American Horse Shopping explained with video.

BunnyDog

BunnyDog

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So you guys know the deal from what I've said about how it worked with coming to buy Cudo. But a thread came up on my home forum board today that highlights perfectly what the typical American (in this case in California) is dealing with when wanting to buy a jumper with a decent budget. Pay attention to the disclosed prices for the animals in the videos given their skill levels.

https://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/...ideos-jumper-prospects-tell-me-what-you-think

Emily
 
Gosh - that does make depressing viewing. I’d not look twice at any of those horses, even at bargain basement price. I was surprised to see the second horse had allegedly been imported from Germany having done some dressage...
I know half a dozen horses well within that price range that are sounder, better produced and have more quality without having to look outside my contacts/friendship group.
Horse shopping Is a nightmare anywhere, but I can see why you came to the UK!
 
I didn't see the prices, but I did agree with the comments. I liked the second one, the chestnut best (but then I like a chestnut), but he looked the nicest overall. Didn't really like the first and the third one was tilting his head although he was the strongest, probably done a bit more. If looking specifically for a jumper I think I would have liked to see them jump, even if loose schooled, rather than potter over a few schooling fences.

Thanks for that!
 
The main question I have is does no one train their own horse over there? Why do you have to have it in a Programme with a professional trainer?

Given those prices for questionably sound horses I really don’t see why more don’t come over here for it. You can get what she is looking for for a 3rd of that price! And it will be far better schooled than any of those horses! Heck none of those would look out of place at a low level unaffiliated riding club over here!
 
Orangehorse said:
I didn't see the prices, but I did agree with the comments. I liked the second one, the chestnut best (but then I like a chestnut), but he looked the nicest overall. Didn't really like the first and the third one was tilting his head although he was the strongest, probably done a bit more. If looking specifically for a jumper I think I would have liked to see them jump, even if loose schooled, rather than potter over a few schooling fences.

Thanks for that!
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Between $35k and $45k apparently
 
i didnt like any of them, the chestnut seemed the best of a bad lot. i thought horse A looked like he could have had a bit of acp or similar..i cant believe those prices. Cudo is so much better than any of them, you did the right thing coming over here, hope you are getting on ok with him...keep us updated please
 
For this rider I would do horse no 2, the chestnut.

To be fair to the horses the rider was inconsistent in the contact, and tipping the weight forward, it would have been interesting to see them with the more professional riders aboard.

The first horse was just too much horse for this rider.

The second two looked really kind and well trained to me. The rider was just enjoying the ride and not doing a deal to help and balance them.

Not that there was anything wrong with this rider, she was calm and kind, but not perhaps allowing the horses to show what they were truly capable of.

Of course they are more expensive than here, but finding horses here that would quietly and calmly pop round a few fences from canter with a passive rider would be hard too.
 
None of them seemed to me to be what the lady is looking for and all are well overpriced. But taking into account what seems to be her level of experience, it could be that she lacks the confidence and/or skill to shop abroad without the help of a good, and more importantly, honest agent who can match horse and rider well.

Possible job opening Emily ?? :)
 
American prices have always been crazy though? I used to go there a lot as a child and remember looking through the horse for sale ads thinking they were all a rip off! Over there though, they seem to have much lower aspirations than here in general - a horse thats jumping 1m courses seems to be worth a fortune as perhaps thats what most amateurs are happy with, whereas in the UK we all generally expect most horses to be easily doing this just for a simple RC horse.

I quite liked the first one, he looked nice natured but not for anything remotely like those prices. He looked like a nice safe RC horse.
 
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Interesting thread, I know a few folk who have in the past made big money by selling their "trained" show jumpers and eventers to the USA for sale, but I was led to believe that market has dried up a bit as Americans were coming over here themselves (New Zealand) and doing their own shopping, or agents were coming shopping on an owners behalf or else buying young OTTB's with potential to take back, school and sell on.

Is there a shortage of horses in the USA to command these crazy prices?

I thought the horses all looked very ordinary. For that sort of money here you would get something special with a decent set of results.
 
Red-1 said:
For this rider I would do horse no 2, the chestnut.

Not that there was anything wrong with this rider, she was calm and kind, but not perhaps allowing the horses to show what they were truly capable of.
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Having read the thread only B was ridden by the buyer.

When my sister in VA was looking at dressage horses to buy I told her to come here. Even with all the import costs a much better quality and trained Horse could be bought here or in Ireland. I looked at all the videos she sent me and really there was nothing much for 20-30,000 dollars that I’d look at twice and that was before the value of the pound dropped.
 
Emily it's not sound, is it? Dragging both back toes badly, left even worse than right. Hopping occasionally on the back end too?
 
BunnyDog said:
Just as an update we heard from the poster today. She had an additional ride on the A horse again and is going to get him vetted.

Not many of us can believe it.

Here's the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuGXqZbTW8I&feature=youtu.be


Emily
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I would be quite concerned that he had been sedated, the "fifth leg" dingle dangling is a bit of a giveaway. I would also question his fitness (soundless) he is not moving as he should.

Did you say this was the owner? The rider looks very tentative.

ETA - Of course, I do not know the horse or owners, and they are probably very honest, but if a horse moved like that and had a dangly 5th leg it is certainly something I would query with the vet!
 
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ycbm said:
Emily it's not sound, is it? Dragging both back toes badly, left even worse than right. Hopping occasionally on the back end too?
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Dunno, but it looks doped! Can hardly move out of it's own way, and she's certainly not riding it at all.

Oops, I see Red-1 is on it already ^^^
 
Sorry. Got my video links confused....

Here's the new link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_lL62JulEE&feature=youtu.be

The rider is the potential buyer.

We had discussed the 'dangly bits' quite a bit and us far more cynical Americans were all out saying... "We think think it's been drugged."

That seems not to have put her off though. Quite a number of my friends are believing it likely that the trainer may have made a deal with the seller. The price is high even for California. And the horse is so green for a 7 yr old.

I would not say he's sound no.

Em
 
BunnyDog said:
Sorry. Got my video links confused....

Here's the new link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_lL62JulEE&feature=youtu.be

The rider is the potential buyer.

We had discussed the 'dangly bits' quite a bit and us far more cynical Americans were all out saying... "We think think it's been drugged."

That seems not to have put her off though. Quite a number of my friends are believing it likely that the trainer may have made a deal with the seller. The price is high even for California. And the horse is so green for a 7 yr old.

I would not say he's sound no.

Em
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He is more awake in this one, but I would still say his undercarriage was still more relaxed that normal.

I would doubt he would pass a vet.

I think the lady will find she is over-horsed with an explosive horse.

If I were advising the lady we would buy an intermediate horse, as in one to get her more mileage but that would not compete 1.30. I think she would have a lot more fun with one to kick on round 1m courses and to learn to ride the horse forward onto a contact.

If she insisted on this horse I would want her to ride it on the day of the vetting to make sure the 'ride' was the same, and have the bloods taken and stored. I suspect on vetting day he may be somewhat unsettled. ;)
 
I suspect she will find the jumping a bit of a challenge - it looked fairly onward bound at times when the buyer was riding - I suspect the bucking that we saw with the trainer is not unusual. But time will tel..
 
VRIN said:
I suspect she will find the jumping a bit of a challenge - it looked fairly onward bound at times when the buyer was riding - I suspect the bucking that we saw with the trainer is not unusual. But time will tel..
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Every time it actually used itself over a fence it bucked, when restricted and not allowed to move forward, most of the time with both riders, it didn't but as the fences go up I suspect it will be far too much for her and may explain why it appeared to be sedated in the first video, the buyer seems to love him judging by the fussing after it managed to get to the other side of the tiny fences so as she obviously has more money than sense she will probably live to regret it.

I certainly think the trainer is getting a nice present out of it as there is no way I would advise the purchase if she were a client of mine it is far too green, doesn't look sound and is not likely to carry her round a course unless doping is allowed in competition.
 
be positive said:
Every time it actually used itself over a fence it bucked, when restricted and not allowed to move forward, most of the time with both riders, it didn't but as the fences go up I suspect it will be far too much for her and may explain why it appeared to be sedated in the first video, the buyer seems to love him judging by the fussing after it managed to get to the other side of the tiny fences so as she obviously has more money than sense she will probably live to regret it.

I certainly think the trainer is getting a nice present out of it as there is no way I would advise the purchase if she were a client of mine it is far too green, doesn't look sound and is not likely to carry her round a course unless doping is allowed in competition.
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I got the sense that the rider was not the most confident of riders but from the patting was feeling 'safe' with the horse which I suspect is what is motivating her to buy it. Presumably she is keen to buy but feels she has limited choices. Think as said before there is a definite business opportunity there!
 
VRIN said:
I got the sense that the rider was not the most confident of riders but from the patting was feeling 'safe' with the horse which I suspect is what is motivating her to buy it. Presumably she is keen to buy but feels she has limited choices. Think as said before there is a definite business opportunity there!
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I agree she thought she felt safe and from the sound of things there are very limited choices in the US, when they have to jump 1.30 it is never going to be easy to find something for a rider that lacks confidence and should really be looking for a nice schoolmaster to pop round 80-90 for a few years, which is what we would buy over here and then move on if ready.
 
be positive said:
I agree she thought she felt safe and from the sound of things there are very limited choices in the US, when they have to jump 1.30 it is never going to be easy to find something for a rider that lacks confidence and should really be looking for a nice schoolmaster to pop round 80-90 for a few years, which is what we would buy over here and then move on if ready.
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If she is looking to find something that can jump 1.30, this is a very poor choice -it is not proven at this height and I don't think there has been any evidence to suggest it has the potential???
 
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