Advice on care for a difficult thoroughbred during winter.

[amybyersx]

Hello,

I'm completely new here and I'm just looking for some advice.
I have a thoroughbred gelding who I have owned for a few years now. He is currently stabled in a foaling box so he had plenty of room to move. He is very highly strung and winter is a very difficult time for me because any routine I have has problems.

I own another pony and they are turned out in one field together. I can put them both out at 6am but I can't get back down to the yard until gone 7pm, which means the horses are still out when it's dark, which isn't a problem for my pony, but my thoroughbred FREAKS out. He doesn't just fence-walk, he fence-runs.. continuously back and forth which wrecks my field, stresses him out, stresses my pony, stresses the other horses around him and many other things. No body will bring him in for me because he can be highly strung, so he stuck out until late if he goes out.

Last winter, we ended up keeping him in Mon-Fri and out Sat&Sun but obviously, I got called all the names under the sun for doing this, keeping him in, even though he was being walked or lunged(i'm probably going to get comments about doing this on here too). Both horses were perfectly happy being in for those days with food but I'm reluctant to do that this winter.

My only other option is to move yards and do grass livery but I have reservations on doing this due to both horses being very sensitive. Both horses are fine to be left to their own devices, they prefer that in the summer but obviously, in winter, they have to come in because it is yard rules. They also lose weight very easily so having them out 24/7 where I can't control what they eat wouldn't be the best thing for them.

I don't know what to do. I feel mean keeping them in but I'm at the end of my tether with the whole fence-running thing.. not only is he getting everyone stressed, but so is he. He sweats up and he will hurt himself and I worry about him all day when I'm not there, knowing he will start freaking out once it gets dark and other horses get brought in. I'm not in a position to pay for part-livery on a different yard and no one at my yard will bring him in as he is naughty.

Please give me some advice. Would you put him out and let him stress or would you keep him in during the week, out at weekends when he can be brought in at a normal time?

Also, he is highly strung no matter what, in work, out of work, kept in, left out.. it's just the way he is so he is not acting out because of a certain routine. Any routine I have, he acts the same.

Thank you

 

[wench]

Presuming you can't afford to to pay anyone to bring him in, if he's more settled in 24/7 then leave him in.

 

[amybyersx]

Presuming you can't afford to to pay anyone to bring him in, if he's more settled in 24/7 then leave him in.

Ideally, i don't want to pay out for someone to come to my yard daily to bring him in as no one at my yard would do it. He can be naughty to lead even for me. I wasn't sure about leaving him in as i get the glares and the nasty comments about being cruel by keeping him in all day. It's a tough call to make really as i want to do what is best for him in the winter but it's hard to decide if it's best letting him stress out in his field at night or leave him in all day and night.

 

[TGM]

Are you allowed to give hay in the field? If he has a full tummy he might be less stressed when left out.

 

[JillA]

Is the stressing due to field mates leaving him behind? Rather than staying out per se, maybe moving him to grass livery would suit him better, if his herd also stays out. Modern rugs can easily replace a warm stable.

 

[paddi22]

my tb stresses on routine, he was the same. If he knew he was coming in at the same time each day he would just melt for about 2 hours before anticipating it was going to happen. He wasn't as bad in the summer as the grass distracted him a bit. I ended up moving to grass livery and he was 100% happier living out. He did some gate hovering for the first few weeks but after that he just relaxed.

 

[_HP_]

Is the stressing due to field mates leaving him behind? Rather than staying out per se, maybe moving him to grass livery would suit him better, if his herd also stays out. Modern rugs can easily replace a warm stable.

Agree with this
My , apparently sensitive tb, did extremely well turned out 24/7/365.

 

[honetpot]

I had a TB that had been stabled most of its life, the first six months we had him he stabled fine and if it was really wet he would be boxed for days with plenty of hay with no problems. After a summer out with his herd mates he would not stable, the first time we tried he went bonkers and kicked a hole in the stable wall, some though he had colic. So for the next four years he wintered out 24/7 double rugged with hay and bucket feed and was very happy. If he was mine I would try leaving him out, its still mild and rug him up, if it doesn't work there is still time for plan B.

 

[Mince Pie]

Is yours an ex racehorse OP? Perhaps he's just conditioned to be in? Also if he's in a foaling box then he's hardly in a tiny stable 24/7!

 

[amybyersx]

Is yours an ex racehorse OP? Perhaps he's just conditioned to be in? Also if he's in a foaling box then he's hardly in a tiny stable 24/7!

Yes, he was born and bred on a racing yard and was tried for racing but wasn't fast enough(not that you would know it the way he bombs around his field!)

I know that! The size of his stable is great considering but people on my yard had major issues last winter saying i was cruel keeping him in during the week ect.

 

[amybyersx]

I had a TB that had been stabled most of its life, the first six months we had him he stabled fine and if it was really wet he would be boxed for days with plenty of hay with no problems. After a summer out with his herd mates he would not stable, the first time we tried he went bonkers and kicked a hole in the stable wall, some though he had colic. So for the next four years he wintered out 24/7 double rugged with hay and bucket feed and was very happy. If he was mine I would try leaving him out, its still mild and rug him up, if it doesn't work there is still time for plan B.

The thing is, on my yard they all have to come in for winter so i would have to move him. If he didn't like grass livery, i would have to find another yard and i would struggle because in my area, all the liverys get full up in winter

 

[amybyersx]

We are allowed to give hay in the field yes but i have tried all that. He either eats it all on the morning or he will ignore it and just trample through it at night, i have tried both hay and Haylage

 

[amybyersx]

Not really. He is only in a field with my mare but the fields surrounding him have horses in. Even if half are in and half are out, he still does it. It's almost like he wants to be first in every night, which is impossible for me with my current schedule. He also gets very spooky in the dark. We have a track to walk up to to get to our barn and when coming out of the field, he will barge, spook, spin and sometimes rear until he gets up to the barn and to his stable. It's like he thinks something is coming behind him to attack him. He is fine on a morning, will walk down fine(probably because it's early and he is half asleep), when he gets to the gate, he will bomb off, have a buck then settle to eat until later that night.

 

[monkeymad]

If you want to stay at your current yard I suspect you are going to have to pay someone to bring them in at lunchtime. Does your yard not have any staff that could do this, or is it purely a DIY yard? If your horses are ok to be brought in earlier (I see from your post the TB can be difficult to lead in when its dark), is any one at the yard late morning who could get yours in (even in they are only out for a couple of hours) and in return you could do some chores for them?

 

[LadySam]

The real issue seems to be he doesn't cope with the dark, yes? So out 24/7 isn't really an option then.

If you can't get someone to bring him in while it's still light, then it looks like you'll have to go back to your past routine of leaving him in during the week and out on the weekend. If he's still worked during the week and kept mentally engaged, he should be fine, especially if that's what he's been used to. Routine is important. That surely will be kinder than him getting stressed out every afternoon for hours when the sun goes down.

That just leaves you coping with the haters on the yard. As a sentient human you should have better luck figuring out how to cope with that than the horse has had with coping with the dark! Nothing nasty meant by that OP. It just looks like one of you is going to have to deal with something unpleasant and uncomfortable and I don't believe it should be the horse.

 

[amybyersx]

The probably is the yard is purely DIY and the owner is not horsey at all so he doesn't have staff or anything like that. The other liverys keep themselves to themselves and don't tend to help people out. In the past with liveries, I was able to pay someone to bring him in but he was difficult to lead and they refused to do it anymore, eventually moving yards so having someone else bring him in isn't really an option. The only way of getting someone to bring them in would be to pay someone off site to come onto my yard to bring them in(which would work out very costly)

 

[amybyersx]

I totally understand what you mean by me being the one that is coping. He would be lunged in the morning, given food in his net and a mixture of a treat ball, lickit, turnip ect so he would always have food, would have had exercise and would have things to keep him busy through out the day. My issue is, when people on my yard tell me i'm cruel for keeping him in, I start to believe it and then I feel guilty, even though I know he stresses when he is out. I know how he reacts at night while waiting to come in and then he becomes dangerous to lead up from the field and he risks getting hurt while out, yet when people say, oh he shouldn't be inside all that time!! I do feel guilty about it. Thank you for your advice. It looks like i'm just going to have to get thicker skin and deal with the bitchy comments.

 

[LadySam]

Stables can be bitchy places. I don't know why they attract it, but they do. You sound like you've got the bases well covered for him being a happy horse inside, so there's no need to second guess yourself when people who are clueless about your horse's situation start judging. His welfare comes first, you've got it covered and you know it. Haters gonna hate. Shake it off.

 

[SEL]

I can't add anything to the advice but sending you lots of positive vibes for having a horse that doesn't lead in the dark. Found out last year that my new horse couldn't actually SEE in the dark. My paddock at the time was a 10 min walk across another field full of horses - not fun with a very big, very stressed horse. Luckily I think the yard are letting me sort something more suitable this year.

 

[whizzer]

My sensitive,very,very poor doer TB does far better living out 24/7 all year round,
positively thrived last 2 winters & did far better than the previous 15 winters that I'd owned him when he'd been stabled at night in winter. He's rugged,fed twice daily,has access to shelter & ab lib haylage plus company he likes.

 

[Theocat]

It sounds like the routine is the problem rather than the darkness, because you say he's fine in the summer when they're out 24/7.

I'd personally try moving to grass livery, and once there I'd try to vary the timings and routine as much as possible so he can't start to anticipate and get stressed.

Routine is great in theory, but some horses just can't seem to cope, and do better if there's no scope for anticipation! Out 24/7 with ad lib forage there are far fewer "events" for them to get worked up about anyway.

 

[debserofe]

I have a retired 28yr old ex racer/eventer who gets very stressed if left out too long and much prefers a stable in bad weather - I am lucky that I have my horses at home and have created a fenced off courtyard area in front of my stables so in winter (or summer, if the weather is really bad!) I can leave them in but with stable doors open so they can wander about. Despite this the TB always walks out of his stable into his stable mates stable and stays there all day - it seems that a different stable is all he needs! As soon as I get his tea, he will walk out of his stable mate's stable and back into his own!

Best advice I can give is to ignore the bitchy comments and just do whats best for your horse!

One thing I would suggest is to have him leading better - it was the best thing I did for my boy as he was ok to lead until he wasn't (stressed) - now anyone can lead his safely, even when he is stressed out, so I know anyone can take him in for me in an emergency! Remember racehorses run on adrenalin, even slow ones have a strong flight response, so it is encouraged! They are also not encouraged to connect with you so I would cut out the lunging - especially if it is just to get the fizz out (just makes them fitter!) and work on getting your horse connecting with you so that they walk with you - take a look at Buck Brannaman 7 clinics, it works!

 

[nikkimariet]

Do what's right for the horse...

Fig will attempt to bring himself in if left out too long. I hate hate hate pandering to them but he did the splits last year stressing and was off work with torn muscles for a month... It's just not worth it.

Amusingly, he doesn't care about being left in (he has a huge foaling box stable too)! Exracer thing. He's a fair weather bunny too so the routine we've got works for him. He looses weight very fast and although we have good grass and land that's managed well, we couldn't have them out all the time, so he's in over night.

 

[amybyersx]

Do what's right for the horse...

Fig will attempt to bring himself in if left out too long. I hate hate hate pandering to them but he did the splits last year stressing and was off work with torn muscles for a month... It's just not worth it.

Amusingly, he doesn't care about being left in (he has a huge foaling box stable too)! Exracer thing. He's a fair weather bunny too so the routine we've got works for him. He looses weight very fast and although we have good grass and land that's managed well, we couldn't have them out all the time, so he's in over night.

Your horse sounds identical to mine. He loses weight quickly if left out and the only time he kept his weight was last winter when he stayed in mon-fri. I hate the bitchy comments i get but my boy obviously prefers to be inside a warm stable with his 'sister' next door. I think i will keep him in during the week and put him out at weekends, when he can be brought in at a decent time without him stressing.

 

[Flyermc]

Could you turnout out for an hr in the morning and again in the evening while your at the yard?

My pony goes out everyday in winter, but sometimes with snow etc its not possible, so he goes out for an hr in the morning and at night while i muck out etc

 

[amybyersx]

Could you turnout out for an hr in the morning and again in the evening while your at the yard?

My pony goes out everyday in winter, but sometimes with snow etc its not possible, so he goes out for an hr in the morning and at night while i muck out etc

I can't do that. If i turned him out in the evening, it would be at 7pm, when it is already dark outside and he is terrified in the dark. It would make the situation much more dangerous for me as he becomes very spooked and almost dangerous in the dark

 

[monkeymad]

Could you get up to yard in the morning a bit earlier and turn them out whilst you muck out and then bring back in? My tb can take or leave going out in the bad weather, but her companion is a pony in his mid 30s and he needs to go out or becomes very stiff. If the weather is overly wet, I may not turn mine out into the field for the odd day, but I will hack out my tb and let the pony be free range around the yard. Is your other horse ok being stood in all week?

 

[Artax]

Wow I know this type. I think the routine is affecting him.

Either you need someone to help you with bringing in or you need 24/7 t/o somewhere. For your own self digity, I would very much look to leave this negative place. There are many positive places surely? For me, its been nice to have helpful generous people that are knowledgeable about all types of horses. It's not cruel to put horses in a stable 24/7 if they are safe there... I have seen for myself a horse that wastes away fence-walking. Some are high maintenance, you have this problem. Consistency is key with this mentality horse.

 

[amybyersx]

Could you get up to yard in the morning a bit earlier and turn them out whilst you muck out and then bring back in? My tb can take or leave going out in the bad weather, but her companion is a pony in his mid 30s and he needs to go out or becomes very stiff. If the weather is overly wet, I may not turn mine out into the field for the odd day, but I will hack out my tb and let the pony be free range around the yard. Is your other horse ok being stood in all week?

My pony doesn't mind at all. She is so chilled so could fall over. I'm moving yards soon where the owner does assist with turnout so as long as he isnt to much for her, hopefully he should be okay.

 

[amybyersx]

Thank you for your answer. Yesterday i actually found a lovely new, small quiet yard which i hope will be better for him! I can't wait to get away from the negativity and know that if he has to stay in this winter, i won't get the name calling ect. I'm hoping this yard will be a better fit for him.