Am angry and appalled - what do you lot think?

Angelbones

Angelbones

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To cut a very long story short here's the situation:

If you watched someone (a horsey professional) trying to load a horse into a lorry (steep ramp, horse young and not used to loading at all) and the horse reared up and over backwards, not once, or twice but 4 times, what would you do? Would you speak up? Would you try to stop it? Would you walk away?

Just wondering as this is what happened locally to me last week, and I am so upset and cross about it all.

Ok, first fall is seriously unfortunate, but if I'm being really generous i could say yes, I can see whey they would say let's try it all again. But for the horse to fall over backwards twice and then to carry on with it for a third and then a fourth time is really beyond belief to me. Its not as if a) the horse couldn't have stayed longer and had some loading help, b) they were going to take the horse back and get on it that day, especially after the first fall, so time wasn't the issue. I am deeply upset for the horse (who is now injured), and appalled at those involved. I hasten to add that I wasn't there but have been told all this separately by two people who were there.

My reaction was, amongst other things, why on earth didn't anyone speak up and stop it? Well I was told that nobody wanted to challenge the loader etc etc. Now in a perfect world I would like to believe that I would have had the guts to speak up, but of course you never know until you are in that situation do you? If nothing else I think I would have made it clear that I wasn't happy and wasn't about to be part of it and then removed myself from the situation.

There you go, I'm so cross and upset about it all. Just wondered what you lot felt about this type of thing really?
 
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Terrible - if the facts are true. As you weren't there first hand, there may be an element of chinese whispers coming in....

If it is true, though, then I'm amazed the owner of the youngster didn't think that all of this would be a bad idea from the outset!
 
To be honest - while on the livery yard I saw all sorts of terrible loading, unfair on the horse and dangerous for the handler.

I learned never to interfere - however bad - unless help is asked for. In which case they never liked my answer of "work on the ground to put all the pieces together then introduce it at the right time".

These people always know best, the horse not loading is a fact they can't deal with, it escallates into agression and unfair behaviour and If it ain't my horse or lorry there is nothing at all that I can do about it.
 
I saw a senior BHS instructor beat a horse up cause it wouldnot go into a stable because she thought nobody was looking. So perfect arent they. I was the only one there so had no evidence to use against her.
 
I know of a horse that fell on the concrete and broke the bone near to his tail due to this kind of "training". He did eventually get over his trauma about loading (from what I can gather) but he now won't stand on concrete happily. Very sad business.
 
after the first episode, i would put horse into a box, back lorry ramp up to the door of said box, and then drive horse onto lorry.

Horses will always "run away" from confrontation..so will run up the ramp without too much stress.

I wouldn't allow ANY animal on my yard to be treated as such.

Sadly a mare of mine several years ago "flipped" over loading for Hunting one morning, had an aneurism and died where she fell..previously a sound loader.
I wouldnt risk it now
 
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I would wonder if there was any mis representation as you don't have it first hand but would still want to know why the witnesses or owner did nothing in the face of apparent cruelty? I worked at a yard where one of the liveries tried to force her horse into a trailer to go to a show and it wasn't having it, reared up and over onto it's back on the yard, as she tried again with a friend behind with a lunge whip it went up again catching the top of the trailer. I pointed out that going to ashow with a horse in such a state and having two serious blows was not the best idea. Big row followed along the lines of 'it's my horse I'll do what I want'. Next thing horse drops like a rock and starts fitting, vet came out, horse either unresponsive or fitting and recommends it's immediately pts but she refused to and left it overnight! Horse died six hours later, she had gone home. Awful thing to happen to a lovely mare. Always butt in if someone is doing something stupid!

Following on from this the following day she turned up at ten am to check on her horse that we had all stayed up with to find it dead, she then had a go at me as if it were my fault, I told her where to get off, she pushed me, I let it go, she tried to push me again but I stepped aside and she fell, got up and left. Two hours later the cops arrived and took me in on suspicion of assault! Thankfully I had plenty of witnesses and they let me go. Still glad I stuck my nose in tho!!
 
Angelbones said:
To cut a very long story short here's the situation:

If you watched someone (a horsey professional) trying to load a horse into a lorry (steep ramp, horse young and not used to loading at all) and the horse reared up and over backwards, not once, or twice but 4 times, what would you do? Would you speak up? Would you try to stop it? Would you walk away?

Just wondering as this is what happened locally to me last week, and I am so upset and cross about it all.

Ok, first fall is seriously unfortunate, but if I'm being really generous i could say yes, I can see whey they would say let's try it all again. But for the horse to fall over backwards twice and then to carry on with it for a third and then a fourth time is really beyond belief to me. Its not as if a) the horse couldn't have stayed longer and had some loading help, b) they were going to take the horse back and get on it that day, especially after the first fall, so time wasn't the issue. I am deeply upset for the horse (who is now injured), and appalled at those involved. I hasten to add that I wasn't there but have been told all this separately by two people who were there.

My reaction was, amongst other things, why on earth didn't anyone speak up and stop it? Well I was told that nobody wanted to challenge the loader etc etc. Now in a perfect world I would like to believe that I would have had the guts to speak up, but of course you never know until you are in that situation do you? If nothing else I think I would have made it clear that I wasn't happy and wasn't about to be part of it and then removed myself from the situation.

There you go, I'm so cross and upset about it all. Just wondered what you lot felt about this type of thing really?
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sorry you got someting wrong... It was'nt a horsey professional it was a hopeless half wit A hole.. who isnt any good at even the most basic training .....
 
A horse going over on it's back can cause serious injury and even death, so I would speak up, loudly if need be.
My young horse went over backwards once when being loaded by a professional, and it may be that the force of the impact cause the long-term damage that meant she had to retire at 6 years old.
As I'm not that far from you, I'd like to know who the professional is, just to be aware if anyone I know is using them. If you feel OK about it, would you mind pm'ing me?
 
Please excuse me if I am being ignorant but IF what you were told is true, I'm confused as to why it happened. I understand that they need to get the horse loaded for whatever reason, and its not an issue they could probably call off and say 'nevermind, we'll try again in 6 months time', but surely they had options?

A less steep ramp? Loading help? Bucket of food? Load another horse first?
I don't understand the reason behind forcing an issue like this where they not only lose out on loading the horse anyway but also injur it and have to pay vet fees. Even the most uncaring owner, that makes no logical sense. If it was young perhaps they could have loaded his mum first (or perhaps he's not THAT young). In any case, there were options. Its not as though cruelty achieved their goal more quickly, anyway.
 
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