Am I just being sour????

[cmarychapman]

Am I just being sour????....In a word Yes!

In your previous post apparently your sharer said she was going away at Christmas 3 months before when she started the share but you couldn't remember if this happened or not. You didn't seem to take any initiative to diary when your sharer was around or not even though many people go away at Christmas. Without any specific contract stating otherwise all the extra livery bills are your responsibility.

I live in London and for £200 per week I could ride twice per week on a nice competition horse kept on full livery with oportunities to compete. Your sharer is paying £200 to toddle around the countryside so I don't consider it a good deal at all. As a sharer I expect to pay the market value for a share which is NOT necessarily the same as a proportion of the costs of keeping the horse. Good sharers are hard to come by, someone with a good reputation and riding skills (both of which you want seeing as you are 'finickity'); well that comes at a price too!

If I was you I would do your sharer a favour, give her the £200 back and end it now. Retire your oldie and do what you want with the other. Good luck

 

[Wagtail]

When we offer a share on a horse at our yard the going rate is £30 per week for 2/3 days with absolutely no yard duties to do. They just turn up and ride. It is still difficult though to find suitable and competent sharers. The only thing I advise people to ensure, is that the sharer agrees to pay the money up front whether they ride or not. It sounds like you are getting this and more, so I do think you are being unreasonable in your expectations of a sharer. Maybe you should write up a contract which stipulates that she gives you a certain amount of notice of her absences in future. If she sends it by text or email then she can keep a record that she has informed you even if you forget.

 

[Sarah Sum1]

Yes, I think you're being a bit sour.

 

[pixiebee]

i cant remember who said they wouldnt pay for a lame horse but i think its a bit unfair to do that in the short term as its one of those things and cant be helped.
Also, she said that she had verbally informed me but am i certain she didnt-its the sort of thing i would have written in the calender. and i was arranging the horses over xmas-thats how i found out she was going away.! i would have tried to avoid full livery-especially at double cost if i had earlier notice-my partner could have swapped his work days etc.

to the poster who said that they pay 200 per week to ride a comp horse twice....my sharer pays 100 per MONTH per horse so the 200 is for TWO horses, so no comparision to be honest!

why should someone expect to pay nothing/very little towards the cost of someones horse and ride etc for the owner to pay for someone elses enjoymnet. they ride x times per week then they pay towards those costs-still a damnsite cheaper than owning TWO horses!!
Now ok-so i admit im perhaps being sour because if im honest with myself, id rather not share my horses at all.

however, i feel a bit upset that she has moaned becasue the farrier cant come out for a week and she cant hack him out-though ive told her the school is fine so its not like she cant ride at all!! and i have also told her that her kids are welconme to ride the older one but just take it steady and stay in the school this week to see how he goes. i have NOT told her to not ride etc etc!
gotta love this forum!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[NOISYGIRL]

I would have thought she should pay for the days she couldn't do, I would be very miffed as thats the reason you have a sharer and have agreed those days, if she can't do them on those days she should cough up

PS if you think you can cope now without a sharer I would part company with her. Nobody rides my horse and never has, I don't like it, except in a 999 emergency when I blacked out with my gal bladder pain haha, my friend rode him home for me, apart from that nobody rides him other than me.

 

[Archangel]

Has your sharer ever had her own horse? I think when you have had your own you understand that you spend most of your time looking for lost shoes, box resting, and very little just turning up and riding!

Regarding the Christmas arrangements, it is unfortunate but I think you have to bear the extra cost simply because you are the owner. I think even if I had a sharer for one of mine I would not expect them to do the horse Christmas Day or Boxing/New Year's day simply because that is the day everyone has huge commitments.

I do think it is quite common for people to pay to share and just turn up to ride the horse and not get involved in the day to day running of things. It is not the way I do things personally, but it is perfectly OK.

It is a funny thing but once you start paying for things you have certain expectations (obviously this goes out the window when you are the owner - you might as well start burning £20 notes in a wheelbarrow). £200 is a lot of money to shell out and she may be thinking twice about value for money.

I personally would grit my teeth and put the livery money issue behind me and look at it this way - you are getting a £200 contribution each month to the cost of your horses which is not to be sniffed at, plus the horses are getting worked at a grim time of the year. Perhaps have a friendly chat with her about the horse who is having to take it easy for the moment - she is probably a bit grumbly because you are a bit grumbly and both of you have a point tbh.

Tricky thing being a sharer and having a sharer!

 

[cmarychapman]

why should someone expect to pay nothing/very little towards the cost of someones horse and ride etc for the owner to pay for someone elses enjoymnet. they ride x times per week then they pay towards those costs-still a damnsite cheaper than owning TWO horses!!
QUOTE]

Because (believe it or not) some owners consider that their sharers provide them with a service by exercising their horse and doing stable duties it a) frees up their time to do other things, b) saves them money as they do not have to pay for a groom/full livery c) provides them with a contribution towards the costs of keeping their horse. I think very few people expect to share a horse for free but I find it strange that some people do not think that there is a market price for sharing.

 

[loopyloop]

to the poster who said that they pay 200 per week to ride a comp horse twice....my sharer pays 100 per MONTH per horse so the 200 is for TWO horses, so no comparision to be honest!

why should someone expect to pay nothing/very little towards the cost of someones horse and ride etc for the owner to pay for someone elses enjoymnet. they ride x times per week then they pay towards those costs-still a damnsite cheaper than owning TWO horses!!
Now ok-so i admit im perhaps being sour because if im honest with myself, id rather not share my horses at all.

Personally I think £200 to ride two older horses that she is only hacking 3x a week is a bit steep! I pay £100 a month to ride two beautiful competition horses whenever/wherever I like! That is only a recent development though, prior to this I rode for part of winter and the whole of summer for free!!! Yes I know I'm onto a winner but before this I was paying £130 a month and shoes for one horse that I could ride whenever/wherever!

The owner is obviously footing the majority of her bills, so she is technically paying for my enjoyment BUT she also appreciates everything I do for her and in the grand scheme of things its cheaper for her than having to pay her full costs and have a groom/rider.

Its swings and roundabouts really!

It sounds to me like you need the sharer more than she needs you though?

 

[Suzie86]

I think the debate on the price is affected a lot by the area you are in.

£200 a month is not very much round here, especially for 2 horses

 

[Spyda]

I have had sharers in the past so speak from personal experience.

When you propose to share your horse you need to decide in advance how much riding your are going to offer your sharer (what days or hours of riding) and whether or not the sharer is to help with yard duties and if so, on which days. Then decide in advance what will happen on those days that the sharer cannot 'do' their days. Once you've decided these factors you come up with an all inclusive 'share price' charged weekly or monthly. This should take into account ALL of the expenses you wish your sharer to contribute. Full stop. It's no good agreeing with a sharer to pay x-amount per month, then start asking for extras later on for things you haven't expressly agreed on when the share was agreed and started.

Also, look at it from your sharers position. If one of your horses is unable to maintain the level of work it was when the share started, it would be fair to ask the sharer if they are happy to continue sharing. To agree to pay £100 to hack out and then not be able to, is a breach of the verbal agreement initially made. IMO your sharer has every right to feel miffed AMT when she's parted with £200 this month and one horse has lost a shoe and the other isn't up to hacking.

Ultimately, if you resent your sharers contribution of £200 per month for what she and her children get to do with your horses, you should terminate the arrangement. Then sit down, work out what would make you happy and look again on those terms.

 

[paisley]

Obviously, you're annoyed at the extra cost, but in all honesty it sounds like a lot of mis-communication. I do appreciate you are struggling financially, but I expect even if you had a contract it would probably only have stated your sharer had to pay the £200 per month- so you wouldnt have been any better off. From your original post, what about retiring the older horse, and you school the other one and she hacks it? You save money and both of you do what you like best!

 

[Azmar]

It's not obligatory to keep horses. If you can only afford to by sharing then so be it, but for goodness sake £200 per month is not to be sniffed at is it? If she cannot ride them then why should she pay etc as previously stated. I think 'you cannot have your cake and eat it too' cones to mind.......

 

[marmalade76]

Crikey - if someone was to pay me £200 per month to hack my two out, I'd be happy to fit in around them and I'd have a much fitter pair of ponies to boot!

FWIW, I would not expect a sharer to look after my horse on Christmas day/Boxing day/new year.

It sounds to me, OP, that you are simply not cut out for sharing and need to find another way of reducing your costs.

 

[pixiebee]

oh god, im really mean arent i?
i just think that part of owning/riding/being involved with horses has its ups and downs and being lame/loosing shoes is one of them. it cant be helped, and surely if all you want to do is turn up and ride and not pay when you cant ride-go to a riding scholol and pay for lkessons. I cannot believe the amount of people on here who say people ride their horses and dont pay/muck out etc-thats insane and not what horses are about. why shouldnt she pay towards them? she has them for whatever she wants to do on those days as if they were her own. (apart from this week fair enough) and lessons in this area are easily 25 quid per half an hr and there are 3 of them riding. so if they were to ride 3 times per week that would mean it would cost her £300 per month. so i dont see how 200 for them is steep?
ps..whoever said TWO old horses...one is only 12 and fully fit and capable of jumping/dressage etc etc but she CHOOSES to amble around the countryside! He was advertised at 100 per month and i stated that he could jump etc etc and we have a lovely indoor school, dressage arena, showjumps etc which they would have full use of plus she has half livery where they are turned out and fed in the mornings so she only has to go up in the afternoon. so not that bad is it!!

 

[eggs]

Given that this is your second post about your sharer that I have read I am really not sure why you posted this. You clearly feel that your sharer isn't right for you so do what you feel you have to do.

 

[gnubee]

I think the issue you are dealing with is that people generally have sharers either because they dont have the time to do their horses, in which case they would tend to offer a cheap riding deal in exchange for the sharer making a regular commitment to do the work on their days (essentially the sharer gets the benefit of riding, and you get a cheap/free groom) OR you need a financial contribution, so continue to make yourself available to groom/muck out etc., in exchange for the sharer being able to effectively treat you like a riding school.
You seem to be lucky enough to have the best of both worlds atm, in a regular committment to do stable jobs from your sharer, plus a sizeable monthly contribution, and have perhaps become a bit spoiled by it, so where in situation 1 above you would be entitled to be upset because the sharer doing regular days was the foundation of the deal, and in situation 2 you would have been expecting to pay for christmas, you were not really expecting to pay, but IMO not really entitled to expect the sharer to do the work.

Given that you have what appears to be a fairly good deal from your sharer but are still not really happy with the arangement, and the older horse doesnt seem to be up to the work anymore, and you seem to not want other people riding your horse now you are bringing it into training, I think probably you should explain to the sharer that you think you need to end the arangement because the older horse doesnt seem up to it, and you want to spend more time riding your competition horse. Either that, or think about what arangement you would want in terms of time/cash from the sharer to make you actually happy with the arangement, and then explain to them that you need to change the deal, and will understand if they are no longer interested. At the moment, it looks like your mutual dissatisfaction is just going to end up with you falling out, and probably being abandoed by the sharer at short notice.

 

[Honey08]

I would jump at someone to pay £200 to help out with my three - including the pony for their children. They are both BE competing horses. At the moment I'm nota able to ride that much due to injury, and would even have someone ride in return for help.

I think that it sounds like you have a fantastic deal, but you don't realise it, and as someone said, it will end in a fall out and a lot of bad feeling sooner or later (probably sooner). You'd be better taking your horses back, doing all the work, and paying for everything yourself. That way you'd know it was down to you if you went away again... If you ever have a sharer again, have a written agreement regarding what happens re holidays, and write things down in a diary.

I feel sorry for her really, paying all that money and doing a decent portion of the work, while walking on eggshells. She'd be better off paying to ride at a RS. It may cost more, but they wouldn't complain about everything she did, she'd be insured, and get instruction in the bargain! She would easily find another share agreement anyway.

Sorry if that isn't what you want to hear.

 

[Witchy]

...i have only seen this lady ride once on a hack and i dont know exactly what she is doing when she is riding them> i.e cantering/trotting etc and am finicky about other people riding my horses in the first place. would you allow someone else to hack your horses out that you didnt know that well?

Are you for real? These two questions should have been answered by you before starting to share your horses. As the owner, you say what should and should not be done with your horses so you should know what's being done with them out on a hack. I think the answer of letting people you don't know ride your horses has been answered, yes you would and you have.

Sorry but yes, you sound sour.

 

[miss_bird]

I do see your point about not enough notice being given (aparently) but she still paid you £200 for the month and would of only been there for a week.
So yes i do think you are being a bit off, and asking someone who is paying for the pleasure of hacking to only go in the school is a bit harsh

 

[Cinnamontoast]

That's a lot of money for her to pay: she could have two of her own on grass livery for that.

You can't expect her to offer more money-why should she? Your agreement was £200, end of story. You can't ask for or expect more because you had to pay for your horses when she was away. Unless you have a contract re payment when she can't make it, you can't really whinge.

I'm just grateful that I have a sharer who can ride (I was very keen to check this before I let her take my boy on!) and the money is peripheral for me. I can more than afford my horse and I hate to be a cow, but I don't think people should have animals if they can't afford them without lots of help. You said you could cope without her: give her notice, therefore. You don't sound happy and what's the point of having horses unless you get a ton of pleasure from it?

 

[brigantia]

If your main focus is schooling and competition, I would think you'd like to have a sharer who enjoys hacking so the horse can get a break from the schooling. That way the horse's routine is more varied and interesting. Hacking is generally a lot less harder on the horse's joints etc. than intensive schooling and jumping, anyway.

It sounds like you're paying a lot for livery. Are there cheaper livery options available to you?

 

[xspiralx]

As everyone else has already said; as they are your horses, you are responsible for any extra costs.

People who share do so because they don't have the money or time, or want the hassle of owning a horse.

The owner gets the burden when the chips are down but also have the pleasure of owning their own animal and being able to call the shots.

£200 p/m is more than fair IMO and I agree with whoever said that if you need to rely on a sharer in order to be able to afford your horses, then perhaps you shouldn't have them? Owning is a privilege, not a right. [hence why I haven't owned my own since I was 18 - I'd love to but can't afford it right now!]

 

[The_snoopster]

It appears that you actually do not want a sharer, so end the share agreement and be done with it, personally I hate riding in a school and the owner would have to pay me £200 a month to do it.

 

[Twizzel]

If you look the shoes bit from her point of view, she is paying for the use of a horse agreed at the start of the share, if that horse cannot be used in a way she wants because it has no shoes, why should she pay the £200 a month? She is sticking to her end of the deal yet still can't ride the horse. I used to share and the farrier was a bit pants at coming out and normally took 10 days from when you phoned/text to actually shoeing the horse, so if I couldn't ride on those 10 days, my share money was reduced. When money is exchanging hands it almost becomes a business agreement, the sharer pays X amount each month and expects the owner to make sure the horse is available to be ridden on their days. If the horse is lame/throws a shoe then it obviously isn't able to be ridden so the share money should be reduced. My old share horse couldn't be ridden for 4 weeks whilst she waited for a new saddle- my share money was halved in those 4 weeks so I could afford to go for a hack at a riding school. I still did my 4 days/wk looking after the horse though.

I don't think the sharer should pay the extra livery costs either, she still paid her normal £200/month even when she wasn't able to ride the horse... doesn't sound like it's working for either of you...

 

[BonneMaman]

I think you have learnt a valuable lesson - get a contract in place and make it clear what you expect them to pay for.

I agree though - if they are supposed to look after the horses on set days then it is their responsibility to arrange alternative arrangements for their care. Mentioning in passing that you might be away on holiday is not good practice - get them to write it down on a calendar or notice board or similar.

However, you do need to sort out the shoes asap but again this is all part of having horses and the sharer needs to understand that ***** happens, horses lose shoes. I would not be happy to hack out on 3 shoes - you would be asking for trouble.

I would also have checked how good a rider they were before loaning - what if something had happened to either the sharer or the horse due to their inability?

Good luck though in future.... and ignore those on here that cannot be civil with their replies - some of them were very rude and should really grow up!

 

[pixiebee]

thank you! was beginning to think im a right witch!!! lol
for those who said i shouldnt have horses if i cant afford them-my partner has lost some work unexpectedly which means that it has left us short for a few months. so what you are saying is that i should sell my horses just because im struggling for a few months?!!!
normally we manage ok-never loads of money spare but we manage!
I bet half the people here who own horses dont have loads of money and have the odd month where things are tight!

 

[Ginge Crosby]

I have had sharers in the past so speak from personal experience.

When you propose to share your horse you need to decide in advance how much riding your are going to offer your sharer (what days or hours of riding) and whether or not the sharer is to help with yard duties and if so, on which days. Then decide in advance what will happen on those days that the sharer cannot 'do' their days. Once you've decided these factors you come up with an all inclusive 'share price' charged weekly or monthly. This should take into account ALL of the expenses you wish your sharer to contribute.

.

Thanks for this spyda, i'm considering sharing/loaning my boy at the moment and i'm glad to get something useful from this thread!

 

[lexiedhb]

I am a sharer- have been for 3 years- so would like to think i am a pretty good one. I have never fallen out with my horses owners, and pay £50pcm for 2 days a week- plus do my share horse and her others if needs be

Several things about your post struck me
1) You have only seen this person ride your horse once in however long she has been with you---- WHY? how come something so precious to you (hoss) has been allowed off the yard with a perfect stranger you have seen ride once???
2) I would not pay extra towards my share horse because the OWNER could not make it up the yard
3) She pays you £200 PCM- so already pays for the horses shoes
4) you are expecting her to pay more, or continue to pay the same when she can not do what it is she pays you for with said lame hoss
5)Although called sharer's technically they do not share the horse.... in most cases, the responsibility lies with you as the owner....... do you expect her to pay half your vets bills?

 

[lara b]

My two pence worth (as a past owner/loaner/sharer both of my own and of someone elses) would be that if I was the sharer and I couldn't do my chores on my set days then I would pay the livery. However when I share a horse I would tend to treat it as mine on my days, which would mean sorting out xmas etc in advance just like I would with my own.