Am I expecting too much? What's everyone's opinion.

[horseForce]

So the other day I went to look at a share. Absolutely stunning purebred shire youngster, newly broken so quite green. Ever so sweet. However, the dilemma I'm struggling a bit with is although I could absolutely love the horse, I do find myself essentially in a position of paying (quite a bit too!) to educate someone else's horse for them. I've brought on other people's horses before so it's definitely not beyond my abilities.

However, what's the concensus here on essentially paying to subsidise a strangers horses education?

I'm assuming most people paying for a share would want something that's already competent for them!

 

[Roxylola]

Every circumstance is different. Do you really want to share the horse, would you rather wait for something that ticks more of your boxes? If this horse is one you're really keen to ride you may need to be prepared to pay towards the horse

 

[Shay]

Its really individual. Lots of folk do advertise looking for sharers as an alternative to paying a professional. And it is very nice for them if they can get it. They do also take a bit of a risk - especially with such a green horse as it is so easy to ruin them. If the circumstances and the money suit you then go for it - if they don't, keep looking.

 

[Trouper]

I guess it depends where you get your satisfaction from. If it is just the riding, then perhaps a green youngster is not the one. But if you like training young ones up and seeing them develop and improve and having the satisfaction of giving them the best start in life, then that is another scenario. You don't say anything about the owner's capabilities of doing this? If they would appreciate your help with his education then I think that is the basis for a conversation on perhaps reducing the financial contribution in return for your skills?

 

[canteron]

It really depends whether it’s worth it to you? Maybe a bit cheeky of the owner .... but if it ticks other boxes for you then go for it .... if not keep looking!

 

[Gingerwitch]

It's your choice you either like what is on offer or you don't. Unless you have been promised an established horse that is now broke and have been offered an alternative.

 

[brighteyes]

I'd be looking at the owner/other side of the deal and their situation. How long is the share likely to be? Might they be the sort to sell on as soon as hard times hit? Would you want to/be able to take on all your hard work in the event this happens or would you suck it up?

Aside from all that, a Shire is quite an undertaking!

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

IMO, every time you ride a horse, in fact every time you have any interaction with a horse you will be training it, either for good, or the opposite, it is immaterial whether the horse is green or very experienced.

If you want to share, rather than buying your own horse, any owner will expect you to be riding in such a way that the horse improves, or at least doesn't 'disimprove'.

I am not sure that I would want a stranger to ride my green horse, so you should consider yourself lucky to have the opportunity, imo. Whether you want to take up the opportunity or not is up to you.

 

[Skib]

It is always a grey area in sharing. Which side should pay or what constitutes training?
As far as the horse goes - One cant answer this unless you say where and how you will be riding the horse? I have always hacked shares which is so good for a young horse. Any horse I hack has to be taught how I want it to go for me and how to respond. I was very confused when my safety checks (entirely for my own peace of mind) were described by the yard staff as schooling.
My training any horse I ride (my choice) is not for the good of the horse.And with this horse being so young there might be a difference of opinion about it being trained in a school at all at this age and how?
As far as the owner goes, absolute trust between owner and sharer seems to me essential for any share to succeed.
I would also suggest that if you like this horse, you ask the owner for a sharing contract which allows you to make an offer if the owner decides to sell the horse.

 

[Goldenstar]

It’s really down to if you want to do it .
Would it give you pleasure .
Yes in essence you paying to do something the might well have had to pay someone to do , personally I would not test pilot someone else’s young horse and pay to do it but if it will give you pleasure go for it .
The pit fall young horses need very regular unambiguous riding so you need to be sure you and the owner can work together because if you fear it may became a situation where the horse not get worked and you arrive to a fresh youngster in winter I would not do it .

 

[Polos Mum]

As the nights start to draw in it's amazing how many full loan green / just broken horses are starting to come up available. I fully see both sides of the debate.

OP I would think as much about the owner as I would about the horse - can you work with them, do they ride in a similar style to you, do they seem like they have the confidence / knowledge to bring on a big young horse. If you're there because the owner is having issues that would be different for me than if the owner is just time poor!

Maybe the cost is negotiable if they can see how much of an asset you are?

There will be lots coming up for share in the next few months as winter / redundancies bite

 

[Xmasha]

It depends what you want out of it. personally (if i was a good enough rider ) i wouldnt be paying to bring someone elses horse on. Plus how would you feel if in 12 months if they sold the horse on, and made a few ££ out of your work ?

 

[Polos Mum]

There's always 2 sides. I've a pony on loan at the moment, my horse is off games (likely permanently) and with the virus (lack of work and silly horse prices) I've no funds to replace him.
Pony is being schooled for the first time in years (really ever - he's only 7), he's looking really well in only 6 weeks and smashed a dressage test yesterday (first time out in 18 months). Him being more valuable to sell in 2-3 months is guaranteed but that's a risk I'll take - I'm enjoying him, he's having a great time and i'm grateful to be out having fun even if it turns out to be short term.

I've loaned before and after about 8 years the owner called just to triple check I knew she never wanted him back (her circumstances were changing) - at that point she'd have had him back over my dead body so perfect arrangement all round.

Everyone's individual circumstances are different and each situation is different.

 

[horseForce]

It depends what you want out of it. personally (if i was a good enough rider ) i wouldnt be paying to bring someone elses horse on. Plus how would you feel if in 12 months if they sold the horse on, and made a few ££ out of your work ?

This really touches upon many points as do so many other replies. It's a big horse for a big owner type situation (no disrespect to them of course) so they don't seem physically that capable nor do they seem hugely experienced. The yard is also very inclined towards dealing / breeding so I absolutely can't be sure if they wouldn't intend to sell my work at some point. They've also repeatedly insisted they're not going to sell unprompted sending a few bells ringing.

What struck me as odd is the yard owner has been doing 90% of the talking, whilst the actual owner seemed quite hands off on the whole process and even left the YO to manage the ad and the contract.

Maybe I'm being over cautious.

 

[Cortez]

Why on earth would you pay to do a job that someone should be being paid to do?

 

[Buster2020]

See the problem with that type of share is when the horse is trained and is going nicely . The owner could suddenly stop the share because she got what she/he wanted a trained horse without having to put her hand in her pocket. I would be very careful op I now people who had green full loan horse and the minute the horse was trained up the owners took the horse back and sold the horse for a lot of money.

 

[Muddywellies]

These situations baffle me. I regularly see young horses (some unbroken) for loan or share and indeed, it always looks to me that some people want their horse brought on for free. I guess if you enjoy doing it, and don't mind after 12 months hard work, the owner taking the horse back, then go for it. But I personally wouldn't.

 

[Lintel]

Horses for courses really...


If you enjoy bringing horses on without the financial uncertainty that goes along side it then it works out for you ?

Most certainly it works out well for the owner if they get a competent sharer able to bring their horse on without paying for a pro but really how often does it work out that way?

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

If you are sharing someone else's horse you need to bear in mind that the share can be ended at any time, no matter what standard the horse is when you start the share - and no matter what the owner's plans are at the time, they can change and, of course, anything unexpected can happen to the horse.
If you want as much certainty as possible, you need to buy your own horse.

 

[criso]

I can see why people say about paying to bring on a horse but then there are people who can't have their own horse but are very able and maybe want more of a challenge.

When I was on a yard in London, there were a lot of these sort of shares. The nature of London meant there were very good riders who had maybe just moved to London from other parts of the UK or overseas, working or students. They weren't in a position yet to have their own horse in terms of finances, time and being settled in where they were in life and location. They were maybe riding at a riding school once and week getting frustrated with the how much they were getting out of this. And with London prices, it might be costing the same if not more than access to a share several days a week.
The owners had a green horse because they weren't in a position to buy a established horse, were working maybe long hours and found it helpful to have a couple of days a week when they didn't have to go to the yard. It wasn't about having someone else bringing on your horse, they would have been looking for a sharer whether the horse was green, established, a novice ride or sharp. Alot of the shares ended because the sharer got their own horse, moved away or the horse moved to a different yard that wasn't convenient though many sharers followed to new yards.

It's also worth bearing in mind that if there are any problems with horse either behavioural or physical, then the sharer can just walk away.

 

[Tarragon]

Surely this is entirely up to the individual. Perhaps ask yourself if you had to choose between no horse to ride because you can't find the right ready-made share horse and taking on a green share horse and getting some satisfaction out of developing the horse, which would you prefer?
I once spent 2 hours a day 5 days a week exercising hunters for nothing, just because I didn't have anything to ride myself and I loved taking these beautiful horses out!
I might have baulked at paying for the privilege though.

 

[Melody Grey]

Why on earth would you pay to do a job that someone should be being paid to do?

This, with bells on!

 

[Myloubylou]

Depends on whether long term share & if horse has issues. Share to me means opportunity to have horse for much less than outright ownership. As long as you have same goals as the owner why wouldn’t you pay towards its keep if you have them part of the time? If I wanted someone to come and improve my horse beyond my capabilities then yes I’d pay them. So at the end of the day is up to you whether you want to take on a green horse or not.

 

[Auslander]

I tentatively put the feelers out once for a sharer for my reasonably well schooled horse once. Had about 64 million replies from people who wanted me to pay them to school him for me...I was quite tempted to invite some of them over to show me what they could do to improve his level of schooling!

I don't have much truck with people who are looking for a share, but then object to paying to ride green horses, because they don't want to offer a free schooling service. If you're not a pro rider, and that's the sort of horse you like, take ego out of the mix, and ask yourself if you'd enjoy riding this horse.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I tentatively put the feelers out once for a sharer for my reasonably well schooled horse once. Had about 64 million replies from people who wanted me to pay them to school him for me...I was quite tempted to invite some of them over to show me what they could do to improve his level of schooling!

I don't have much truck with people who are looking for a share, but then object to paying to ride green horses, because they don't want to offer a free schooling service. If you're not a pro rider, and that's the sort of horse you like, take ego out of the mix, and ask yourself if you'd enjoy riding this horse.

This with bells on, if you don't like what on offer to share, buy your own!

 

[Shilasdair]

^^^ What Auslander said.

If you think you are good enough, in qualifications and experience, to bring someone else's horse on, then insure yourself and advertise your services at a competitive rate.
If you want to share a horse because you can't afford your own, or don't want the commitment or whatever, then don't start complaining that the horse is too green for your amazing rider skills. Either enjoy it, or don't.

I've been on both sides of the loaning experience - having a lovely lady riding my somewhat green 5yo Tb while I studied far away, and also borrowing a GP dressage horse which had been competed to a high level. I was grateful for both experiences.

 

[Auslander]

^^^ What Auslander said.

Please don't agree with me. It makes me feel very uncomfortable

 

[Shilasdair]

Please don't agree with me. It makes me feel very uncomfortable

I absolutely agree with you, Auslander. Always.

And I'll continue to do so until your freak, Shetland related, completely unforeseen demise. Hugs?

 

[Auslander]

I absolutely agree with you, Auslander. Always.

And I'll continue to do so until your freak, Shetland related, completely unforeseen demise. Hugs?

My Shitland doesnt want to hurt me any more, since I adapted his diet. He now eats only handbaked, heavily iced cupcakes, and he loves me very much

 

[Shilasdair]

My Shitland doesnt want to hurt me any more, since I adapted his diet. He now eats only handbaked, heavily iced cupcakes, and he loves me very much

Have you heard of the term 'lulling'?

My money is on the Shetland.