First, there is lots to like - she looks sweet and sensible, so much as you can tell from photos. But if she is below their usual price for high end dressage foals I can see why. Her natural balance and shape might lend itself to galloping a bit more than the average so perhaps her faults can be strengths in another area.

Second, while I know there is almost a preference for dressage breeding for eventers and I can see the reasoning, I'm not wholly convinced. Many of then jump with their knees down and don't seem the best at thinking with their feet. That said, I'm quite partial to Rhodiamant as they seem to have good brains. I don't know much about WH II for jobs other than dressage.

I think that was the earlier point about going to see them though, unless you are buying something very specific from someone you trust. At least it starts getting your eye in.
 
Agree the chestnut foal looks more an eventer type to me.

However The dark bay they also have for sale is a lot cheaper than what they usually sell their foals for to, so perhaps the reason is actually the one stated, they are reducing in size, so prepared to sell cheaper than they usually let them go for. The one I was interested in there many years ago was also more a dressage bred jumping eventer type but still the 4k price.

For what it's worth I think buying any youngster is a lottery , and temperament and train ability particularly for competing at the lower levels are far more important than breeding and flashy movement.
Also flashy movement can often lead to unsound ness later in life.

From what I gather The op wants a fun horse, that could do well at normal level affiliated dressage, she does not want a Grand Prix potential hard to train sharp highly talented individual that may require a higher budget.
 
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lannerch said:
From what I gather The op wants a fun horse, that could do well at normal level affiliated dressage, she does not want a Grand Prix potential hard to train sharp highly talented individual that may require a higher budget.
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Yes, that's exactly it!
In the discussion of the example filly, are the weak points suggested minor unless I was aiming to compete at a really high level, or are people suggesting that the horse wouldn't be good for someone like me because of them? If anyone wants to PM me their more critical points, it would be very helpful! I'm not used to looking at anything other than ordinary riding club type horses, so all these well bred foals look beautiful to me!
 
Can anyone recommend any You Tube videos of good foals? Might help to get my eye in a bit. I wonder if anyone has ever systematically studied links between 'performance' as a foal and performance later in life?
 
I'm answering myself now.... a superficial search would suggest that stride patterns don't change much between foal and adult, but jumping at six months is a fairly poor predictor of jumping ability as an adult.
 
The French did a whole study tracking foals to 4 years but I've never been able to find the info from it on line in English and my French isn't good enough to check in French.

Can I just take umbrage with a point above re breeding. People keep mentioning it as if it were somehow separate from the horse in front of you and/or only connected to competitive success (which is probably the thing it is least connected to) or things like conformation movement. You tell how a horse is built or moves by LOOKING at it. I would say breeding CAN tell you - not guarantee - information about the intangibles. (One of which may be how the horse will mature.) To say it is less important than temperament seems odd to me, especially since most people are not great at assessing things like ridability in pre riding age horses. Of course there are no guarantees and no one is advocating buying a horse with an obvious weakness because it looks good on paper.

The OP asked if anyone has ever done a study on how horses turn out. .
.that is pretty much the whole point of studbooks!
 
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Breeding is only a guide, you can have the best bred horse, that is completely untrainable to the average person due to temperament issues.
At least if the youngster has the right kind of temperament which with a bit of experience is not so hard to spot , even if it doesn't make what you bought it for , it will have a useful working life as something else and will also be highly saleable.
Good breeding is a bonus not an essential, temperament is an essential .
 
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