advice wanted with bitting a strong horse

J

jellyshark

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Horse tanking x country and so incurring lots of time penalties (at intermediatte) Currently ridden in a pelham with a grackle, this is giving little/no brakes, he comes up and back so I don't think any kind of gag will help as my understanding is that the gag will bring him up!

would like to be able to gallop and then have brakes for the fences, currently just fighting for contol, not making a nice ride so any suggestions gratefully recieved.
 
Waterford?
Does he listen to your body aids, e'g bringing shoulders up & back, as a decelerating/balancing aid?
What kind of pelham are you using?
Is he coming too high to focus on his fences properly, too busy fighting you? If so, roller noseband could help.
Do you have any vids showing what he's doing?
 
My big mare is ridden in a snaffle 80 per cent of the time but for x country like you a pelham does nothing so we ride her in a Tom Thumb bit and its the only bit i can stop her in x
 
kerilli, when cross country horse thinks he knows best so does not really listen, just looked at videos we seem to catch him when its going well. He is a 16.3 irish ridden by an 8 stone female so has no reaction to her other aids!
He is not coming too high to focus as generally always clear (don't want to jinx things) cross country. Rider feels that is she lets him go it gets unsafe (and stood watching I would agree) so she needs to be confident that when she asks him to slow he will so she can set him up where necessary for the combinations etc. He is ridden in a straight bar pelham - which is working well for showjumping - we have tried a kimblewick, I had wondered about a waterford but only really seen gags or snaffles in them.

Lynnskatz, thanks may have to try a tom thumb but may need to add a curb chain!
 
A combination noseband is very effective with some, along with a Waterford or whatever you choose. A universal can encourage them to come rounder.
 
If K's suggestion of the waterford works, you could try that mouth piece in a pelham maybe. Have been using a universal gag with waterford mouth piece, without leather curb strap I can't stop, with one is a totally different ball game!
 
Hi, I have been having similar problems this year.
I showjump my mare in a rubber pelham. I have tried XC schooling in this and she was totally dead in the mouth so that wasn't happening.
I used to take her XC in a straight bar nathe snaffle, worked up to cartwheel nathe, universal 3 ringed gag, rubber cheltenham gag and finally a copper cheltenham gag. We also had her in a grackle as this was advised by my horse dentist.
After a few hairy XC rounds resulting in run outs and retirements (intermediate) I decided something had to be done.
I have now got her in a metal pelham with a fairly fearsome port in it. At Weston Park this worked amazingly, almost too amazingly, I am going to try a smaller port next time.
I have also found that I seem to have much more steering in a flash noseband rather than the grackle.
The port just means that she can't bear down on the pelham like she does on the rubber one but she obviously likes the action.
With reference to waterfords, I think they are a very personal thing, I can't stand them and have never found a horse that has liked going in one, I tend to use a twisted snaffle with cheeks instead as they can't lean on them however you still have the steering which I feel you lose with all the links in a waterford.
On another horse who is very sensitive, I have also found that a rope noseband has worked wonders. He happily runs intermediate in a twisted snaffle with rope noseband. He was just too strong in plain flash and can't stand anything stronger than a snaffle in his mouth.
 
We had exactly this issue, five feet, eight stone daughter on big strong 16.2, who always went clear xc but would get too fast and bold. A waterford pelham worked a treat - could let him gallop on a bit knowing the brakes were there when needed.
 
I have a very strong horse xc, he naturally has a high head carriage, I use a Cheltenham gag with a losenge in the middle, don't find this makes head any higher and he really respects this bit, I too have tried pellhams which was hopeless for him, did have success with a universal for a while but he just started to run away with me again so went back to the gag.
Maybe worth a try?
 
I would second a ported mouthpiece. We use a double bridle however, rather than a pelham.

We have a large ID who carries his head very high - above the point of effectiveness of the bit - and if he is unhappy with what is in his mouth, he rawls down and pulls me out of the saddle - so he's very good at communicating what he likes and doesn't!

We take him XC in a double bridle - French link bradoon, that sits in the opening of the port and a seriously high port on the weymouth. 90% of the time, he can run on as much as he wants on the top rein. The 10% I need his attention, I can pick up the bottom rein and steady him. (coming into a fence, that's all I can do - steady, not stop!)

He is 18hh btw, so a lot of poundage to slow down lol!
 
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