Am I mad or are people lazy (sorry long!)

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speednut

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I keep my eventer at a super DIY yard. I work shifts but still manage to go up to the yard twice a day as I believe you should if you own a horse.

I fit him in like this -
Early shift 7-5, get up at 5am, drive to yard, horse on walker, muck out, feeds/water/hay, rug up and turn out (in dark in winter) quick change and leave yard at 6.20 to get to work at 6.50. After work bring in, ride, put to bed.

Late shift 2-12, go to yard about 7am, muck out, ride, turn out, go home to do some housework. Back at yard 12.30 to get in groom and rug up, change and get to work for 1350. A kind friend feeds him when I'm on lates.

Night shift 2300-0700 - go to yard straight from night shift muck out, ride, turn out then home for some sleep. Back at yard for about 1600 to bring in, groom, rug up feed etc. I have been known to go eventing straight from nightshift!!

The yard owner will help out if people write it in the book but the only help I have from her is she will bring him in once the clocks go back when I am on days as it is dark when I finish. As I cannot guarantee finishing work on time she occasionally gets a panic phone call to feed or bring in.

As horse is my responsibility I feel strongly that I should not rely on others to look after him for me.

Other people on the yard are really starting to annoy me and need to start taking responsibility for their horses.

Livery 1 lives nearer yard than me and has office job not starting until 9am. Doesn't bother coming up in morning. YO changes rugs and turns out both ponies and brings in again into dirty beds. At weekends turns up about lunchtime, kids ride, dad mucks out, leaves loads of mess and feeds and goes by 3pm.

Livery 2 again office job YO turns out both her horses havng changed rugs and put boots on, mucks out 3 days a week, then brings in, changes rugs, and remove boots. Owner turns up and rides a few evenings a week. Weekends is as livery 1.

Livery 3 - horse broke fetlock and is crippled, box walks for england and won't stay in field longer than 2 hours. Owner turns up 3 mornings a week but YO has to turn out and bring in everyday and often gets message to muck out when owner can't be bothered to turn up.

I know it is up to YO to say no and not do all the extras but is appears to me that people can't be bothered to look after their horses properly and are taking the p***.
I manage and work far longer shifts than any of the others, I would feel so guilty if I had to ask someone to muck out my horse just because I was going to work.
Am I the one in the wrong or do these people need to get a grip?
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These people need to get a grip. I'm 14 and I still go and do my horse monday - friday at 6am rain or shine and weekends and holidays at about 8am. I do my mucking out, haynets, water turnout etc. and the yard only brings her in at lunchtime because all the horses have to come in together and I'm at school. Seven days a week I go back at 4pm or after school and ride and skip out etc. I can't even drive or ride a scooter but I still manage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Does the YO get paid for doing these 'extras' and does she mind doing it? If she offers assisted DIY livery on her yard then I don't see the harm in people using the services she is offering! As long as she is reliable and trustworthy does it matter whether she turns the horses out in the morning or the owners do!

I agree there are some stable chores that can help you bond with your horse, but the horse doesn't give a monkeys who mucks it out as long as it is done properly! If someone wants to pay the YO to muck out her horse I can't see a problem with that!
 
Please let's keep the Christmas spirit - yes I know it's early but everyone wants to feel jolly and get in the peace and goodwill vibe today it seems - and not start this moaning up again. It is up to everyone how much time they allocate to their horses and, so long as someone is responsible for the horse's welfare, it reallly shouldn't be any concern of yours should it? Like I said on the other thread, looking after your horse is not a competetive sport so let's not pretend that it is please. And so said Tiny Tim etc, etc.
 
I can see your point, however my horse is on full livery 5 days a week. I work 7-6 everyday, my yard is 25 mins from my house, plus I have a dog that needs to be walked before and after work. I also have an extremely stressful job and everything combined with house work etc is just too much I'm afraid.
I used to do mainly DIY however my horse is happier in his routine now, he's not one that would be happy to be turned out for long periods, so this way he gets to go out about 8.30 and come in to a clean bed between 2.30 and 3 during the summer. This time of year things change and he is in by lunchtime, which again I couldn't do.
My main concern is that my horse is happy and content and the arrangement I have now means that he is far happier than if I killed myself trying to do everything.
I think it has to be each to their own.
 
I work 8.30-5, my horse is on asisted DIY livery about a 5 min walk from my house. My work is an hours drive from home. I have her fed and turned out in the morning as part of my livery and pay the YO to bring in as I simply cannot get there in time to get her in during the week.

People have different lives, if the horses are fed and happy what does it matter if you get someone else to do it or not?
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While I admire your dedication I simply want to enjoy the time I have with my horse rather than running myself ragged and making mine and my family's life a misery by being exhausted! If people can't be bothered to ride or have no interest in their horse then I think that is sad, but they are the ones pouring their money down the drain and as long as the horse doesn't suffer where is the harm? There is more than one way to skin a cat!
 
Ditto Tia.


Some people like to see their horse every morning, but for some, it will cost them more in petrol just to get there than it will cost to pay YO to do it, and as long as the horse is being cared for, who cares!
 
no BUT you enjoy looking after your horse, where as some folks just don't like work or don't mind paying someone else to do..............

it sounds like your just a busy person..... or just plan very well
 
I see from your previous post that the YO charges just £1 to turn out/bring in, well to be honest the petrol to drive there and back for some folk is probably more than that!
Don't forget your YO also relys on those £1's, if she is getting £10 a day that adds up to a tidy amount over a week .
I think it's good you do your horse yourself, when I was a DIY livery I too joined the 5am get changed hurtle into work brigade and I know it's tiring, but not everyone has to agree with your ways, and although a lot of people don't keep high standards you have to bite your lip and get on with your own horse unless you genuinely feel they are suffering.
I would just keep my head down and get on with your own horse, they probably mutter about you being obsessive...
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<font color="peru">As long as it isn't inconveniencing people (who aren't being paid to do it), and the horse's welfare is not suffering, I don't see a problem with it. It could be they have private home commitments you don't know about that renders them unable to come down early in the morning. Or they could simply like a lie-in.

When I loaned Tequila, her owner would check her and feed her for me in the mornings. She would be down there doing all the others anyway (private land and only 1 DIY livery and 1 full, the rest are hers), and I had to be on a bus to college at 7.45 every morning, and don't drive (it takes approx 45mins to walk to the horses, or about 20 on a bike but up massive hills). Teq didn't care as long as she was fed, I trusted her owner completely to make sure she was ok, and it meant I didn't put additional pressure on myself during my A levels. In return, I'd help her with the others in the evenings/weekends. It just seems sensible to me.

TNN
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speednut - what do you think about people who are on FULL livery? Should they not own horses? What about people who only get to see their horses of a weekend? Sorry but I do not think these people on your yard are lazy, I just think they time manage their days differently. If my YO only charged £1 to turn out then hell, I would let her do it for me EVERY day!
 
I only see the horse I ride at weekends as she is in Scotland and I work in London Mon-Friday, I really wouldn't like to know what you think of me LOL.
I guess I might be let off as it isn't my horse
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Not everyone can be perfect
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sorry-nothign wrong with most of that as to when they come up etc- in fact it's not really any of your business!
Some would say your horse doesn't get a routine, but that's nobody's business is it?
 
I only take full liveries at my yard, because that way I know the horses are all being done properly, are in a routine, and I don't have people coming and going at all hours. My owners pay for the service, and get to enjoy their horses as and when they are able to - and probably get more "quality time" with them as a result. Personally it wouldn't suit me to have someone doing all that for my horse, but this is my life and that is theirs.

I honestly don't see a problem if the horses are being looked after properly and the YO is getting paid for doing their job.
 
as long as the horse's welfare doesn't suffer, i don't think it matters much who does it. if you're happy with your system, great. i don't agree with lazy owners who ponies come in to dirty beds, but that's the YO's fault, she should tell them it's not on.
in some ways you're making a rod for your own back, as i used to. for e.g. i used to feed my horses at 7.15 am all year round. since i haven't competed for a while, i very gradually let it slide to 8.15, since there's no early starts for shows to make me keep it early. it's much more civilised for me, and i'm sure the horses are fine (mostly out in fields with ad lib hay anyway, so not standing there starving waiting for me!) i felt guilty for a while, but what the heck... they're my horses, it suits them, they're fine, so be it!
 
You are not mad, I do everthing myself because I like the way I do things. However I have a very talanted well to do friend who would not touch a mucking out fork for fear of breaking a nail. Her horse is on full livery, and when its 5 in the morning and I am taking two horses up to the field in mud and rain I do sometimes think to myself maybe she has the right idea. Each to there own I find with the horse world its always best to do your own thing and not worry what other folk get up to. Both my friends horses and mine are happy the only difference is she looks a million dollers and well me a wreck !
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Me and OH both work 6.30am - 5.30pm mon - fri so my ex takes the girls to the yard to ride on mon,tue,wed on thursday we go after work to muck out etc and on fri my friend who has a horse there takes them up for me so they can ride etc , weekends are spent either at shows or pony clubbing, he is turned out every morning by YO and it works like clockwork for us and our pony is fit, happy and healthy which at the end of the day is the most important thing(well to me anyway), good for you doing what you do you deserve a medal! but some of us find work , kids and housework have to fit in round the horse/pony as well
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I can see that you are a totally dedicated, extremely hard-working owner.

I believe (as you will see in my other thread) that owners should have a certain level of experience/knowledge BEFORE owning a horse.

But, I do believe it is up to the owner what kind of livery will suit them. As long as the YO is performing the duties they are paid to do, and the owner has an idea of how the horse is being managed (and much input into it) - I believe the horse is ultimately the owner's responsibility - I don't see the problem with YO and staff managing the horse if on part or full livery. I believe all key decisions should lie with the owner, but as for mucking out, filling haynets etc I am sure the horse doesn't care who does it.

It is important to have a bond with your horse but there is nothing to say that this can't be maintained over evenings/weekends. While we would all love to spend as much time with our horse as poss sometimes other commitments get in the way. It may be that you don't have a full understanding of why these other liveries are acting the way they are? What other commitments are in their lives? In any case, it is their choice which type of livery to be on.

I put my horse on full livery because I only ever had time to muck out, rug up, groom etc outside of work hrs. Thus he did not get enough exercise and was very frustrated. Now he is in full livery I oversee everything that is done with him, but I can exercise more rather than mucking out which is really not spending time with my horse.....
 
I agree with some of what you have said but not everything. Just because someone owns a horse it does not mean they have to muck out, turn out etc. Yes the horse is their responsibility but it doesnt mean they arent a responsible owner if they pay someone else to do it.

At the moment im working mon-fri and have to leave for work at 7:00 and dont get back into the house until about 7ish. If I was to turn my horse out myself on a morning I would be knackered. My horse would be out on her own which she wouldnt like and so it is far easier for the YO to turn her out. My YO also lives on site and it wouldnt be fair on her. I also believe it wouldnt be fair on my horse as she too needs her sleep.

When I move to shifts next year my horse will be going on full livery. Its not because I dont want to look after her because I , and I love it. I dont want the worry of having to rush back or panicking because I have to work over and I cant get to do my horse. My horse will be in a routine and I will still see her everyday. She doesnt care who mucks her out, its only me.
 
I'm on full livery during the week. As much as I would love to be able to go up there twice a day and do it all myself I'm well aware I couldn't. I'm not a morning person and if i had to get up at 5 every day I would be no use at work by the time lunchtime came. I also can't commit to not having to work overtime sometimes and that wouldn't be fair on my horse if one evening I didn't turn up for 2 hours. I still go every evening anyway just to say hello. It also means I've got more time to ride, and to fit other stuff in.

Also my yard's sneakily put up the prices of part livery so that it actually works out cheaper to have full livery during the week if there's more than once a month I can't make it down!
 
God I must be really bad then!!! I only see my horse on a weekend in the winter and sometimes not even that if I'm away!
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My mum looks after him, which I guess is better in that I know he will be well looked after but worse in that I can get her to do more stuff!
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I don't think it is fair to say that anyone who doesn't do everything for their own horse is lazy - as long as they have an agreement with YO or whoever - what has it got to do with you??
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I kind of keep my horse at home but in a proff yard...
i live probably 100m from my horse but the YO feeds and turns out my horse in the moring after changing rugs, and when i come home from school (around 4pm) i bring in from field, muck out whilst hes standing, then quick groom all over (20 mins) and then i leave him for another 5mins whilst i put hay in the stable and quick tidy up around the yard.
then i ride and cool him off and in he goes and then gets fed!

for the morning if i know its going to be bad weather i leave a haynet outside his door for the YO to put up when shes feeding him. if its good i leave his outdoor rug nearby so is easily accessible.

but i know my routine is very unique as the YO is also close friend and my horse is kept in stables built on my land joining on to her yard
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and she uses the extra stable that i dont use... she dosent get paid for the extras and the total i pay a week is approx. £20, which covers feed (he gets 4 scoops a day :O), shavings, hay and general bills like elecetricity for arena and general upkeep etc.

but in the morning i get my bus at 8am...
 
Firstly - I would much rather my horse had a regular routine and was turned out/fed with the others on the yard, than have him messed around everyday. Therefore I pay my YO to t/o in the mornings, as I start work at 7am, which is the time when all the horses on the yard get sorted out.

I muck out and groom every day, and ride most days - I'm sure my horse doesn't care who puts him in the field!!!

Secondly - the YO is being paid for her services, what's the problem?

The whole "I get up at 5am to muck out therefore I am a better horse owner than you" brigade gets on my nerves much more than people who genuinely love their horses, but can't spend every spare moment of the day with them.
 
When we had a yard we used to charge £1 to put a horse out in the morning. Most liveries took us up on it as they could see the benefit. 1 livery didn't and her poor horse used to get chucked out in the field at 5 am when she got there and would sit neighing it's head off all miserable until the others got turned out at 7.

Now who's not a good horse owner?
 
I have to say turning horses out at the same time every day is generally thought of as more important than what that actual time is. You know, the theory being that horses like routine - they like to be let out and brought in at exactly the same time each day.
 
I really hate your attitude - in fact its this attitude thats made me move from some yards in the past.

The kind of people who think that they're the best owners ever and if you're not getting up at 5am and killing yourself for your horse then you're not a good owner, or you're neglecting your horse.

If people pay for the horse to be cared for by the YO, who gives a damn? Horse is still cared for, gets a regular routine, makes their life easier.
 
I would be interested to hear what other commitments you have, besides house, or do you have a cleaner? Children? other pets?

Quite frankly I would rather pay to ensure my horses were done in the morning than run myself into the ground, running around like a headless chicken.....

Yes you are obviously a very caring owner, but dont look down on people who pay someone for a service!
 
I guess it all depends on perspective.

Where I come fom DIY is almost unheard of for a number of reasons. One is that almost anyone who lives/works in the city is at least 3/4 hour's drive from their horse. Going up twice a day is impossible - not to mention prohibitively expensive - especially for anyone with kids or a demanding job.

And then there is traffic which can make ruin the schedule completely, meaning horses would be standing in or out, possibly unfed, for any amount of time. THIS is seen as unacceptably negligable by most people and the general concensus is that routine and consistency are more important to the horses' well being than than the "personal" touch.

Perhaps some of that is weather related - with a harsher climate it can be a great deal more brutal for a horse to get stuck outside in the heat or the cold or the bugs. Even in 24/7 turnout situation having someone attend to horses in the daylight hours is seen as a necessary safety and management concern.

Of course people who have horses at home have to compromise somewhat but often they do that by boarding out in the winter months!

It's generally seen as essential horses get handled and fed at the same time so that horses never get left alone in a field if they can't cope, say, and so someone in authority knows what's going on should there be a problem. Generally vet and blacksmiths come during business hours and it seen as preferable if these things get attended to promptly, rather than waiting 'till the owner has time (or inclination). I've known more than one barn owner make a deal for a boarder to bring his/her own feed, say, and then get frustrated when life gets in the way of regular delivery.

I had event horses running at one point when I lived in the city and had to go up 2x a day to ride them sufficiently. I also traded off barn work with the owner of the farm so HE could get a break. I was happy to do it, knew it needed to be done but it also meant for those years I did almost nothing else. For many people, especially with complicated adult lives this is not realistic. Nor is making them feel guilty about it seen as being very productive.
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Generally people who save on their horses' care (at least for urban owners) by trying to do things themselves when they would be better off paying someone else (maybe a professional!) are seen as the people scrimping on their horse's best interests. I'm not saying this in any more fair a generalisation, just that it's an interesting difference of opinion.
 
Speednut - This way works for you!
It obviously doesnt work for others, so continue doing what you are doing, and unless a horse is being neglected, dont get involved.
Many people for the reasons stated in the rest of this post cannot be at the yard twice a day, and some people dont want to.
Surely the horse is going to be better off have say an hour of quality time with its owner, than be rushed about?
Chill, there are far more important things to get stressed about, and i doubt you have an extra time to worry about what other people are doing!
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