Am I looking for the impossible here?

[Eleanor2003]

Hi- Ive posted here once before and found it increadibly useful! So Im going to try again

In order for there not to be more questions than answers, I thought I should probably fill you in on all relevant context

Context:
I am a 16 yo, 5'6 girl who has ridden since she was 4 in the riding school. At age 11, I then finally got my first pony (14.1 Connie 6yo) and both I and the pony were both taught the basics of dressage by an Ex-Grand Prix rider (she must be in her 80's and she was taught dressage by my grandfather!) . The pony was taught how to work and ride nicely/correctly and I was taught how to hold a contact and how to alter my riding-school ways. After I grew out of him, I went back to riding school horses ( I only rode ones that could hold a decent contact as I found it incredibly annoying how hollow they felt if they didn't!) before I then went to boarding school. I then found a riding school which had a horse that could do a bit more dressage that I was doing at the time and was taught by an AMAZING instructor who has taught me all the lateral work I know from shoulder- fore to half pass and walk pirouette. I have done this all on a 12yo 16.2 ID who has now been my partner in crime for 2 years. My mum has had 3 horses and 2 ponies of her own but had a whole team around her and her family revolved around hunting. She still owns a 28 yo 16.3 1/3 ID who she has had from 5yo.

So- now for the important bit! After much thought, my instructor suggested getting my own horse as having an hour lesson twice a week is no longer enough for me and I need a horse that can take my dressage education further and doesn't have EVERYONE (from the disabled children who forget to hold the reins to the likes of me) riding him. I've also found that by not having control of feed, exercise regime and tack manipulation eg. if I think he would work better with a different bit, I can't compete at my best and as this is becoming more of an interest, its been decided as a group that I should look into getting a horse. he would live at a quiet full livery yard and I would have my instructor with me anytime I rode (until I got the hang of it) and I would have other trusted riders on hand if I got stuck.

So this is what I was hopefully looking for (although a schoolmaster would be ideal, we just can't seem to find one!)

8yo+
ID/ weight carrier type
Gelding - I don't get on with mares!
16.1- 16.3hh
Some dressage background or has been competing in showing
up to £10000
sane, sensible, sound
no vices

Even though I am a complete dressage nerd, I wouldn't say I was brave and find that I am very nervous with new horses so I do find that "dressage" and "nervous" tend to clash when it comes up to looking for horses! Although saying this, at the last viewing I went to the lady said she thought I was going to be more of a nervous rider than I actually was so maybe I'm making too much of a fuss about it? So my questions to you are:

- Am I looking for the right thing?
-If I am, where do you find them? because HoreQuest and Horsemart aren't helping at all and the dressage horse sites I've found all have sharp, spindly-legged, over £10000 horses
-If I am not, what do you suggest I look for?

I am based in Lincolnshire so if you know of anybody who would be useful for me to get in contact with, I would be highly grateful!

 

[Red-1]

I think you may find a lovely horse that has been in a SJ background. Many are beautifully bred, have nice paces, and have been out and about with riders who ride forward, in busy collecting rings etc. They also seem cheaper than dressage ones!

My mare would have suited you. She is not for sale, and is a mare (!) but would have been in your other specs (maybe 2 inches smaller). She was being sold as an eventer though. Doesn't mean she can't do dressage, lateral work was already well on and she was still 4 (rising 5) when she came, with a handful of BDs, one BS and one BE under her belt.

So, I would look at SJers and eventers too, rather than pure dressage horses.

 

[P.forpony]

My suggestion at this point would be to delegate.

It sounds like you have thought everything through very sensibly and are ready to progress.

You have a good budget for your requirements but aren’t used to horse shopping and its a very tricky thing at the best of times.

Find someone you trust and approach them to start looking for you. Be aware that a good professional eg. Your instructor would need to be paid for their time, but the price would be tiny compared to ending up with the wrong horse.
Word of mouth is important for finding good horses, lots of them never get advertised so someone in the industry who can ask around may get you better results.

And good luck with your search!

 

[madamebonnie]

I would also look at eventers. If it's been out and about at busy comps as Red-1 says they should be pretty good to handle and ride.

You don't need a dressage bred horse to enjoy dressage. There's plenty examples on here but my horse is a fairly ordinary irish sports horse and we're looking to make our medium debut soon!

 

[FestiveFuzz]

Whilst I don’t disagree an eventer could fit your remit, some of them don’t transition well to a life between the white boards. Obviously any horse can sour without variation, but I’ve seen a few eventers that seemed to go off the boil without a healthy mix of jumping and faster work thrown in.

In your shoes as a dressage nerd I’d be looking for an older schoolmaster type that’ll teach you all they know and you can go out and have fun with.

I got an AM dressage horse who had been schooled up to PSG at home some 4 years ago now and the difference in my riding is incredible. He’s really taught me to ride well, and it’s so much easier to learn feel when the horse is correct in the first place. It hasn’t always been plain sailing, there was a long period of time at the beginning where we couldn’t canter on the correct lead without changes as I wasn’t keeping myself straight and weight balanced and he was picking up the nuances of my seat (including an incredible lesson where I accidentally pulled off a string of tempi changes) but I’ve had so much fun over the years learning from him and it’s been so rewarding.

 

[jnb]

I would suggest you look at retired or ring-sour show Hunters; most are schooled well (Louise Bell and Into the Blue for instance, competed at Show Hunter and Working Hunter, before going on to GP Dressage)
Or...a retired show cob if you want a true weight carrier. I highly doubt you would get to GP with one, but many move very well and are eminently capable of Elementary level.

 

[FestiveFuzz]

Now I’m caffeinated I should add that if you do go down the older schoolmaster route I’d be prepared to have some money set aside for the general maintenance that comes with having a higher mileage horse.

People are often surprised when they find out my boy is 17 as he acts and looks a lot younger, but this has been down to careful management (and a large dose of help from my trainer!) to ensure he remains supple and happy in his work.

 

[Horses 123]

I think your best bet would be to, as previously said, ask around and see if there are any horses for sale by word of mouth. Even though you are experienced, a good thing would be to see if there are any decent riding school horses for sale, for something a bit more sensible - you'd be surprised at the quality they have sometimes! That would build your confidence up until you are ready to maybe even get another one, that would take you further up the levels. Always put safety first, no matter how talented a horse may seem - and enjoy the journey! Have fun with your new addition!

 

[DabDab]

Lots of good suggestions above. The only thing I would add is that the fact you want quite a substantial horse will be limiting you slightly. Unfortunately 16.2hh, weight carrying horses do tend to command a premium, particularly if they are also very sensible and well schooled. And there are also relatively few of them about. If it is possible for you to open up your spec on size of horse you will probably find a lot more to look at.

 

[Muckymummy]

Tbh you can have unlimited budget and still make sacrifices. Although you say you need something that has has the ability. Any horse can go on the bit and you will find the good school masters will find every fault in you so just be prepared for that. These top horses are high maintenance so are you willing to sacrifice. Do you have the support for shows etc. Personally I think you'd be surprise how much of a change a riding school horse is to a top comp horse. I would definitely get a proper dressage coach that would let you sit on a more advanced horse and see is this really what you want. I'm not trying to be negative but they really are worlds apart and one is not easier than the other. Just different challenges

 

[oldie48]

Why not widen your scope, at 5'6" you don't need a 16.1+ and you might find something smaller with a bit of bone suits you well. I'd go for a nice temperament that will hack, decent conformation and one that has been taught the basics properly. I've also looked at ex show horses but found you need to be careful as sometimes they have not been taught to work correctly through and that can be a pain to change. Schoolmasters can be great but nice ones are often very expensive and quite challenging to ride as it's easy to confuse them, they often also know all the tricks and will suss out a less experienced rider very quickly. Good luck, I hope you find a lovely partner!

 

[Meowy Catkin]

16 years old and already sexist towards mares.

Stop telling yourself that you 'don't get on with mares' and try to appreciate each horse as an individual. You open up the number of potential horses by including mares in your search.

 

[Eleanor2003]

Tbh you can have unlimited budget and still make sacrifices. Although you say you need something that has has the ability. Any horse can go on the bit and you will find the good school masters will find every fault in you so just be prepared for that. These top horses are high maintenance so are you willing to sacrifice. Do you have the support for shows etc. Personally I think you'd be surprise how much of a change a riding school horse is to a top comp horse. I would definitely get a proper dressage coach that would let you sit on a more advanced horse and see is this really what you want. I'm not trying to be negative but they really are worlds apart and one is not easier than the other. Just different challenges

In my shop for a horse I actually found a KPWN that was doing advanced medium and was very lucky to have a sit on it! I found I got used to the bigger movement quite quickly, unfortunately, he had some BIG health issues for the non negotiable price of £10000 without tack ? I’m not looking for something that will take me up to GP or is a ‘top competition horse’ but something that has had the basics of the contact, carrying himself and could take me up to medium would be nice! I 100% agree I need something quiet. I’ve found that trying to find something that has a descent amount of bone and carries themselves/working correctly is quite difficult!

 

[Muckymummy]

In my shop for a horse I actually found a KPWN that was doing advanced medium and was very lucky to have a sit on it! I found I got used to the bigger movement quite quickly, unfortunately, he had some BIG health issues for the non negotiable price of £10000 without tack ? I’m not looking for something that will take me up to GP or is a ‘top competition horse’ but something that has had the basics of the contact, carrying himself and could take me up to medium would be nice! I 100% agree I need something quiet. I’ve found that trying to find something that has a descent amount of bone and carries themselves/working correctly is quite difficult!

Don't even go there with me horse shopping is not fun anymore... Half the horse I looked at were lame.... Now I have a nice two year old with a bit of bone not too much and I have everything crossed she will be my forever horse