Advice re ridden showing

[Jgoodlad]

Looking to get opinions. At a local show, in open ridden classes (eg coloured or ridden pony) is it fair/acceptable for lead reins to enter classes and place higher than others if they only do the standard lead rein trot show? When others are doing canters of both reins and extensions? Thank you

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Well a lead rein can't exactly be expected to canter can it? So as long as it performed to its task and is of good type then why should it not beat the others? At local level anything seems to be able to go into any class. But generally you wouldn't see a leas rein in an open ridden class.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

The ponies in ridden showing classes are normally judged on conformation and manners, so yes, if the lead rein pony was well put together for its type and mannerly when viewed against the others, it deserved to be placed. If you want to be judged on your riding, you should enter equitation classes, or turn to dressage instead of showing.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Well a lead rein can't exactly be expected to canter can it? So as long as it performed to its task and is of good type then why should it not beat the others? At local level anything seems to be able to go into any class. But generally you wouldn't see a leas rein in an open ridden class.

But that is mainly for safety reasons.

 

[Jgoodlad]

But that is mainly for safety reasons.

Yes I see what you’re saying re lead reins performing best as they can. I think it just seems unfair on the kids doing it themselves! Thank you

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Thats the problem with local shows basically anything goes and everyone has to accept it, thing is some are really geared up to encourage kids so often get placed high regardless of weather its really fair.

I found the same when I did local shows some have much better rules than others and are organised more like County affiliated shows so you wont tend not to get this kind of thing.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

Unless the show prohibits lean rein entries in open classes, then they are as worthy an entrant as anyone else.

 

[Snowfilly]

Why not? After all, it’s standard to see lead rein combinations in the ring for the ridden championship, where others do a full show and they don’t, so what difference does it make?

 

[Carlosmum]

As a judge of a mixed class you look at the overall picture of each competitor and judge each one to the standard of its type. In an open showing class this could be a coloured who is a truer standard to its type than the ROR, or a M&M who may be a lovely pony but, the first ridden pony is a better example of its type. In the end whilst all ( most) judges do their best to be objective. Judging show classes is probably one of the most subjective jobs in the equine competition world!

 

[SO1]

Yes. I do affilated veteran SSADL in the ridden class everyone is all together including LR and first ridden and big hunters, people riding saddle, all types of show horses and ponies.

These sort of classes are very hard to judge. The judge is looking for the horse or pony that is as near to perfection for the type of class that it would normally do. I expect that at a local show the judge may not be an expert in all the types of equines in this sort of mixed class so they probably judge on manners, turnout and conformation on this basis a LR could win.

In the SSADL classes which are mixed types I have been told by judges very honestly that they do not have expertise in the breed I have which is New Forest but it has not mattered they liked him and he has done very well.

 

[minesadouble]

Unless it's a best rider or equitation

Thats the problem with local shows basically anything goes and everyone has to accept it, thing is some are really geared up to encourage kids so often get placed high regardless of weather its really fair.

I found the same when I did local shows some have much better rules than others and are organised more like County affiliated shows so you wont tend not to get this kind of thing.

If the class was a 'best coloured pony' class (for example) then do you not agree that a lead rein pony would be entitled to win it if it was the best animal in the ring?
Sometimes the issue at local level is more inexperienced people being unable to understand the class they have entered rather than bad judging.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Unless it's a best rider or equitation

If the class was a 'best coloured pony' class (for example) then do you not agree that a lead rein pony would be entitled to win it if it was the best animal in the ring?
Sometimes the issue at local level is more inexperienced people being unable to understand the class they have entered rather than bad judging.

but a ridden class is usually a combination of horse and rider if it was just the pony being judged it's normally an in hand class, but I suppose if the rider is not judged at all then yes.

I just think in a normal ridden class that accepts lead rein it's often impossible to judge because the riders ability is taken into consideration, I do think often they place especially children to encourage them for the future.

This is why I said anything goes at a lot of local shows and they are all different.

 

[Carlosmum]

but a ridden class is usually a combination of horse and rider if it was just the pony being judged it's normally an in hand class, but I suppose if the rider is not judged at all then yes.

I just think in a normal ridden class that accepts lead rein it's often impossible to judge because the riders ability is taken into consideration, I do think often they place especially children to encourage them for the future.

This is why I said anything goes at a lot of local shows and they are all different.

A ridden class is not about the rider, that would be best rider, The ridden class is mostly about performance, manners and confirmation. A beautifully turned out combination, could look lovely on the walk/trot around but canter on the wrong leg unnoticed by the rider. On the other hand a hairy native cob with a rider in mismatched jacket might perform beautifully. Which would you choose? Likewise a lead rein pony who looks after its little rider with handler on the end of a long loose rein can compete on an equal footing with a Hunter who gallops round at the end of their show.


I have judged at many local shows and also competed in both ridden and in hand at County level, they are not really so different.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I didn't say a ridden class is about the rider I totally get what your saying about a ridden class and I understand its a complete picture you get in the ring at that time.

My argument is some local shows will sometimes place very novice beginners and children to give them confidence and motivation to compete again, which I don't have a problem with but that is how it is and is often subjective of what the show stands for and how they operate.

 

[Leandy]

Looking to get opinions. At a local show, in open ridden classes (eg coloured or ridden pony) is it fair/acceptable for lead reins to enter classes and place higher than others if they only do the standard lead rein trot show? When others are doing canters of both reins and extensions? Thank you

Yes, if they do a good job of what is within their capability, in that they have been allowed to enter in the first place and have paid the same entry fee etc as everyone else, so I can't see that they should have a lesser chance of winning than anyone else. As to the advisability of allowing totally open, mixed classes which must be very hard to judge - well obviously that makes the result rather a lottery in any event. If one isn't happy with the "openness" of the class then enter something different.

 

[conniegirl]

but a ridden class is usually a combination of horse and rider

No, the rider is not judged on thier riding at all. The pony is judged on thier way of going, manners, conformation and type.
yes a good rider will influence the horses way of going but there are no marks as such for riders being good.

A leadrein pony is only expected to walk and trot, it will be judged on its way of going in those gaits, a lead rein pony should not have huge movement that could bounce a tot out of the saddle. A leadrein pony will however be much more harshly marked in its manners, what may be considered a minor blip for a riding horse would be a complete no no for a leadrein pony.

in a mixed type class you judge against the type of pony/horse, so is the leadrein a better leadrein pony than the riding horse is a riding horse?

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

No, the rider is not judged on thier riding at all. The pony is judged on thier way of going, manners, conformation and type.
yes a good rider will influence the horses way of going but there are no marks as such for riders being good.

A leadrein pony is only expected to walk and trot, it will be judged on its way of going in those gaits, a lead rein pony should not have huge movement that could bounce a tot out of the saddle. A leadrein pony will however be much more harshly marked in its manners, what may be considered a minor blip for a riding horse would be a complete no no for a leadrein pony.

in a mixed type class you judge against the type of pony/horse, so is the leadrein a better leadrein pony than the riding horse is a riding horse?

Ok I didn't word it properly but that is what I basically meant I know they are not judged on the riding as such but how the horse is going and the overall picture counts.

 

[Carlosmum]

I didn't say a ridden class is about the rider I totally get what your saying about a ridden class and I understand its a complete picture you get in the ring at that time.

My argument is some local shows will sometimes place very novice beginners and children to give them confidence and motivation to compete again, which I don't have a problem with but that is how it is and is often subjective of what the show stands for and how they operate.

That implies the show organisers have some say in how the judge judges the class and I am sure you didn't mean it the way it appears. A judge should judge what appears in the ring in front of them at the time of the class. I avoid looking outside of the showring when waiting for my class to arrive and I feel vey uncomfortable with an over chatty steward who may be trying to give info about Betty's last show with Fred where he won the supreme championship. I politely ask them not to comment.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

That implies the show organisers have some say in how the judge judges the class and I am sure you didn't mean it the way it appears. A judge should judge what appears in the ring in front of them at the time of the class. I avoid looking outside of the showring when waiting for my class to arrive and I feel vey uncomfortable with an over chatty steward who may be trying to give info about Betty's last show with Fred where he won the supreme championship. I politely ask them not to comment.

What sorry really don't get that anyway we should maybe just leave it!