Advice please! Pony turning and bolting back to field

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AbbyT90

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As title - I have only had this pony on loan for 5 days and he's had a huge scene change (he's come from a private stables with one other horse where his stable was in his field to a big competition yard with a long walk to field and loads of horses and people).

He's shown signs of no manners so far (walking into you, threatening with a leg and trying to push you back with his head), so far I've been counteracting any bad manners by making him move away from me or taking appropriate action (no yelling or violence).

So far he's been fine to bring in and turn out (going out he jogs but will stop if you make him). Tonight he walked away from me, but I caught him and started for home, suddenly he launched away from me sideways, he turned and bolted back to his friends. I went and caught him, walked back for home, he did the same thing in the same place. And I don't mean he pulled a bit to try it on, I mean my choice was let go or get dragged. He even kicked out as he bolted. The second time trying to catch him he turned around and bolted at me, I had to get out of the way because he was not stopping.

Fourth time (yes he's this persistent) he went right instead of back and ran across the XC course. Eventually got him back (I never ran after him, I just walked), fifth time he bolted forwards towards the yard and the yard owner caught him, by this time he was close to the stable and as soon as his feet hit the concrete road he turned into an absolute dope, I did some lunge work with him, he tried a few bolts there but the bit in his mouth was an excellent deterrent!

So I'm now in a position where I'm worried to turn out tomorrow, if he knows he can use his strength I don't see what's stopping him unfortunately...The yard owner has said I can borrow her dually halter, does anyone think this will help? Would I be advised to turn out and catch in his bridle (if I can get it on in the field) until he learns he can't turn tail and take off? I'm also worried this may happen when I ride, any thoughts?

Sorry for long post, I'm tired, upset and need a bit of reassurance that he shouldn't go right back where he's come from
 
Speak to pony's owners, i would like to know if one of mine was acting out of character!

Def use a bridle or dually every time you are handling, even if the bridle is only a headpiece with cheeks and bit over the headcollar. Also hat and gloves.
Make sure pony respects your space, but its very early days and a huge upheaval for pony.

Hope you manage to get him more settled
 
What have his owners said when you told them about his behaviour? it may be that he is really unsettled moving and in a few more days with you managing to take charge he will settle down, I think the YO should offer to help and show you how to use the dually, it is not much use borrowing it if you don't use it properly and someone more experienced may see what is happening and find a way to deal with it more effectively.

Is he being good to ride despite the lack of manners on the ground? if he is good then it is worth persisting, I would suggest treating the next week as a trial and if he is still being difficult you do consider returning him before someone gets injured, he may be finding a busy yard too stressful and the other option may be to find somewhere quieter or having him on individual turnout for a while until he has settled to the yard and routine, there is usually a way round issues such as this but it needs nipping in the bud quickly, using a bridle may work but he risks being injured if he does get away from you with it on.
 
He is not "bolting" he is "taking off", this needs to be stopped, and you would probably be better to find a good strong instructor or experienced horseman.
The owner should be asked to visit as the last thing they need is a horse which is out of control. Assuming they did not let it get to this stage themselves.
 
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Thanks everyone, I'm anxious to curb this quickly before he learns that bolting gets him where he wants to be so I'll try leading out with a bridle tomorrow - he hasn't bolted off to the field thus far but as I saw tonight extreme behaviours crop up out of nowhere!

Unfortunately his owners have no experience of him taking off - he was always brought in at the same time as his friend and the stable was literally next to the field so he had nowhere to go really and no reason to go anyway. His owner lost interest after going to uni so he's been untouched for a year before she came back and rode him a bit (just in the field he lives in). I'm confident I haven't caused this myself - but I don't know if he's had any loaners before that he's learned this off. It is possible the owners know he does this but haven't told me!

He does have a very good mouth which I'm anxious to keep that way. With any luck that means the bridle will be enough control - I've taken the reins off tonight so if he does get away I don't have those to contend with flapping about.

Unfortunately I don't see this being a one off...
 
You need to be extremely careful if you turn out with a bridle on, as he can tear off, with the bit in his teeth, you could have a headcollar under the bridle, or if there is a "holding pen" at the field, use this.
 
My horse used to do this and I got kicked a couple of times before I saw sense, put him in a chifney attached to a lunge line. Once he knew he couldn't get away with it he packed it in and now walks nicely.
Distraction can also help like keeping his attention with a carrot but to be honest you don't want to get into the habit of rewarding bad behavior and you will end up begging the horse to walk in nicely when you should probably be telling him what is expected.
Good luck it can definitely be sorted.
 
This sounds like separation anxiety to me, completely out of his environment, he just wants to be with other horses. I swear by the dually, mine used to go straight through a bridle and I wasn't brave enough to use a chiffney as he would still tank off with one in and I really would have worried about breaking his jaw he was so extreme in his behaviour. The dually and some groundwoek training using the kelly marks "perfect manners" book worked well for us. He needs to learn that you are his trusted herd leader, I would be looking to establish some ground rules. When you lead him anywhere make him stand still, walk a few paces back, move his body over, get him listening to you. Having been in your situation, the field seems to utterly change the dynamics of how they feel they can behave, so he needs to concentrate on you more. Also make his stable a lovely place to be in. I used to leave a swede on a rope a football with a handful of nuts and always a haynet so when he came in it was to a rewarding treat.

Good luck, it's not a nice feeling being tanked off with, hope you manage to nip it in the bud - the next few days are critical to your future relationship.
 
Did yours used to do it going both in and out, or just one way? I turned up in full riot gear this morning, put a bridle on him, and he went out like a dope on a rope, didn't even jog like he usually does! That doesn't mean I'm any less wary for this evening though.

I did consider using a carrot but, like you, didn't want to be pleading for good behaviour. I want to tell him and have him do.
 
hat, gloves, bridle or be nice halter and a lunge line.

let him try and run, give him a d bit of slack then pull him up bloody sharp.

he needs ground manners reinforcing in the school too, but you need to nip this in the bud and give him a bit of a wake up call.

last year as a 2yo my boy did this a couple of times on the way OUT (was always foot perfect coming in) as he was just SO happy to get to the field and like yours it wasnt jogging or pushing and slowly getting away from you it was 1 second walking and then next a flat out gallop straight ahead no chance of stopping or turning him.

first time in the be nice halter i just walked along as normal, slack rope and when he went he got about 5/6 foot hit the be nice and sat down in shock! his ground manners in the school/yard were perfect he was just being a bit cocky and keen and this quite literally stopped him in his tracks.

hes absolutely fine now and hasnt done it/tried it/even thought about it since but once hes back in the winter paddock which is a slightly longer walk away, he will ALWAYS be turned out in the be nice, so he never gets the opportunity to do it again.
 
My pony did this on and off for the first few weeks we had him. I think it was partly separation anxiety, partly the move to a new home and partly because he thought he could get away with it. We tackled it by wearing hat and gloves when turning him out, and wrapping the leadrope around his nose. I led him with my hand right up at the top of the leadrope and my elbow in front of his chest. That way you get a bit of advance warning if he's going to go! 9 times out of 10 this enabled us to catch him before he got away and he got a very stern reprimand. Once he settled the behaviour stopped and it has only resurfaced on very rare occasions since then. I'm always alert though! x
 
I was going to ditto the lunge line, I would do some work in the school too so that you get a bit of practice influencing him. Dually/bridle/be nice I think is your choice - you do need it to be pressure and release rather than him still pulling on whatever you are using though too.How is he once he is in?
 
I'm another one to second letting the owners know. They may be able to explain the behaviour or offer you tips on how they handled him that didn't result in him buggering off. It would also give the owners the opportunity to take the horse back before things escalate.
 
AbbyT90 said:
Did yours used to do it going both in and out, or just one way? I turned up in full riot gear this morning, put a bridle on him, and he went out like a dope on a rope, didn't even jog like he usually does! That doesn't mean I'm any less wary for this evening though.

I did consider using a carrot but, like you, didn't want to be pleading for good behaviour. I want to tell him and have him do.
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That is fine but he will regard the turnout in the field when he can get back to the other horses as his reward. You want him to be looking to you for the reward, so there is no reason to not reward with carrot. I would set off from the stable, in either bridle or halter, not necessarily on the obvious route to the field, ask him to stop/circle/back, whichever is best in the space you have and THEN reward. You are not 'begging him to behave', you are rewarding him for doing so. Carry on with your walk, insisting that he walks in a mannerly fashion, interspersed with interludes when you ask for specific movements and reward when he performs them. In your own time, arrive at the field gate, walk through, turn him and remove the bridle/halter and reward for standing well, while you do so.

It is a massive change for him but you are obviously thinking about how he feels, so I'm sure you will get there with him.
 
BethH said:
This sounds like separation anxiety to me, completely out of his environment, he just wants to be with other horses. I swear by the dually, mine used to go straight through a bridle and I wasn't brave enough to use a chiffney as he would still tank off with one in and I really would have worried about breaking his jaw he was so extreme in his behaviour. The dually and some groundwoek training using the kelly marks "perfect manners" book worked well for us. He needs to learn that you are his trusted herd leader, I would be looking to establish some ground rules. When you lead him anywhere make him stand still, walk a few paces back, move his body over, get him listening to you. Having been in your situation, the field seems to utterly change the dynamics of how they feel they can behave, so he needs to concentrate on you more. Also make his stable a lovely place to be in. I used to leave a swede on a rope a football with a handful of nuts and always a haynet so when he came in it was to a rewarding treat.

Good luck, it's not a nice feeling being tanked off with, hope you manage to nip it in the bud - the next few days are critical to your future relationship.
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Fully agree with the field being different - if you take him on a lunge line or lead rope into the school he's absolutely fine, likes to be close but you can move him away/back him up/stop him just as you please...but oh boy the second those feet feel grass and he sees other horses...

Prince33Sp4rkle said:
hat, gloves, bridle or be nice halter and a lunge line.

let him try and run, give him a d bit of slack then pull him up bloody sharp.

he needs ground manners reinforcing in the school too, but you need to nip this in the bud and give him a bit of a wake up call.

last year as a 2yo my boy did this a couple of times on the way OUT (was always foot perfect coming in) as he was just SO happy to get to the field and like yours it wasnt jogging or pushing and slowly getting away from you it was 1 second walking and then next a flat out gallop straight ahead no chance of stopping or turning him.

first time in the be nice halter i just walked along as normal, slack rope and when he went he got about 5/6 foot hit the be nice and sat down in shock! his ground manners in the school/yard were perfect he was just being a bit cocky and keen and this quite literally stopped him in his tracks.

hes absolutely fine now and hasnt done it/tried it/even thought about it since but once hes back in the winter paddock which is a slightly longer walk away, he will ALWAYS be turned out in the be nice, so he never gets the opportunity to do it again.
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I thought we were ok because he turned out fine yesterday, then yard owner's daughter brought him in and he was fine with her, I then made the grave error of just using a headcollar today and despite having the rope wrapped over his nose he bolted off to the other horses again! I'm definitely buying a be nice because he yanks at the lead rope when he's tied too - he hasnt snapped string YET but I don't trust him!

ester said:
I was going to ditto the lunge line, I would do some work in the school too so that you get a bit of practice influencing him. Dually/bridle/be nice I think is your choice - you do need it to be pressure and release rather than him still pulling on whatever you are using though too.How is he once he is in?
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Unfortunately in school he's a different pony, I don't feel like my work is having any effect because he never resists in school, does everything you like just as you like (yesterday we also discovered he seems to have a back problem but that's probably a whole other thread!). Once he's in the stable he wants his own way, very pushy, but can be responsive (i.e. doesnt kick or bite when you push him away in stable)



Pearlsasinger said:
That is fine but he will regard the turnout in the field when he can get back to the other horses as his reward. You want him to be looking to you for the reward, so there is no reason to not reward with carrot. I would set off from the stable, in either bridle or halter, not necessarily on the obvious route to the field, ask him to stop/circle/back, whichever is best in the space you have and THEN reward. You are not 'begging him to behave', you are rewarding him for doing so. Carry on with your walk, insisting that he walks in a mannerly fashion, interspersed with interludes when you ask for specific movements and reward when he performs them. In your own time, arrive at the field gate, walk through, turn him and remove the bridle/halter and reward for standing well, while you do so.

It is a massive change for him but you are obviously thinking about how he feels, so I'm sure you will get there with him.
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I'm trying to respect his feelings, and you're entirely right about the treat actually, I don't want to bully him, I want him to respect me as a leader but feel like he wants to stick with me
 
Just a word of warning - when I put the "be nice" on my boy it sent him absolutely nuts, I had the black horse impression & when he felt the pressure on his poll, he tried to kick my head in and was lashing out with his front legs. I've never gone near one since as I also found it didn't release quickly enough. The dually with nose pressure and much quicker release was better and he took much more notice of it, I also like the fact you can switch to and from a normal headcollar in it. With the Be nice I also worried about the impact of riding and wanting a relaxed poll and self carriage so I didn't want him to get scared of the feel of the bridle, he really doesn't like the rope and even now can't stand poll pressure!

I know that sounds a bit mad but when my horse was a youngster he really was quite special to deal with and measures you would use on a normal horse just didn't work with him. Just make sure whatever you do you can be safely out of his way when he uses his body against you.

Also if he has a bad back that would increase his anxiety and his need to feel he is in a herd, could be some of the problem, I'd get that sorted asap if you can.

Oh and if you do get the dually, put it on like a lunge cavesson and never tie up with the lead rope on the nose ring. Best of luck
 
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My horse reacted violently to the "be nice" halter, which actually is far from nice as it puts hard pressure on the poll, one of the most sensitive parts of the body. If he has been used to being brought in with another horse is it possible to do this for a while? The other horse should stay behind him and each day drop a little further back until gets used to the idea of coming in alone. He doesn't know the routine yet and is obviously panicking, thinking he's being taken away again, but if you make sure he has a nice treat waiting in the stable he'll gradually realise that coming away from his new friends isn't the end of his world and he'll also start to realise that he will go back out again. Routine is very important to some horses, and he has obviously been used to one.

Give him time to settle, his world has changed overnight and he's finding it hard to adapt.
 
I did it!! This evening I went out armed with his bridle and a lunge line, he tried 3 times to turn and take off and each time the pressure from the lunge line and the bit pulled him up short. After the third time he looked very surprised and plodded along beside me like a dope. I know that by no means is he sorted but even knowing I can stop him is a huge relief for me.
 
Thats great news.

I've had a couple of horses over the years who needed the headcollar rope wrapped round their nose to lead in potentially tense situations so I do sympathise, but it never got to be an insurmountable problem.

Good luck.

Fiona
 
As he's laminitic and it's coming into autumn I took some advice and swapped him from in during night to out overnight and in over day. After standing in for 24 hours he didn't try once to take off despite being fresh. I did 10 mins of "back up and respect my space" work first. Not sure if that made a difference but when asked to stop on way to field and back up he did on command. I'm not convinced it won't happen again but this is progress
 
BethH said:
This sounds like separation anxiety to me, completely out of his environment, he just wants to be with other horses. I swear by the dually, mine used to go straight through a bridle and I wasn't brave enough to use a chiffney as he would still tank off with one in and I really would have worried about breaking his jaw he was so extreme in his behaviour. The dually and some groundwoek training using the kelly marks "perfect manners" book worked well for us. He needs to learn that you are his trusted herd leader, I would be looking to establish some ground rules. When you lead him anywhere make him stand still, walk a few paces back, move his body over, get him listening to you. Having been in your situation, the field seems to utterly change the dynamics of how they feel they can behave, so he needs to concentrate on you more. Also make his stable a lovely place to be in. I used to leave a swede on a rope a football with a handful of nuts and always a haynet so when he came in it was to a rewarding treat.

Good luck, it's not a nice feeling being tanked off with, hope you manage to nip it in the bud - the next few days are critical to your future relationship.
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Def separation anxiety Lots of ground work control his feet.
 
please ensure you wear a hat, and other protection for now. Never stop using whatever you have found that works. Dually works wonders but don't get complacent because they seem ok, always leave on nose rope ring when leading.

Sounds like compete sep anxiety and should get better but you are right to want to nip it in the bud. Have you tried treats when leading? just to occupy the brain? not a solution but may just break the pattern......
 
Everything I've seen so far would make me agree with separation anxiety. So I guess the question is will this ease as he settles in?

He's had a couple of very good days and I debated stopping use of the bridle, but this evening there was a competition on the yard that I had to walk him past all the horseboxes and associated excitement that goes on. He grew a fair few inches walking through (curiosity mostly), still halted on command though wouldn't back up at a request, had to be shoved!

When we reached grass he made a mild attempt to spring free but he really doesn't like the pressure of the bridle so didn't try very hard. He got more relaxed and steady the closer we got to the field. Part of me feels so sorry for him!
 
I think you are doing brilliantly. If you have him under control then carry on as you are just stay aware that he may try it on if he thinks you aren't paying attention. The more days that go past with you doing the same thing the more he will settle and understand that is how he has to behave. He needs you to be consistent it is still all new to him. My dually is 10yrs old and I still use it every day, mostly clipped on the headcollar ring but the second I don't think my horse is listening he gets clipped on the nose rope so I am always a step ahead of him and we rarely have problems. Best to prevent a problem rather than deal with one, just don't take a couple of good days for granted, you're doing well and he probably feels a lot safer and pleased that you are taking charge. P.s I think he was very brave not to run away from the busy yard competition thing, I hope you gave him lots of praise, it would have been very easy for him to take the opportunity to play up and instead he did his best to keep a lid on it & well done you for staying calm.
 
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