Aggressive yearling

[ihatework]

I don’t envy you OP.
I’ve done quite a lot around young sport horses. Horses that have all been bought up in a similar (and very young horse friendly) way.
Yet they all have their differences in personality, and they all go through spells of being easier/trickier.
I generally take a minimal handling to get the job done approach and then at breaking time they get made very much human compliant.
That said, whilst growing up they have to be friendly and respectful and I have absolutely no qualms in setting my boundaries quite firmly if needs be. It has to be black and white when training, shades of grey just end up with confused horses.
But any correction has to be done in a non emotional way and timing is crucial. Plus you must be super quick to reward the good behaviours.

 

[Meg_99]

i always spend time with youngsters, and hate the idea of turning away, i want them to be round people from the get go
i want my youngsters to understand a lot of words, and different tones, i think verbal communication may be underestimated, a kind word of praise, a sharp word to mean i mean it, full on what a good horse, and all the commands for l reining lunging, leading, i belive in getting out on the road and seeing as much as possible,

there are too many horses out there who lack education in the most basic way, and trust in humans and perhaps never learn to enjoy human company, in the things that make being with horses a joy, the way the eyes of a horse can shine in anticipation of a ride, the curious look of a youngster learning something new, you dont have to spoil it with handling just give them more credit for having a brain

out for a walk in the fields i take mine over logs through water, to watch all sorts of machinery, train and occupy the brain, and talk all the time to them, because they love it, when you come to backing you are 3 parts there and most of the dodgy bits are installed, and the magic ingredient of confidence makes it so much easier for them

I was thinking in a very similar way to you when getting her out and doing things. I think everyone has different opinions on it though but I think that’s what is best for her and her future job. She likes getting out and seeing things and is always interested in new sights and sounds, she’s a curious little one and I love watching her process it all. She’s took to it like a duck to water. We only go maybe once a week

 

[tristar]

if you have youngster with a bold attitude its great to see how brave they are, and how they thrive on overcoming new challenges and responding to the world with interest rather than fear.

i have one who was the most defiant creature on earth who looked down on you from a great height with utter disgust, now he`s grown up, 13 yrs he often gives me the feeling he would take you through hell and bring you out the side, and to just sit on him is like being on the top of the world, it was a long road, but he is who he is.

 

[Meg_99]

if you have youngster with a bold attitude its great to see how brave they are, and how they thrive on overcoming new challenges and responding to the world with interest rather than fear.

i have one who was the most defiant creature on earth who looked down on you from a great height with utter disgust, now he`s grown up, 13 yrs he often gives me the feeling he would take you through hell and bring you out the side, and to just sit on him is like being on the top of the world, it was a long road, but he is who he is.

He sounds lovely! I had one like that but he was also always up to mischief. They really are all different I have the baby bold as brass and my other one who doesn’t like rustling leaves? All horses I’ve met have such a variety of personalities and behaviour. I’ve seen a lot of different ones over the years that I’ve had horses but this is my first baby and it’s so interesting to see how similar she is to a human child (personality wise. I’m well aware she’s a half ton monster haha)

 

[paddy555]

i always spend time with youngsters, and hate the idea of turning away, i want them to be round people from the get go
i want my youngsters to understand a lot of words, and different tones, i think verbal communication may be underestimated, a kind word of praise, a sharp word to mean i mean it, full on what a good horse, and all the commands for l reining lunging, leading, i belive in getting out on the road and seeing as much as possible,

there are too many horses out there who lack education in the most basic way, and trust in humans and perhaps never learn to enjoy human company, in the things that make being with horses a joy, the way the eyes of a horse can shine in anticipation of a ride, the curious look of a youngster learning something new, you dont have to spoil it with handling just give them more credit for having a brain

out for a walk in the fields i take mine over logs through water, to watch all sorts of machinery, train and occupy the brain, and talk all the time to them, because they love it, when you come to backing you are 3 parts there and most of the dodgy bits are installed, and the magic ingredient of confidence makes it so much easier for them

totally agree with all of this and it is what I do.
I cannot see any benefit of putting a youngster out with a group of other youngsters. My arab was a prime example of this. He came as a yearling colt from a well known stud. He was destined to become a stallion with us. He had spent the time from a weaned foal for a year in a group of similarly aged youngsters. They taught him a lot. That a herd has a herd leader and that is the biggest bully.. If anything gets in my way the hind legs and teeth both work very well in solving that problem and it can easily be extrapolated to pesky humans who don't get out of the way and the biggest bully gets the most grub.
His first few weeks with us were shock horror on his part that these tactics didn't work on humans.
I only have one youngster at a time and they go out with an older horse.

I do all that you do Tristar. In fact what I do is limited only by my imagination. Baby horses love to learn. They can soon extend that couple of minutes to far longer learning times. What you teach doesn't matter. They learn to learn.

I also don't see the point in taking anything up to 3 years with a youngster basically in a field. It learns nothing and you miss out on spending time with the horse.
Everyone has a learning experience with their first youngster but you have to learn.

I am sure you will be fine Meg. The first important thing is to understand the rules well away from the horse. What is acceptable and what isn't. You have already found that treats cause a problem. Food causes a problem, the youngster is programmed to eat, if another horse comes near it's food it has to kick it away or starve. You are the horse it is kicking away. So simply don't get in that position. Put the food down and get out of the way, let it eat. You can teach manners at feeding time later.

You have the brain, the horse only has instinct so run it through in your mind what you are going to do, how you are going to keep yourself safe and how you are going to teach the horse and where. It is no good doing something that is going to get you trapped in the stable. Once you've planned well in advance you are not going to get in a difficult situation.

I use both language and body cues at the same time. Then I interchange them. So horse learns to walk with me at all paces by voice commands and then by body language. All useful.

Most important first job is she gets out of your space and stays out of it. You walk forwards and she politely takes a step backwards away from you.
Don't smack her. She will see it as an attack by another horse, it kicks her, she kicks back. "big" yourself up, you are 10 ft tall, growl at her, get your attitude right, you are the boss. If you have a stick poke it into her chest and push her back. Whatever it takes you to get her to take a step backwards and stand there for a couple of seconds. Reward her with your voice.
Keep repeating, every time you catch her repeat. Don't allow any errors. Move onto get her hindquarters to move away from you, stand at the side and use pressure to get them to move, work up to just standing at her side and telling her over or just pointing.
Then try getting her to back out of your space, stop and then walk one step forward towards you. Only one step and she stops on command.

It will be a bit harder at first for her to learn the new rules ie you say and she does but it will soon get through.

 

[Meg_99]

totally agree with all of this and it is what I do.
I cannot see any benefit of putting a youngster out with a group of other youngsters. My arab was a prime example of this. He came as a yearling colt from a well known stud. He was destined to become a stallion with us. He had spent the time from a weaned foal for a year in a group of similarly aged youngsters. They taught him a lot. That a herd has a herd leader and that is the biggest bully.. If anything gets in my way the hind legs and teeth both work very well in solving that problem and it can easily be extrapolated to pesky humans who don't get out of the way and the biggest bully gets the most grub.
His first few weeks with us were shock horror on his part that these tactics didn't work on humans.
I only have one youngster at a time and they go out with an older horse.

I do all that you do Tristar. In fact what I do is limited only by my imagination. Baby horses love to learn. They can soon extend that couple of minutes to far longer learning times. What you teach doesn't matter. They learn to learn.

I also don't see the point in taking anything up to 3 years with a youngster basically in a field. It learns nothing and you miss out on spending time with the horse.
Everyone has a learning experience with their first youngster but you have to learn.

I am sure you will be fine Meg. The first important thing is to understand the rules well away from the horse. What is acceptable and what isn't. You have already found that treats cause a problem. Food causes a problem, the youngster is programmed to eat, if another horse comes near it's food it has to kick it away or starve. You are the horse it is kicking away. So simply don't get in that position. Put the food down and get out of the way, let it eat. You can teach manners at feeding time later.

You have the brain, the horse only has instinct so run it through in your mind what you are going to do, how you are going to keep yourself safe and how you are going to teach the horse and where. It is no good doing something that is going to get you trapped in the stable. Once you've planned well in advance you are not going to get in a difficult situation.

I use both language and body cues at the same time. Then I interchange them. So horse learns to walk with me at all paces by voice commands and then by body language. All useful.

Most important first job is she gets out of your space and stays out of it. You walk forwards and she politely takes a step backwards away from you.
Don't smack her. She will see it as an attack by another horse, it kicks her, she kicks back. "big" yourself up, you are 10 ft tall, growl at her, get your attitude right, you are the boss. If you have a stick poke it into her chest and push her back. Whatever it takes you to get her to take a step backwards and stand there for a couple of seconds. Reward her with your voice.
Keep repeating, every time you catch her repeat. Don't allow any errors. Move onto get her hindquarters to move away from you, stand at the side and use pressure to get them to move, work up to just standing at her side and telling her over or just pointing.
Then try getting her to back out of your space, stop and then walk one step forward towards you. Only one step and she stops on command.

It will be a bit harder at first for her to learn the new rules ie you say and she does but it will soon get through.

We have learned backing straight up and she has caught on really quickly albeit with pinned ears and a shake of the head in frustration. Hindquarters is still a tricky one as she really protests about it but I make sure she has a headcollar on so she doesn’t get chance to turn it towards me. Thankyou for your advice! I’ll keep at it and eventually we’ll get it. Do you think I should reward her when she does what I ask or simply release pressure?

 

[paddy555]

We have learned backing straight up and she has caught on really quickly albeit with pinned ears and a shake of the head in frustration. Hindquarters is still a tricky one as she really protests about it but I make sure she has a headcollar on so she doesn’t get chance to turn it towards me. Thankyou for your advice! I’ll keep at it and eventually we’ll get it. Do you think I should reward her when she does what I ask or simply release pressure?

how you reward is up to you. A lot simply work on release of pressure, ie the horse gets to stand in a pleasant place. I cannot see any problem doing that and using your voice to say goodgirl at the same time. Whatever you prefer and whatever she likes.
Anything that doesn't involve food. As mine get older I sometimes stroke them on the forehead which they love but that is after the stage of them thinking if I am in their space I am a target to be bashed around with their head.

Another thing you can teach in the next few months is to lower her head on command. ie you put your hand on the poll and tell her down and she lowers her head and stands there calmly and quietly.

If you google Tteam and also Linda Tellington Jones you will find lots entries and there should be some U tube videos.
They will show you exercises you can teach, head lowering, walking over poles (which is very different from teaching a riding horse to walk/trot over poles, de sensitising exercises lots of different ideas all very good for youngsters to produce a calm, sensible horse. All you need for them is a small space and a dozen 12 ft poles.

I did some of her courses many years ago and they are the best thing for learning horse handling.

Bear in mind the KEVIN factor (sorry Ratface if you read this )

Kevin the teenager will appear several times in the next couple of years. You will go from a lovely, kind youngster who wants to learn to a sulky, adolescent who sticks their fingers up at you and says "F off" When this happens I just chuck mine out in the field for a few weeks until they can come back to being civil and learning again.

 

[tristar]

as paddy says, think it through what you are going to do and where, i think that is one of the best pieces of advice you could have, prep, have a plan, know where you are aiming and consider safety at all times


i have an ancient book by linda tellington jones its very interesting specially how she changed her approach to horses as she learned more

 

[tristar]

my stallion ran with a herd till he was nearly two, very little handling, he was super wild for a long time

 

[Meg_99]

Had a bit of a breakthrough today. Put her in and when I came back with her dinner she was stood at the back of the stable quietly and calmly waiting until I said good girl. Just got to work on doing as I ask when there’s no motive and a big open space now. She’s picked it up way quicker than any other horse I’ve had