Advice on next pony for 11-12yo

[DeliaRides]

Bit of a novice owner here but horsey background, just first owned pony was for daughter, we've had her 18 momths.

Daughter is 11 almost 12, very slim, about 5ft 2 (has had massive growth spurt recently!) and has had her first pony, a very sassy young section C 13hh, for about 18 months. Sadly by the end of next competition season, she will have well and truly outgrown her. They do a lot of unaffiliated comps....mostly SJ but also CT, some XC, plus lessons, clinics, and just general fun activities with friends, beach rides, forest, farm etc. Pony was admittedly probably 'a bit much' when we first got her - she is very speedy and can get strong - but they have grown together and both learnt so much and have a lovely partnership and daughter handles her brilliantly. They do very well at unaffiliated level, and it's been a real blast for them both. They've done everything, won plenty, been to championships in SJ, and aside from competing, had the best time and become a fabulous partnership. For her next mount, I am struggling with what we do. I think instinct is keep her in pony categories, get something just under 148, connie type, will need to be reasonably sporty as she wants to continue with what she is doing. She may in her later teens think about affiliated SJ but I'd prefer to keep the focus on fun really as we realistically don't have the financial legs to take it very far. So instinct is a big pony, for her teenage years. But I also see plenty around at 14.3 or 15hh that also look like they might fit the bill, but would push her out of ponies. I am cautious about that, because I think there are many downsides, and I suppose ultimately I think juniors should mostly be on ponies competing against other juniors. But equally I have seen plenty of RC friends aged 13 or so move onto horses and do very well this season, so I might be wrong about that. I don't want to over-horse her, certainly that is a worry (and she is strong and gutsy but quite slight in build), and also it does seem like the bigger they get, the more complicated lots of things get, in terms of keeping them fit and well etc.

I would appreciate any thoughts on this, from either side...did you stick with ponies and wish you'd moved up to horses sooner, did you get a bigger horse and regret it, did you decide for one or the other and remain happy with your choice? What are the pros and cons of either choice that I might not have considered?

FWIW the day we brought current pony home I did think....probably will end up wishing we'd have gone for something bigger....but it's been perfect because from day 1 at aged 10 daughter has been able to do everything on the ground, mounted, loading etc. There was no intimidation of a big strong animal to contend with, just a very spirited one!

Thank you in advance for any thoughts.

 

[SmallPony]

My question is, outgrown in what way?

If she is 5'2 and slim, she doesn't sound physically too big for a 13hh well built welsh C? Welshies are tough creatures, and it sounds like this one is really teaching her and they are having loads of fun together (and you say that's the goal for her!). Does she want a new one?

Personally I think that the cultural norm of moving up as soon as possible isn't necessarily well founded - we seem to have an aspiration of bigger is better, and I think a lot of teens and even small adults are physically over-horsed (although I'm definitely biased as a petite adult - I love ponies and small horses as I feel able to ride better on that size and everything feels much more harmonious on 15.2h or less, than on a 16.2 - 17h +).

If she wants to jump great heights or focus on high performance activies, then yes, moving up to horses is the obvious next step, but otherwise I'd be letting her enjoy her current pony as long as she can.

 

[Patterdale]

I would say get as good a 148 as you can afford, accept she’ll have 2-3 good years on it, then get the horse when she’s 15 ish. The 148 should sell well.

Buying a horse too soon is no fun. It’s a totally different ball game. Ponies are easier and more fun, and you want to keep her in pony classes at this age. Low level BS isn’t too expensive and if you do decide to try a bit of affiliated she’ll be at a disadvantage in horse classes.

Just my two pennarth!

 

[DeliaRides]

Good question and really interesting thoughts. Daughter is very leggy and pony is not a chunky C. Weight wise they'd be fine for a long time yet, but fit in terms of depth will become a problem I think. She currently already looks a bit games-style dangly legged in dressage stirrups, but fine still in jumping length. I suppose the other part is that I do think daughter will want to move up somewhat with her jumping. She's currently competing at 70-80 and smashing it and having loads of fun, but I think at some point during her teenage years she will want to move up along with her peers and current pony won't be able to do that. Her comfort level really seems to top out at about 80. So I think both reasons really. If she wasn't competing at all then we'd just keep her on current pony for a while longer.

I take your point though, and it makes me lean even more towards sticking under 14.2 really.

 

[DeliaRides]

PS I completely love ponies too, and if I was slimmer myself I'd just ride a Highland or similar for the rest of my life!

 

[Abacus]

I tried putting my 12 year old son on my 16.2 (safe as houses, total saint). Son is 5’8 and taller than me, and he looked great but couldn’t really cope with the stride length or the fact that the horse was much narrower than his 13.3 chunky new forest. I found that I had to find him an interim horse that was more similar to the pony as a stepping stone. We got a 15.1 which he now finds comfortable (and dammit is already outgrowing after only 4 months). Whatever you end up with height wise I think it’s worth considering the stride length and general feel to make it a smoother transition to a larger horse, whether it’s 14.2 or a bit more. At 5’2 I’d probably look for a 14.2 of similar build to the pony she has.

 

[Patterdale]

Good question and really interesting thoughts. Daughter is very leggy and pony is not a chunky C. Weight wise they'd be fine for a long time yet, but fit in terms of depth will become a problem I think. She currently already looks a bit games-style dangly legged in dressage stirrups, but fine still in jumping length. I suppose the other part is that I do think daughter will want to move up somewhat with her jumping. She's currently competing at 70-80 and smashing it and having loads of fun, but I think at some point during her teenage years she will want to move up along with her peers and current pony won't be able to do that. Her comfort level really seems to top out at about 80. So I think both reasons really. If she wasn't competing at all then we'd just keep her on current pony for a while longer.

I take your point though, and it makes me lean even more towards sticking under 14.2 really.

Definitely don’t keep her on a pony too small, the balance is all out and they end up compensating which causes the subsequent position faults to become ingrained. Ex pony club trainer here ?

There’s really nothing wrong with buying one just the right size though. I’ve seen many children put off by being over horses by something they can ‘grow into.’

I know how it feels though as I’ve just been in the same position myself. My growing 10 year old has outgrown the 12hh and will need a 14.2 before long. However this is not the most confident child, so I’ve taken my own advice and bought a 13.1 in full knowledge it’s going to be an 18 month pony. But hopefully that’ll be 18 months of fun and confidence rather than 18 months of pressure and fear! Luckily I have a few young uns to take over afterwards too though!

ALSO you will find it much easier to find a 148 suitable for a child, than a 15.2 suitable for a child on horses.

 

[rara007]

Remember lots of ‘15hh’ will easily be under 148cm properly measured.

 

[babymare]

Bit of a novice owner here but horsey background, just first owned pony was for daughter, we've had her 18 momths.

Daughter is 11 almost 12, very slim, about 5ft 2 (has had massive growth spurt recently!) and has had her first pony, a very sassy young section C 13hh, for about 18 months. Sadly by the end of next competition season, she will have well and truly outgrown her. They do a lot of unaffiliated comps....mostly SJ but also CT, some XC, plus lessons, clinics, and just general fun activities with friends, beach rides, forest, farm etc. Pony was admittedly probably 'a bit much' when we first got her - she is very speedy and can get strong - but they have grown together and both learnt so much and have a lovely partnership and daughter handles her brilliantly. They do very well at unaffiliated level, and it's been a real blast for them both. They've done everything, won plenty, been to championships in SJ, and aside from competing, had the best time and become a fabulous partnership. For her next mount, I am struggling with what we do. I think instinct is keep her in pony categories, get something just under 148, connie type, will need to be reasonably sporty as she wants to continue with what she is doing. She may in her later teens think about affiliated SJ but I'd prefer to keep the focus on fun really as we realistically don't have the financial legs to take it very far. So instinct is a big pony, for her teenage years. But I also see plenty around at 14.3 or 15hh that also look like they might fit the bill, but would push her out of ponies. I am cautious about that, because I think there are many downsides, and I suppose ultimately I think juniors should mostly be on ponies competing against other juniors. But equally I have seen plenty of RC friends aged 13 or so move onto horses and do very well this season, so I might be wrong about that. I don't want to over-horse her, certainly that is a worry (and she is strong and gutsy but quite slight in build), and also it does seem like the bigger they get, the more complicated lots of things get, in terms of keeping them fit and well etc.

I would appreciate any thoughts on this, from either side...did you stick with ponies and wish you'd moved up to horses sooner, did you get a bigger horse and regret it, did you decide for one or the other and remain happy with your choice? What are the pros and cons of either choice that I might not have considered?

FWIW the day we brought current pony home I did think....probably will end up wishing we'd have gone for something bigger....but it's been perfect because from day 1 at aged 10 daughter has been able to do everything on the ground, mounted, loading etc. There was no intimidation of a big strong animal to contend with, just a very spirited one!

Thank you in advance for any thoughts.

I can’t give you advice because successfully I bought right ponies for daughter (more luck than knowledge) BUT wanted to say you are a lovely parent and,whilst a post asking, it was a pleasure to read. Good luck in your hunt

 

[maya2008]

Makes me realise how small my children are - my 10yo has another year on his 12hh and still fits fine on our part cob 11.2hh!

I think you need to think carefully about build and temperament to go with the jump up in size. 13hh to 14.2hh is a huge jump in terms of the pony’s strength and movement, both to handle and to ride. Your daughter might be truly happy on a whizzy pony at 13hh, where she's strong enough and balanced enough to control the excitable moments - but a similar pony at 14.2hh might be much too much for her and destroy her confidence. You can, definitely, go up to 14.2hh right now (I'm only just 5ft4 and I ride anything 12.2hh to horse sized) but children don't have the musculature and balance that adults do. To control and effectively ride a 14.2hh takes a lot more muscle strength than the same on a 13hh. So if you jump straight up, you'll need a quieter sort than she's on now. Will she be happy with that? Or would you be better off with an 'in-between' size that's nice and competitive while she continues to grow? I stayed on 13.2hh ponies for quite a long time at your daughter's age, and I stopped growing at 14 - so would have been about her height at 12.

We had exactly this dilemma last summer - except that I already had the bigger ponies. So my 10 year old son played around on them all once his old shetland was ready to step down. Our experience was that he physically fit on everything 11.2hh to 14.2hh but in terms of a good fit for a competitive child who wanted to go everywhere on a fast, fun, naughty pony...'just right' was the only way forwards. Our 14.2hh is safe but not fast enough for him. Smaller NF was just downright cheeky and took the Mickey. 13.3hh old SJ pony did her best for him but the movement was too big and it affected his jumping position, as well as his hands - he just couldn't quite keep them steady. He rode the 13.3hh for a while, then I bought him the 'right sized' 12hh Welsh he has now. The difference is like night and day. He can do everything for this pony himself, can deal with his cheeky moments with a smile; wander off hacking in front of me. He backed his Welsh himself and is successfully bringing him on. His position and knowledge are improving day by day, and although I'm well aware we'll get at most 18 months more on this pony, it was 100% the right thing to do.

 

[Orangehorse]

This is a sweeping generalisation - but I think that ponies tend to look after themselves, and look after their riders.

Horses need their riders to look after them, and teach them what to do, particularly the "let's get something youngish." This is where it can go so horribly wrong in putting a teenager onto a horse.

I would not go over 15 hh max, and 14.2 if you want to stay in pony classes against others of the same age.
Although, as above, a 14.2 can take some riding particularly if it is the keen competitor type.


I know that people will have lots of stories where the young person coped perfectly well with a bigger animal, but if you are just looking to have fun then stick with ponies.

 

[Annagain]

How tall is your daughter likely to end up? Is she an early sprouter or is her height now a sign of her being tall in future? At 12 I was tiny - about 4'9". My friends were all about 5'2" - one of them is now 5'9", one is the same height as me - 5'6" and the other two are still 5'2"!

If she's likely to be ok on a 15hh well into adulthood (I had my 14hh Sec D until I was 27. By 21 (when I just about stopped growing - I was that late a developer!) I was a bit tall on him but never too heavy). I think I'd stick it out on the current pony as long as possible and then get a saint of a 15hher.

If she's likely to outgrow a 15hh horse in the next few years as well, I'd go for a 14.2 now and then a bigger one when necessary so it's not such a big jump in one go. Just the one change would be easier for you all and cheaper in the long run but if that's not likely to accommodate her needs, it would be better to get the stepping stone pony sooner rather than later I think.

 

[DeliaRides]

Thank you so much for thoughts, some really useful perspectives here and some things I hadn't really thought of. Happy to hear that others would also buy 'just right' rather than with growing room. Thank you for your perspectives, much to mull over but more confident now that a bigger pony is the right thing rather than going too far too soon wtih a horse.

 

[Wishfilly]

As others have said, there is generally a good market for (just under) 148 ponies- they are big enough to take a small adult too, so sell well. The other thing to bear in mind is that she may not continue growing so quickly, so the 148 could last longer than you think. At 11 I was also just over 5ft, but I only grew a few more inches- to about 5'4''. Girls can stop growing sooner than boys so she may not continue to grow at the same rate.

Anyway, I would definitely get the pony she needs now, rather than the horse she may want in 3-4 years time! She sounds very confident and you don't want to kill that!

As others have said, you may well find some "horses" advertised as 15hh will measure in under 148 without shoes, so I wouldn't dismiss everything over that height.

Jumping wise, I do think ponies look after you, whereas you (the rider) have to help the horse more, and it can be a difficult transition.

 

[Wheresthehoofpick]

12-14 is when my daughters grew massively. To 5'9 one of them. She was on our 12.2 at 12!!! We bought her a 15.1 super cob and she has been an absolute joy. My daughter now 17 still rides her. We are not a competition family so that does change things. We are lifers so the horse has to have a long term job within our family.

 

[WelshD]

I'd say that although they make good money look for a 14.2 pony.

The little girl who rode my ponies went up through a 11.2, 12.2 then a 13hh as I am keen on kids really enjoying ponies before stepping up - the final year with a pony is almost always the best one so why hurry them up through the sizes?

Now she has stopped riding for me (aged 12) she has got a 16hh horse, she does very much love the horse and I'm happy she is able to have one but she will be out of her peer group at pony club, its put her out of local kids showing classes and 'mini' local events and I dont think I'm exaggerating when I'd say its set her back a good 18 months.

I'd never choose a horse for a competitive child until the pony years were well and truly exhausted

 

[Boughtabay]

At that age I was moved from a pony to a full up 15.2 even though we were offered a few 14.2 on loan & it was an awful experience. Really the horse was bought for my mother under the guise of being a step up for me because she’d never have fitted on a 14.2. I loved the horse as any 12yo would but she had a completely different engine to my little spirited Welsh. Rather than spending 2/3 years improving my riding ready for another step up, I spent 4/5 battling to control this enormous animal who was way too much for me. It obviously sounds like you would put 10000x more effort into matching your daughter to a nice horse but really for the sake of 2/3 years, do the middle step and keep her feeling comfortable & progressing. That’s my 2 cents anyway ?

 

[X.ex_racer.X123]

my daughter is 12 5’5 and 50kg and has ridden up to 17.2 5yr old , jumped a big Irish hunter and was fine just looked a bit tiny! It just goes to show that it depends on the horse and rider. She should be good on 14.2 though

 

[X.ex_racer.X123]

my daughter is 12 5’5 and 50kg and has ridden up to 17.2 5yr old , jumped a big Irish hunter and was fine just looked a bit tiny! It just goes to show that it depends on the horse and rider. She should be good on 14.2 though

She’s been riding for 8 years though so quite experienced!

 

[lme]

I don’t think size matters as much as attitude (unless competing in ponies is important) One of my daughters happily took a 17h to Pony club and did rallies with people on 14h ponies. Horse was / is an absolute saint and could switch between family pony mode and competition mode as needed.

 

[fetlock]

I'd go for a 14.2.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

Stick to ponies. I have twin girls who both had a 13.2 One went from 13.2 she was doing 70/80 on to a 14.2 and had the best time of her life over the next 3 years. The other was on a slightly bigger and chunkier 13.2 for longer and was already competing at 1 metre on that pony, so we went straight to a horse and skipped the 148 step. But it was a huge mistake. It was far more of a change then I imagined.

We went from a Section C to a Connemara. The connemara was much, much easier to ride! Good luck!

 

[oldie48]

My daughter was very tall in her early teens. She had a 13.3 connie aged 7 and moved onto a full up 148cm connie x TB when she was 10. She was no light weight either, long legged and was particularly long knee to hip. I mention this because it's not just the size of the pony that matters, being able to fit into a saddle that fits the pony and the rider can also be an issue but there are ways round that. She had a wonderful time on the 148 but had to move onto horses when she was 15, not because she was too tall (5'9") but because she was too heavy for him. We did have to have a jumping saddle made for her so she could keep her knee behind the knee roll but we managed to find a dressage saddle that fitted well. I'm another who would suggest looking for a pony but unless your daughter wants to do pony classes, (mine did) you could go up to a 15hh/15.2 pony type, it's the pony brain that's so great, our ponies have always been a lot brighter than the horses!

 

[PinkRoses]

I would stick with ponies for as long as possible rather than moving onto horses. Then moving on to a sane and sensible been there done it type to show her the ropes. As others have said its a big jump from ponies to horses and I personally really struggled.

at 13/14 I was 5'7'' and deemed to have outgrown the 14 hand pony I'd had on loan. He was a fantastic pony and we were competitive to 1m pony newcomers. We'd just started to get going with BS Juniors as well.

I was 14 when I moved from him to a 16.2 ISH X that was up for share at my yard (we were kind of pressured into it, my parents were non horsey so went along with it), he was the only horse available on the yard at the time and my parents were hesitant to look around and move away to another yard as we would have completely been on our own (it was a RS and livery yard so lots of support and always someone around). IN hindsight this was really stupid and we should have looked around. He was very sharp and strong with a huge cresty neck and when jumping he would just take the bit between his teeth and Pi$$ off. I was completely over horsed and I fell off pretty much every show we went too as he had a dirty stop on him (I had absolutely no idea about riding between leg to hand and supporting and setting up a horse correctly to a fence so he was well within his rights to say no thankyou). I think I shared him for about 18 months before he had to retire but I lost a lot of confidence with him and almost gave up riding entirely.

I eventually ended up with my current mare who I got at 18. She has been my horse of a lifetime and has taken me from 80cm unaffiliated up to 1.25/1.30 international classes in Europe. She was 4 when I got her and I have produced her myself with the help of my trainer. Whilst I do wish I had stayed on ponies longer and moved to a sensible first horse to show me the ropes I would have missed out on her! I have been so so lucky with her, I truly believe it was fate.