Advice pls guys

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showley1

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Well my luck with horses does not seem to be great, i fianlly found what seemed to be the perfect pony for my 13 year old girls, he is a little on the old side at 18 yrs but the girls felt so confident on him, jumping higher than they ever have (they are confident novices), hacked him out and felt safe took him jumping through the woods and also took him for a gallop which they had not done before, i thought perfect, he can improve their confidence and live his days out with us, even the fact he had sweetitch did not put me off really, then came what has me concerned, he has no passport, originally was told it was misplaced, now when discussing price they have not got 1 and does not seem to want to replace it either? what to do????? grrr he seemed the perfect pony???? help
 
I don't suppose they will be the only ones. However it is illegal to sell a horse without one, so if they want to sell, they will have to get him a passport.
I think an 18 yr old sounds perfect for your girls.
 
It is illegal to sell a horse with one but it's not illegal to buy a horse without one I believe so, you could take the chance if the price is right and you really feel this horse is 'the one'. I guess the only major concern would be is the pony really theirs to sell - have you found out how long they've had him? Can they prove it (pics/videos etc)? It would just concern me in case this was another "sold whilst on loan" situation that's all.
Funny though as pre-passporting you wouldn't have even considered it.
Many people who have had horses a long time have not bothered passporting especially if they never competed said pony. It's not right but some people have chosen not to.
I would quiz them a bit more and try get the truth. If something smells fishy then walk away (and maybe consider reporting them - is if DEFRA who check these things?)
 
As long as you are sure he is theirs to sell then go ahead and buy him and then apply for a passport. If they have had him a long time there is every chance they just didn't bother to get one for him.
 
are you having him vetted?

in view of the passport issue i would get the vet to scan for an id chip just to make sure he is not registered to a different owner

my old mare was only passported when she wenton loan 2yrs ago and we had owned her for 5yrs at that point
 
Had not intended to have him vetted as he is not an expensive pony (£1000),
I guess what is bothering me is the possibilty of something like being sold whilst on loan, i would hate for the girls to fall completly in love with him and then have to hand him back, i truely had thought he was the one, we have been looking for months and had a bad loan experience, and he was honestly the first pony both girls felt was perfect , he does have a freezemark though is there anyway i can check that?
 
Yes, contact the Freezemark company http://www.freezemark.biz/ who should hold details of at least one owner - it may not be the current owner as unfortunately people don't always tell them when they sell their horse but at least you can track at least one owner and get some info.
 
be worth going through the vetting process too... might only be a £1000 pony but if he has a health condition the costs soon mount up and your girls wouldn't get the ride they bargained for either.
 
If he needs a new passport, rather than a replacement, he will need to be microchipped, if you decide to buy him get it all done at the same time, vetting, chipping and application for passport done by the vet. I would take the cost of the chip and passport off of what you pay for him.

If the current owners have had him for some time, which I assume they are saying they have hence not getting a passport done when it became law, you should be able to get some form of reference, PC, vet, farrier, previous owner, livery yard owner, do some checking and if it all seems genuine and the pony is the right one in every way it will be worth the hassle.
 
I think you have 14 days to apply for new passport with your receipt. Why not asked your vet to do a riding horse assessment. The basics, heart, lungs and soundness. If you need a drawing then you will pay anyway. Plus flu and tetanus done if needed.
 
Nicnac said:
Yes, contact the Freezemark company http://www.freezemark.biz/ who should hold details of at least one owner - it may not be the current owner as unfortunately people don't always tell them when they sell their horse but at least you can track at least one owner and get some info.
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I would do this and also I would pay to get him passported if they dont want to pay before handing over the £1k. This way the vet can scan him as already suggested. He sounds ideal horse. Do an agreement subject to successful passporting via vet you will purchase for £1k. You have no real idea of this horses age(and the 18 years if true is no problem for a first horse).

Good luck and I hope the horse is not stolen or on loan and becomes yours.(My vet passported a little pony I bought and I got it chipped at the same time, he did all the checks etc and never asked). But with mine I never knew their real ages. Probably a lot older.
 
Thank you
Each message has helped as i think the girls and JJ would have a fantastic time together and it is true before passports i would just have bought him and never thought, i guess this is just the age of mis trust and have been to see so many 'first' ponies and ' confidence givers' in the last 6 months, which could have really either hurt the girls or put them off horses forever , i am now thinking a vetting is a very good idea and if i use her own vet i can find out what history the vet has and hopefully that way i can find the girls new best friend xx
 
Its a good idea to use the sellers vet, they act for you so will disclose any history and should be happy to do all the passport details at the same time straight into your name if he passes. I would suggest you go to the vetting if you possibly can, it can be very useful if anything does show up that needs talking about, face to face is so much better than on a poor mobile reception.
 
Thanks yes i think this is now my plan of attack, after a few mess offering him at a lower price, they have said they have owned him 2.5 years and this and the mess have sparked another element of doubt, i no job losses etc can cause worry and hardship, but have asked for the vetting, with their own vet, and can sort the passport issue out at the same time, i just hope the 'owners' are as genuine as the pony!!!:)
 
be positive said:
Its a good idea to use the sellers vet, they act for you so will disclose any history and should be happy to do all the passport details at the same time straight into your name if he passes. I would suggest you go to the vetting if you possibly can, it can be very useful if anything does show up that needs talking about, face to face is so much better than on a poor mobile reception.
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the vets cannot by law disclose any history on the horse unless the current owner gives permission, they also cannot tell you if there is or is not any history regarding this horse. most vets will not vet a horse for the buyer if it belongs to a client, this is due to a conflict of interest
 
Thanks i really am out of the loop, can they with the current owner's permission? i.e if they have nothing to hide they won't mind the vet discussing the history? or am i just being niaeve?
 
There is no problem if the owners are being honest, they should be no reason to withhold any history so there is then no conflict for the vet.
 
showley1 said:
Thanks i really am out of the loop, can they with the current owner's permission? i.e if they have nothing to hide they won't mind the vet discussing the history? or am i just being niaeve?
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yes they can with owners permission and if they seem like honest people thats fine,
but a warning to everyone is that i know of many people who use one vet for vaccs and routine stuff and another for stuff they would not want insurance companies or prospective owners to know about and then allow the 'routine' vet to give all info they have to purchasers. this is unlikely to apply in your case but many people are doing it who take on horses to back and sell on at huge profit
 
Apparently they can't remember who their vet is? as much as the pony seems perfect am thinking unfortunatly he could be 1 to stay away from now, real alarm bells have rung obviously something is not right.:(
 
I suppose it could mean the pony is healthy and has not needed any treatment for so long that they have forgotten which vet they used last time:rolleyes: or more likely there is a problem somewhere and they thought you would buy no questions asked, I would walk away, shame as the pony sounds ideal.
 
it is starting to sound strange, their will be plenty of people looking for a home for quiet, old pony. Unless they can provide the basic info you have asked for I would walk away. They may be telling the truth, but, very odd.

It may take more time, but it is worth being confident with your acquisition. i have ummed and aahed about ponies, only to miss out on them, and at the time I was disapointed, and later, in hindsight it has been for the best. There are heaps of ponies out there. It is stressful looking for the "right one", but there is more than one right one out there.

Having three kids and recall our pony search days, i feel for you.
 
be positive said:
Its a good idea to use the sellers vet, they act for you so will disclose any history and should be happy to do all the passport details at the same time straight into your name if he passes. I would suggest you go to the vetting if you possibly can, it can be very useful if anything does show up that needs talking about, face to face is so much better than on a poor mobile reception.
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I would not use the sellers vet, get someone independent. The only time I had an issue was when I used sellers vet. I had him vetted by my own vets on arrival, and they were astounded that he "passed" the vetting, they knew the lady that vetted the horse, and were unable to believe it. (Both equine practices). In short the owners, may (intentionally or not) place pressure on the vet to provide an ok report, when not ok.

Do attend the vetting - again I did not attend the vetting - my son was in hospital, and quite unwell, next time I would attend.

I would contact the sellers vet for release of records if the owner oks it, and I had concerns, but mostly I would not bother with this either, as they could use several vets. You still may only get part of the story.
 
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Ok thanks that is going to be something i will try, as i say something is really not right had not so much thought stolen but maybe he is on loan to them?, they have had him apparently 2.5 years and have seen 'older' pictures but how can you not know who your vet is?. Have had a loan horse 3 months and first thing you do is store vet number in your mobile surely??
 
showley1 said:
Ok thanks that is going to be something i will try, as i say something is really not right had not so much thought stolen but maybe he is on loan to them?, they have had him apparently 2.5 years and have seen 'older' pictures but how can you not know who your vet is?. Have had a loan horse 3 months and first thing you do is store vet number in your mobile surely??
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Not quite as unusual as it sounds. Fellow liveries horse was taken ill at the beginning of the week and she had no vet. I ended up calling mine for her. Some people just don't have a clue :-(
 
Although it is illigal to sell a horse with out a passport it can still be done.

Get vet to scan horse for micro chip.
If none found get vet to do a silloiette and a microchip and sort a new passport.

If one is found contact the authority that issued it and get a duplicate passport.

Ensure you get a reciept from seller to prove you are ponys new owners.

maybe sellers just never got round to getting horse a passport and dont want the expense.
But ask for a reduction in price to reflect what it will cost you to sort passport.
 
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