Allen & Page calm and condition for the competition horse-yay or nay?

We did feed it for a little while, but moved over the Topspec Calm Condition which doesn't need soaking.

My friend events up to Novice and feeds her TB this with good results though :)
 
Hey up..

I used this on mine last year. I fed it to him when he was already in a decent condition and it did maintain him well and he went nicely on it. Just to give you an insight he's 17hh, 5yo, warmblood who events although he didn't really event last year he was quite fit.
However, our yard stopped turnout for about three weeks (seriously!!! I have since moved) and he was full of beans and I decided at the time to cut it back a bit. Anyway, the condition just fell off (I cut it very slightly) and I couldn't get the condition back on him. I went back to my good all faithful - Baileys No1 which saved the day and put the condition back on. So - in my experience (which was with just one horse) it maintains the condition once its there but I don't think it really helps build it. I hope that helps.
 
Wibbles has that... Before I swapped him over he had a tendency to go thin at the drop of a hat, and was a bit mad for 15 mins before going dead on me. Now he maintains his weight (although he is def not fat!) regardless of what he's done the day before, and is much more 'even' (providing he hasn't had a week off... before he couldn't even cope with one day off, now he can do two/three in a row) for the entire time I ride him. He's hunted on that and was absolutely fine :)

It could of course be that he's just chillaxed a bit as he's got older though...
 
I couldn't maintain condition with C&C for my little grey TB (eventing intro level) and gave up using it after trialling it for 2 months. He has no problems with being calm though - now have him on naked oats + spillers instant release mix and he is maintaining condition with just about enough energy on this 'rocket fuel' diet!

I am personally not a big fan of soaked feeds as my horses don't seem to find them palatable.
 
I have tried it on a few. Most recently Lilly had it within 2 weeks I had to stop giving it to her or I was going to get put on my face! She went MENTAL on it. She shook and stressed and fence walked and trying to ride her was just a nightmare. Stopped it and normal Lilly returned!

I had 3 sacks of it and so as my weanling was looking a bit skinny from a big old growth spurt and so I figured she could eat up the bags of C&C that Lilly couldnt have. She had a lot of it and still was thin, I carried on till the bags were used up and then swapped back onto high fibre nuts and within days she was starting to looking better, within a couple of weeks was looking normal again.

I dont really understand how any feed can be both calming and conditioning. Any feed with enough calories to add weight would also by default HAVE to add energy. I think it is a nice feed, but not really for weight gain.

Lill now gets high fibre nuts and chaff. If she looks a bit trim (normally after busy weeks of much galloping!) she gets oil added. The vet said you can give 100ml of veg oil per 100kg of pony. So she (at most) gets 550ml of oil a day. It is pure calories, not whizzy energy and is cheap!! You have to build it up slowly though. She looks awesome on it. The other day I went to a new dressage trainer who failed to believe that she was even a TB!!!

I have also fed Copra, baileys no4 and build up cubes to any skinny ones I have had but on the oil and nuts feed that Lill gets I havent even come close to needing those and she does tons of work and keeps a level head x
 
I haven't tried CC either but like vikijay I feed Jae fibre nuts and oil plus balancer. One of the racehorse charities I went to feed all their charges fibre nuts.
I don't need to feed much at the moment as lots of grass but fibre nuts are good as you can feed lots with no mental issues! My mum feeds her TB about 3 scoops a day split into 3 feeds with a mug of oil also split up. It's like a home-made conditioning feed with oil added! They are high in vits and mins too. We use the D&H ones.
I really like fibre nuts, much cheaper than other feeds and you can add Alfa and beet as well as the oil which is the sort of stuff contained in low starch conditioning feeds anyway but you can add bits and pieces to them to suit your horse. They are so versatile :).
 
I think it's 20% starch which is not that low. I'd feed a good balancer, then there is a great choice of straights you could add - concentrating on forages but adding oil and high protein feeds like linseed, or add Top Spec bagged feeds which are all good, and are not fortified, so supposed to be fed with a balancer. Else look to one bag feeds that are low in starch and high in protein, energy and possibly oil, such as Releve, ERS Pellets, and some of the Winergy Equilibrium products. Also new market entrants like Pure Feeds fit the bill. Too many conditioning and competition feeds are high in starch.
 
Didn't do anything for my mare in hardish work. Power and Performance was better but she's really bloomed since I've had her on bog standard cool cubes, D&H Just Grass and rolled barley. She's not at all sensitive to barley and would be described by most as "sharp" and "athletic" yet she gets on with it terrifically well and is looking fantastic (to quote my vet/friend) without being at all silly. In three years she's never looked as well as she does now and was a toast rack three years back. Interestingly it's also what Andrew Nicholson feeds to his sharp poor doers.
 
I feed most of my yard on c&c (with Alfa Oil). I find it very cost effective as they don't need as much as they say on the bag, (I think if I fed what they recommended they would all be fat and probably insane!) 1 scoop soaked feeds around 5 irish sport horse/good doer types. They all look fantastic, shiny coats etc and all seem to be sane on it even the fizzy sharp ones. My 4* horse has plenty of energy on it and it keeps the weight on her and she is a greyhound!
 
Sent Fleur loopy!

Use baileys no 14 (lo-cal balancer) majority of tine and when in hardest work (PN eventing but I have her that bit fitter as a wb!) she gets half scoop of baileys conditioning cubes. Both barley free and never had a problem since keeping weight on her. Infact currently looks like a small hippo as on semi holidays ;)
 
I used it for Otto for quite a while but I had to feed quite a lot of it to make a difference. I was using nearly a bag a week at one stage over the winter. The soaking isn't a problem but I did notice although it says calm and conditioner my boy seemed hotter on this than what he's on currently.

I think some horses it suits but it tended to make mine more fizzy, I can't remember off hand but think it has quite a high starch content which doesn't suit him unfortunately :)

He's now on Allan and Page Fast Fibre, Mounds of Hi Fi and Baileys No 14 from recommendations on here.
 
My exracer did very well on it, I found it did put on condition when necessary, and gave a very shiny coat! If doing some intense schooling though, power & performance might be more apt, as mentioned above. But I believe CS is unshod, isn't he? You may find power & performance is too high in starch and makes him footy, so I'd be careful if you do try it :)
 
i found that it helps to maintain condidtion - but when i fed it to may gelding to put on condition it didnt really do much :\ He then went on to baileys top line mix/cubes with spedi beet - that really helped n now he's on saracen Show improver cubes - been on for 2 weeks and already looks so much better - coat is instantly more glossy :) really look forward to see him going into the winter looking good :)

He drops his weight so easily :(
 
One of Dad's is on it- OK he's a welsh pony, but he is a poor doer stress head competing at national level driving as a team wheeler, so 5 days away at shows, full days travelling, marathons of up to 20km pulling his own weight. He's done well with it, he is naturally so stressy and on so many calmers I don't know if it's making him sharper or not, but he's certainly kept the weight on.
 
Never did much weight wise for my TB. He was reasonably sane on it, is a very sharp sort anyway & most food is like rocket fuel to him! I've found Top Spec cubes much better for condition. He's always bursting with energy so never have to take that into consideration when choosing feed!
 
my ex racer went bonkers on it- didn't see much of the 'calm'. i wasn't that impressed with the 'condition' side of it either- put him on bailey's lo cal instead and that was much better and didn't send him off his rocker :)
 
My ex racer mare did well on it but my ex racer gelding doesn't seem to have that shiny coat and sparkle it gave the mare. I don't know what we'll try on him next, I've bought some linseed oil to add to it for the timebeing
 
Well, the only thing that is keeping the weight on billy is him on straights (barley,oats and maize) and out 24/7.
I think I tried every conditioning feed I could get hold of and wasn't extortionate in price!
I'm not sure how he will do this winter, as this will be his first winter on straights. He is holding weight atm although slighly concerned that I could see his ribs last week 1 month into his hols - may have to up the maize.
That's the beauty of straights though - can up decrease or maintain the feed according to the horse :)
 
This feed is the devil!!!! When I bought my mare (16.1h WBxTB), I was told that she was on this, so I bought a bag, and kept her on it.

When I got her home, she went absolutely mental, rodeo'ing in her stable and booting the back wall. Causing a load of trouble in the field and basically being what I thought, very mareish. I thought she was hormonal, bought a load of mare supplements which didn't change a thing. I then thought she might have gastric ulcers!

I asked my YO, who competes AM on her highly strung warmblood, and she asked what I fed her. I told her about the C&C, and she told me to get her off it ASAP as it sent her gelding round the loop.

Second day she was off it, she was an angel and has been ever since.

I would not recommend this feed to my worst enemy! I now keep the weight on her with 4/5 bales of hay a week, along with her being out 8am-6pm everyday. She is fed two heaped scoops of hi-fi and a cupful of high fibre cubes and has never looked better. She is worked for 1hr15mins schooling 3x per week (she froths she works so hard!), 2x 2hr hacks, and one 30-40mins on the lunge with a day off. She looks fantastic.
 
It's the only feed I've ever fed my hunter that did send her loopy! I have no idea why but have tried it twice and both times my nice, sane hunter has turned into a complete idiot :rolleyes: I would use Baileys no 4 if I needed too :)
 
I haven't used this for years, stopped because I didn't rate it at all for calm or condition!

It may not contain barley or oats, but I seem to remember it contains other cereals and molasses on the ingredients list???

Have you given up on the Simple Systems or Pure feeds idea?
 
thanks guys!

wont bother after reading this, he doesnt hot up but he does need to keep his condition!

simple systems-def a no go, read a few things and actually saw some horses on this system last weekend and lets just say i would be embarrassed to have mine looking like that!its totally put me off even trying-if CS loses condition in the dead of winter ill NEVER get it back on him without stopping working him, and i cant risk that.

pure feeds will work out even more expensive for me and im not madly keen to up the feed budget even further.
 
The thing about barley is that a few horses are intolerant to it, but far more are intolerant to high levels of starch! Maize is the most starchy of all cereals and is in loads of supposedly "cool" feeds, especially many cool/pasture mixes. There are so many more natural options but you have to get the starch figures, not just take the manufacturer's recommendation that it's a real non-heating feed. Peas and beans get included in some barley free feeds but they send most horses loopy - so for most horses forget barley free and think about overall starch and sugar levels instead.
 
There are peas in calm and condition so that could explain problems with some horses.
Only 13% starch in it though which is lower than horse and pony cubes by spillers which has 16%
 
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