Am I looking for something that doesn't exist?

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chaps89

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I will apologise in advance for the length of this post and any typos/grammar errors as Im posting from my phone not laptop.
I have been horse hunting rather unsuccessfully since the start of the year.
My requirements are: 15hh-ish gelding. Aged between 3 and 13. Must be sound/healthy and a nice person to be around who activley likes cuddles. Ideally green/a project but nothing dangerous. To do a bit of everything with but potentially endurance long term. Budget max of £2k.
I had an interesting day yesterday viewing purpose bred endurance horses which has shown I need to re-evaluate what I want.
My riding style simply doesnt work with fast, forward going types, it never has and even if the horse is safe I lose confidence easily. Yet something backwards/nappy/green/that bucks etc I will happily ride and enjoy. I suspect this stems from riding quirky native types and my old horse was a very typical welsh. I had purposefully avoided adverts for welshes because I was wary of finding something similar to, but that will never be the same as/as good as, my old horse but I suspect now I need to go back to looking at more native types than blood types and change what I want to do and be happy doing small pleasures on a horse I enjoy, rather than having a horse who can do the longer distances but I wont even hack out at home as I dont enjoy it.
In terms of what I want to do long term, it seems difficult as I want a horse who is more than a happy hacker hacking out a few times a week but I dont even want something to do rc/affiliate on, I want something I can school and hack, do the odd cross country, bit of clear round sj, unaffiliated dressage and pleasure rides. Which seems to be a bit of an in between market! I am happy to put the work in to do this tho. I dont have the budget to go out and buy this type of horse that is already doing this sort of thing (they seem to be few and far between anyway) and I like the process of getting to that stage as much as I enjoy riding when Im there.
I have tried smaller and bigger horses and find if I go above 15.2/15.3 I just have too much horse to collect and dont enjoy it but smaller than 14.2/14.3 and I just dont feel there is anything there/ safe and secure so height isnt something I can overly compromise on.
Because I dont want something that is already doing alot, I dont really want to increase the budget. Is this where Im going wrong maybe, do I need to increase the budget do we think?
I did see a horse yesterday which the owner/breeder had said is a one on one horse and very reserved that I really seemed to click with. He is unfortunatley in all other ways totally unsuitable :s however it has reconfirmed that although all the other horse were nice and didnt mind me fussing them it is important the horse activley wants to seek out attention and enjoys it. Is this something that will come with time/building a bond with the horse? Ie, am I expecting too much for a strange horse to want to be like this with someone they dont know?
I ideally want something with reasonable conformation, my old horse had soundness issues and even if something is sound Im wary of it being pre-disposed to lameness issues in the future. But that is how long is a piece of string and maybe I need to compromise here.
Then theres level of schooling, I really get a kick out of working with difficult/quirky horses but I wouldnt consider myself even remotely able to take on a 'dangerous' horse and I dont want to bite off more than I can chew. Equally ideally something freshly backed would be ideal for me to bring on. What Im finding is that mostly horses are backed and have done quite extensive work since or they arent backed yet but may have been started. As it would be my first youngster of my own (Ive worked with many others tho) I dont want to bite off more than I can chew and have to totally back one.
Reading that back, my basic criteria becomes alot more detailed and frankly I can understand why I cant find a horse. So, can anyone offer an outside opinion/ a fresh way of looking at the situation to find a horse I enjoy again please? Or equally, where on earth do you look/find the above horse?!
I miss having a horse to spend time with as much as riding and I am lucky that I have friends horses to ride and play with until I find something but I do miss having something of my own and I am very aware it will take time to build a bond and get to where I want.
 
For this budget I suggest you widen your geographical area. I was looking in the home counties and eventually found my pony in Wales through word of mouth. I hadn't been looking that far away but they are definitely cheaper if you look further away from the South East. People who know about these things said the height and type I was looking for (15ish hands, safe etc) would cost more because everybody is looking for that, but they are out there. I'm not sure that looking for a horse that actively seeks cuddles is realistic though - horses don't think the same as us so that sort of behaviour is often a sign of seeking treats! I would aim for a horse that is safe and reliable to handle on the ground, and the bond will grow over time.
 
I agree the bond will grow so don't have this a a need. The cuddly ones aren't always good to ride

Also would avoid warmblood types as It's the first youngster going solo. There movement is so much more athletic that when things do go wrong it's much worse to cope with

A nice well adjusted native would be ideal

As above I find natives in Wales much cheaper
 
Go and look at anything vaguely appropriate! You might not find one that fits all of your specifications, but you may just find one that is perfect for you. My horse Pip wasn't what I was after (I wanted a dressage schoolmaster, not a completely green ex racer) but he is so perfect for me and I wouldn't change a thing about him. Sometimes going with your heart is worth it :) I agree that it may take a while as you have quite a small budget and are after what a lot of people are after, but it is possible.

chaps89 said:
:s however it has reconfirmed that although all the other horse were nice and didnt mind me fussing them it is important the horse activley wants to seek out attention and enjoys it. Is this something that will come with time/building a bond with the horse? Ie, am I expecting too much for a strange horse to want to be like this with someone they dont know?
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I agree that this is probably fairly unrealistic, I couldn't catch mine in the stable to start with, and he didn't like being touched, whereas now he is a dopey donkey who loved cuddles. I think building a bond takes time :)

What about this mare? Someone was asking for help with her advert on here and she seems a lovely sort.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?638757-No-viewings-opinion-of-my-advert-please

http://www.horsemart.co.uk/all-rounder-horse-5-yrs-5-mths-15-0-hh-appaloosa-west-midlan/Horses/310093
 
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There's nothing to say that you need something 'purpose bred' for longer distances, or that you need something whizzy for longer distances. You just need something light to middle weight, sound, with a good work ethic, good legs and feet, and that is interested in what is round the next corner. Try looking at some part bred welshies if you don't want a purebred again, or maybe some of the lighter natives like connies or newfs. Connies have historically been very consistent endurance ponies, and there are quite a few overheight ones knocking around out there if you wanted something 15 hands. Look at what Flurrie has achieved over his career, or the Connies that Catriona Moon bred and rode.
 
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Whooo, you don't want much, do you? That's a hell of a prescriptive list of requirements and I'm not sure it is possible to fit all that into one "identikit" horse. Horses are individuals (I know you know this, just re-stating the obvious here) and have their own unique personalities so making it a requirement that they should "love" you is really a bit unrealistic. And yes, a "bond", whatever that might be, MAY develop; then again it may not. Personally I hate slobbery, clingy horses, but then I am quite businesslike and prefer dogs as pets. Expecting to find ALL that in a ready made package is, frankly, impossible; finding an approximation and then making it yourself would be more realistic. Your budget is very small, but I don't know that throwing money at it will produce what you want either. It is, as ever, down to good judgment, good sense, good gut feeling, and most of all good luck.
 
Pigeon said:
Go and look at anything vaguely appropriate! You might not find one that fits all of your specifications, but you may just find one that is perfect for you. My horse Pip wasn't what I was after (I wanted a dressage schoolmaster, not a completely green ex racer) but he is so perfect for me and I wouldn't change a thing about him. Sometimes going with your heart is worth it :) I agree that it may take a while as you have quite a small budget and are after what a lot of people are after, but it is possible.



I agree that this is probably fairly unrealistic, I couldn't catch mine in the stable to start with, and he didn't like being touched, whereas now he is a dopey donkey who loved cuddles. I think building a bond takes time :)

What about this mare? Someone was asking for help with her advert on here and she seems a lovely sort.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?638757-No-viewings-opinion-of-my-advert-please

http://www.horsemart.co.uk/all-rounder-horse-5-yrs-5-mths-15-0-hh-appaloosa-west-midlan/Horses/310093
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Well that pretty much ticks most of your boxes. Sane but a little green project. Right height, right price.
 
Hard one,
I think you can find a horse to do that on budget but you will have to be prepared to spend time and money looking personally I would up the budget if it gives you many more to see.
The Bond thing personally I don't like horses that are too cuddly with you when you view I think often they are to used to getting their own way and a bit spoilt I prefer horses who are more reserved and assess you the trust you get with this sort is won and worth more IMO .
Buy a horse to do a job then gain its trust and friendship bu your action it's not like meeting a bloke in a pub. if you only have one horse you can't expect to get the same feeling from the next one often you will struggle with the next horse because of the friendship you had with the one before.
Try to find a horse you like in type , you feel comfy on as soon as you get on , that passes the vet and then set off to see where the journey with the new horse gets you.
 
Cow pony - Im happy to travel, Id say its an even split in the ones Ive looked at, half being within an hour, half being further. Slightly put off from going too far as I dont mind travelling an hour and finding a lame horse but travelling 3 horses to find a lame horse is disheartening (yes, its happened) so I prefer to only travel further if Ive heard of the horse through word of mouth/its a reliable known seller. But I certainly dont mind travelling within reason.
I agree on the treat seeking, nothing worse than horses that mug you! Maybe I dont mean cuddley as such, more horses that seem to enjoy spending time with humans? But as herd animals I appreciate thats not the norm.
Fatponee- thanks, Ill take a look :)
Pigeon - I have looked at lots of different types, mostly younger, some older, slender, chunkier and fizzy and ploddy, that have been vaguely appropriate. Fully take on board the point about building a bond. Im more of a gelding person :( that said in all other ways she seems nice so Im sure a phonecall wont hurt so thankyou :)
EstherYoung - Thankyou, its helpful having an endurance persons point of view. Id hoped that a native type could well do the job and yesterday has definitley shown that its better to find the right horse for me and go from there. I suspect the horses we tried were quiet for endurance horses too and theyd definitley been started nicely so definitley better not thinking of finding one bred for the job.
Cortez - I know! I should have re-titled this thread as 'Im looking for a horse that doesnt exist so where do I go from here' as it would be much more apt! I *definitley* dont expect to find all of that in a ready to go package as it were, its why ive mostly looked at youngsters to 'make' one myself, partly as 1) the horse I want in the long run seems few and far between and when they are for sale theyre far beyond my budget and 2) I enjoy working with youngsters and putting the work in myself anyway. When I say I like a horse who enjoys attention I definitley still expect manners, including respecting personal space. But I do see the horse there as a 'friend' as much as to do a job.
Ihatework - yep, agreed. Im definitley more of a gelding person unfortunately but a phone call certainly never hurts when on other aspects tick the boxes.
Goldenstar - Im more than happy to put the time in to find the right horse, Id rather it take longer and I find the right horse than buy one for the sake of it and it just not work. Ive looked at ads in higher price categories but unless I want a ready made or competition type (which tbh I dont) there hasnt been anything that has caught my eye to make me want to up the budget. But Ill certainly take the point on board. I definitley dont want spoilt and wanting their own way. I know Im biased and I know its definitley something that came in time but my old boy understood personal space and had manners but equally would happily come to you in the field just for a scratch (he never got titbits so it certainly wasnt for that!) and would stand all day being groomed and faffed with which is what I want. Its a very valid point and something I need to keep in mind that it wasnt instant with my last horse. What concerns me about finding one I like/ticks the boxes/passss the vet and going from there is the 'liking the horse' bit. Because my old horse was semi-retired for so long*Ive ridden a fair number of horses belonging to other people. What thats shown me is horses Ive liked from the start Ive enjoyed much more and wanted to ride them. Where ive found horses which have been nice enough and I dont dislike I just dont like them (for reasons I cant put my finger on, theyve done nothing wrong) ive ended up riding them because I should and to help the owner and not enjoying it. So buying something that ticks the boxes and is nice enough scares me a bit. I seem to just 'know' as soon as I see a horse in the flesh if I like it or not which is a bleeding nightmare. I dont expect a bond and instant trust straight away by any means, there just needs to be 'something' there for me to be interested and I cant describe what that 'something' is to help the search.

Somehow I have had 3 vetted, with hindsight im glad I didnt end up with the first one (lame on near fore) as it would have been too much for me despite being perfect on paper- anglo arab x nf backed about 6 weeks earlier. Gutted the second one failed (bi-lateral lameness with compensating splints and windgalls) which was an unfit overheight connie who needed alot of work. And the 3rd one was an ish from ireland started but needing work who passed but was iffy (splints on 3 legs at 4 years old and scuffing his back end) so walked away. All very different horses with their own compromises.
I keep going back to the horse I saw yesterday who was a 'like' and right height/age/gender and seemingly sound, sold through a friend of a friend. But he was backed last year and has done nothing since and is a nervous sort who nedds to gain trust which he showed he seemed to want to with me and Id put the time in happily but he wont be a 'straight forward' horse, which for my first solo youngster I need to make it as easy on myself as I can, so I think Id be biting off more than I can chew and as I cant try him to ride its hard to judge. Head vs heart, doh.
Im sorry, people have probably read this thread and are screaming at their screens about the numpty who's too fussy!
 
You're describing a good Welshie. You're prepared to put the work in, you're budget should be fine, it would be in my area :)
Good luck x
 
Whats funny is Ive avoided welshies as I know how stubborn and hard work they can be and I dont want to overhorse myself but have gone looking at different types out of my comfort zone where theres far more chance of overhorsing myself. Yet I know im more than capable of dealing with welshie strops and sensitivities, lol. Ive also tried not to look at specific breeds to keep an open mind and not narrow my criteria further but I dont think I can say its helped!
 
Have you tried any Arabs?
I know I'm biased but...Not too big, very loyal...great bond. Will turn a hoof to anything if asked/ shown properly....usually a cheaper breed to buy because they're not everyone's cup of tea.
Most Arabs are forward and brave, not spooky idiots as people would have you believe..
 
OP, having come from a background of backing & producing M&M's as well as re-habbing TB's off the track etc.
I've had bigger horses tho over the most recent years.
Disaster with last purchase (long story; broken ankle, horse an issue - lost my confidence which I never thought would happen!!) so managed to borrow a full up native from a breeder friend, to go back 'to my roots'.
Confidence was back within a short while & am enjoying the pony & have outgrown her very careful capabilities.

However, I KNOW that if I took on something quite young or with sharp quirks, I could possibly have wobbles, which is no good for any horses confidence, particularly as I do just about everything on my own!

I am looking on & off in the ads to get my eye in for possible purchase in new year.
I have come to the conclusion that I WILL have a native or LW show-cob type as I need 14.2 to 15hh so can get on from the floor if I need to and also get rugs on & off easily with dicky shoulder. Most LW types that size will poss not be up to lugging my 10 & half+ stone weight out hunting or for long forwards-going rides etc.

Let me know when you find the proverbial.... :biggrin3: as will be wanting the same...... however, my budget is a rather more open as right horse more important than price for me.......... ho-hum - good luck! :)
 
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I have a welsh that just loves any sort of attention from anyone, so you're not being too unrealistic looking for a cuddly one. He's only 14.2 though, bit small for you. I don't know that you'll manage to find something that ticks every box, but you'll find one that you click with, and it will probably not be what you were looking for!
 
go see something that almost fits....you may be surprised!


i wanted a gelding, 16hh and not bay - - i got a mare, 15.2 and bay...but she was incredible and my real horse of a lifetime.

current donk is mean to be 16hh - shes going go be 15.2 at a very BIG push!...but shes lovely anyhow :) makes up for height with personality



so yeah - point is - think outside the box!!.... and go with gut instinct when viewing horses....both mine had that feeling about them - and i was right :)
 
I would consider a breed such as a Highland or Icelandic, as well as Arabs or New Forests. All have stamina, would cope easily with medium distance and some are quirky enough to keep you on your toes! You'd struggle to get 15hh with a couple of those breeds, but size isn't everything. ;)
 
Please don't be too put off by a horse that is perfect in every other way, but is a mare. I hope you do ring about the appy x welsh, she really does seem to tick all your other boxes. :)
 
I suspect my boy would have ticked your boxes as he's a 15hh 7yo LW Irish cob who was only broken at 5 and has done very little since so is very green. That said he was advertised at £3,500 and I eventually bought him for £2,500 but he's a lovely chap and worth every penny to me.
 
Also, don't rule out trotters (gypsy trotters/irish bog trotters, that sort of ilk). The lady I took Wolf to for our initial ridden training has taken several trotters to advanced and calls them her 'secret weapon' as they really can trot forever. You've 'just' got to try and find one that hasn't been too hammered as a baby.
 
I think you probably just need to go see things that suit the height, budget and where they seem to be in their education that seems right for you. Sure there will be some that you just don't like the look of in a picture. That's a personal thing. I don't think you should be focusing too much on whether the horse is 'cuddly'. Some horses just aren't or it takes time to build that sort of relationship so you won't know things like that for months down the line.

With your list you may be as well looking at an ex-racer to be honest as they will fit what you want to do, most are actually quite happy doing quiet work BUT have the ability to be more athletic and have the stamina if you did want to focus on endurance down the line. That or something TB x (TB x ID, TB x Welsh or TB x Connie).

Other than that, maybe just be ready for the 'click'. It could be with something you wouldn't have expected!
 
OP I lost my last Welshie last year & spent some time "not looking" at them, as I'm knocking on for 50 now & knew I didn't want to handle the attitude again!

This year I bought a 4yo 15.1 sec D, and he's brilliant, everything I wanted, but not as opinionated as my other 3 have been. I was fortunate in that I didn't have a budget, and although I spent slightly more than your budget (2.5k), that did include all his tack - so they are out there, and they're not all quirky either!
 
just for fun i had a look on horsemart...ad no HM341 160B 3yr 6mths skewbald gelding, lightly backed, laid back and calm..14.3 to make 15.2 £1800 ,.they call hima gypsy vanner but looks quite a lightweight type of cob to me...
 
chaps89 said:
I will apologise in advance for the length of this post and any typos/grammar errors as Im posting from my phone not laptop.
I have been horse hunting rather unsuccessfully since the start of the year.
My requirements are: 15hh-ish gelding. Aged between 3 and 13. Must be sound/healthy and a nice person to be around who activley likes cuddles. Ideally green/a project but nothing dangerous. To do a bit of everything with but potentially endurance long term. Budget max of £2k.
I had an interesting day yesterday viewing purpose bred endurance horses which has shown I need to re-evaluate what I want.
My riding style simply doesnt work with fast, forward going types, it never has and even if the horse is safe I lose confidence easily. Yet something backwards/nappy/green/that bucks etc I will happily ride and enjoy. I suspect this stems from riding quirky native types and my old horse was a very typical welsh. I had purposefully avoided adverts for welshes because I was wary of finding something similar to, but that will never be the same as/as good as, my old horse but I suspect now I need to go back to looking at more native types than blood types and change what I want to do and be happy doing small pleasures on a horse I enjoy, rather than having a horse who can do the longer distances but I wont even hack out at home as I dont enjoy it.
In terms of what I want to do long term, it seems difficult as I want a horse who is more than a happy hacker hacking out a few times a week but I dont even want something to do rc/affiliate on, I want something I can school and hack, do the odd cross country, bit of clear round sj, unaffiliated dressage and pleasure rides. Which seems to be a bit of an in between market! I am happy to put the work in to do this tho. I dont have the budget to go out and buy this type of horse that is already doing this sort of thing (they seem to be few and far between anyway) and I like the process of getting to that stage as much as I enjoy riding when Im there.
I have tried smaller and bigger horses and find if I go above 15.2/15.3 I just have too much horse to collect and dont enjoy it but smaller than 14.2/14.3 and I just dont feel there is anything there/ safe and secure so height isnt something I can overly compromise on.
Because I dont want something that is already doing alot, I dont really want to increase the budget. Is this where Im going wrong maybe, do I need to increase the budget do we think?
I did see a horse yesterday which the owner/breeder had said is a one on one horse and very reserved that I really seemed to click with. He is unfortunatley in all other ways totally unsuitable :s however it has reconfirmed that although all the other horse were nice and didnt mind me fussing them it is important the horse activley wants to seek out attention and enjoys it. Is this something that will come with time/building a bond with the horse? Ie, am I expecting too much for a strange horse to want to be like this with someone they dont know?
I ideally want something with reasonable conformation, my old horse had soundness issues and even if something is sound Im wary of it being pre-disposed to lameness issues in the future. But that is how long is a piece of string and maybe I need to compromise here.
Then theres level of schooling, I really get a kick out of working with difficult/quirky horses but I wouldnt consider myself even remotely able to take on a 'dangerous' horse and I dont want to bite off more than I can chew. Equally ideally something freshly backed would be ideal for me to bring on. What Im finding is that mostly horses are backed and have done quite extensive work since or they arent backed yet but may have been started. As it would be my first youngster of my own (Ive worked with many others tho) I dont want to bite off more than I can chew and have to totally back one.
Reading that back, my basic criteria becomes alot more detailed and frankly I can understand why I cant find a horse. So, can anyone offer an outside opinion/ a fresh way of looking at the situation to find a horse I enjoy again please? Or equally, where on earth do you look/find the above horse?!
I miss having a horse to spend time with as much as riding and I am lucky that I have friends horses to ride and play with until I find something but I do miss having something of my own and I am very aware it will take time to build a bond and get to where I want.
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i wouldnt say you are looking for the impossible, i suspect my lad would have ticked all your boxes he 4 year old irish cob schooling nicely just a bit green, hacks alone or in company, pops a jump, sane sensible and very very very cuddly absolutely loves human interaction, no treats required just lots of kisses haha! took me 3 months to find him and i paid £2000 for him so the are out there hun :)
 
Why not put advert on EGB website, or if you can do a summary in far fewer words of what you are looking for I can post on EGB forum for you. There may be a member looking to sell a horse as it hasn't the ability for longer distances (by that I mean 80km+ so fine for PR), or they know someone who has a horse the type your looking for.

Also try the EGB south east & mid-south websites for classifieds in your area.

From sound of it think you may try looking for Connie. Neighbour has one for sale but 3k unfortunately, shame as wonderful horse they've had since baby but daughter totally outgrown.
 
I don't think you are looking for the impossible - I was after something pretty similar myself (though prefer a mare and don't mind about the cuddles/friendliness so long as I am not being actively attacked!) - I had 2.5 K and looked at lots that were almost right. My eventual purchase has turned out better at dressage and less brilliant at hacking (Though not dangerous or anything nasty I would say she does not love it) but you go with their strengths. This horse was very headshy when purchased but is now gently friendly in a rather nice way and does love a good neck scratch now and again. So yes I think you can find this type easily enough on your budget.
Good luck
 
I agree with whoever said previously to look at anything vaguely appropriate. When I was younger I was looking for a 14.2 gelding for show jumping. Went to a yard to try one and ended up with a 15.1 eventing mare! She was brilliant, until I outgrew her. Sometimes you don't realise what you actually want until its in front of you! (Not very helpful I know!) Don't be afraid of trying something new. Good luck, your horse is out there and will find you :)
 
chaps89 said:
Pigeon - I have looked at lots of different types, mostly younger, some older, slender, chunkier and fizzy and ploddy, that have been vaguely appropriate. Fully take on board the point about building a bond. Im more of a gelding person :( that said in all other ways she seems nice so Im sure a phonecall wont hurt so thankyou :)
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So am I, but there are a couple of mares in my life that have stood head and shoulders above all others, one now sadly passed away and if the other came up for sale I would seriously save my pennies. I can't think of any geldings that I could say the same thing about. I hate mareish mares, or temperamental mares, but a good mare is smart and tuned in, moreso than a gelding - definitely don't rule one out just on gender :)
 
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