anaphylactic shock - help

E

ew1801

Well-Known Member
Joined
12 August 2010
Messages
389
Visit site
my old mare suffers with laryngeal hemiplegia and her breathing has been suffering latley. in the stable she is apsolutly fine but when she gets turned out her breathing gets progessivly worse during the day. she will come in at night heaving quite heavily and it takes her around about 30 mins for her breathing to settle ten shes fine.
I got the vet out to see if there was anything that could be done to help her. the vet said that she had slight inflammation in her throat so he injected her in her neck with steroids and then injected her in her vein the neck with ventipulmin. Within two mins of the vet leaving she was heaving terribly and sweating. I phoned th vet back who cam straight back and gave her a another injection to counteract the ventilpulmin. For the next hour she struggled to breath and the amount of sweat that came from her was apsolutly unreal. all her bedding was wet through and there were pools of sweat on the floor. she stopped sweating after an hour but took nearly 8 hours for her breathing to settle.

But now her breathing is worse than ever. the only time her breathing is settles is when shes stood completley still. she cant even eat her haynet without starting to heave. her respiratory at rest (stood in the stable eating a haynet is 26 breaths a min) and she sometimes gets a bit sweaty as shes struggling that much. same vet and another one has been out and said shes fine the injection wont have caused any damage and i must just try and manage her breathing.


her lungs are clear and it is all down to her larynx. could the injection have made it worse??

But my point is that she wasnt this bad before the reaction. she would just have a few hours out grazing being out of breath but now its even when she stood eating her net.

shes on ventilate, and soaked hay and shes bedded on shavings

has anyone ever heard of permament damage happening from such a reaction and could the vets be wrong??
 
Sweating and an increased heart rate are known and unavoidable effects of ventipulmin. I understand why you vet gave it because dilating the airway would help her breath better but as she didn't have a primary restriction of the airway as in COPD it could be argued that she didn't strictly need it and I wouldn't give it to her again. It sounds like she is having regular hypoxaemic attacks due to her not getting enough oxygen into the system because of the paralysied larynx. These are a rare complication in horses and much more common in dogs. This is not the same as anaphylaxis and is caused because of lack of oxygen causing hyperventilation, pyrexia (increase in temperature compounding the sweating from the ventipulmin) and often causes the animal enormous stress. My immediate concerns would be to make sure she gets fluids to replace those lost in sweating and ideally she should have oxygen supplementation but this is unlikely to be available other than in a hospital. I think I would try giving her a very small amount of sedation, I mean really small amounts and repeat if necessary to try and calm her down. Also rinse of sweat and watch very carefully for her getting chilled as she starts to cool down, you will get through a lot of rugs.
In the long term i think you need to consider this horses quality of life if this is happening on a regular basis. Is she at risk of an attack if she has to run in the field because another horse chases her. How long is she left unattended daily that is potential time she could be suffering alone.
I hope she improves soon.
PS it is not your responsibility to manage her breathing and if you are not comfortable get the vet back to finish what they started.
 
Oh and I don't think any further damage has happened to her larynx and it won't be permanent. The effects of ventipulmin last for up to 12hours so realistically you are in for a long night but will be ok at the end of it.
 
sorry wasnt particularly clear on post. the attack happened last saturday and we went through 3 rugs and gave her regular but short drinks and i stayed in the stable with her over night. her breathing has been alot worse over this last week then before the attack which is why im wondering weather the injection or the reaction she had has caused some sort of damage. she never sweated before attack and yes her respiratory was increased on bringing in but soon settled and she was only breathless for 2 hours out of the whole day, but now shes breathless all the time unless stood doing nothing. i just cant understand how she could get this bad overnight (and it was the same night as the attack). she is checked regularly as yard owner lives on site and my mum goes up in the moriing my dad at midday and me in the evening so she is regularly checked.
i personally dont like watching her heaving as it cant be nice but the vet says she fine?? or they just trying to cover their backsides after cocking up??
 
I can't honestly think of a reasonable explanation that what the vet did could have made her underlying condition worse. Their mistake was not to warn you of what could have happened and it sounds like you were left a bit unsupported. My concern now would be to find out why her breathing is still fast because she can't just be left like that. Does she have a low grade allergic component? Has she developed an infection? Does she have fluid in her lungs or thoracic cavity? It really needs investigating further. Has the vet been out to check her since the attack? Something you can do is be checking her temperature twice day to help rule out infection. Does she cough or have any nasal discharge? Maybe you need to have her scoped again to find out the severity of her laryngeal problem. It may be worth giving her a course of bute to help reduce any inflammation of the larynx which could exacerbate her condition or if she would let you squirt DMSO into the back of her throat (has to be done via the nose). I think you better speak to your vet or get a second opinion.
 
the attack happened on saturday night, the next morning i fed her and she couldnt breath, she was heaving really badly and making alot of noise. I phoned the vets surgery and the practice owner was on call so i spoke to him. he could hear her in the background and his exact word were i will come now i cant leave her like that she sounds like shes at deaths door. take her outside and tie her up and dont let her eat anything.

i did this and took her respiratory which was 26. she soon settled as she was stood doing nothing. the vet turned up an hour later and basically said shes fine she looks well, no damage from injection, just manage larynx problem

her lungs are clear
dont think she has copd but shes bedded on shavings and has soaked hay and i never hear her coughing

i just dont understand how shes deteriated so much overnight?
could the vet have injected her in the wrong place and done some damage?
 
Sorry to hear about your pony being so unwell. Have you taken her pulse in conjunction with her respiratory rate? We had an old pony on our yard who was displaying very laboured breathing and sweating, coupled with a low heart rate. Basically, the pony was suffering from heart failure, due in that case to Cushings syndrome. Could it be that the symptoms showing now are caused by something other than the laryx?
I would say with regard to the pony's quality of life, if that means living in a confined space to enable him to breath, then that is not really fair on the pony. You can't carry on until it's too late. It is hard to make the best decision, but having the chance to let an old friend go in a dignified manner is much less agonizing than ending up with a pony who is dying in front of you whilst you try to get a vet to come out.
Hopefully, your pony will make a recovery from this latest episode, and you can continue as you were before, but if no improvement comes, then please consider doing what is best for your pony.
Kind regards
 
Oh hun - my heart aches for you and your old ned. I'm on a similar journey with my 25yr old who has Summer Pasture RAO. At the moment, he struggles to breathe being ridden on a loose rein up an easy hill (vets say keep him moving as much as poss and we're in Wales)but I know the time will come when he won't be able to walk across the field without struggling. He's just had a 3rd tiny nosebleed, we think from the force of the coughs that wrack his body now and then (no pattern). What worries me more than anything is his quailty of life. To be struggling to breathe must be terrifying. I'm just an informed (I hope) lay owner and not a vet but from the details you have given I would say that at this stage - sadly - it doesn't really matter what the original trigger was. The fact is that your old girl is in a bad bad place. The old saying is always true "better a week too early than a day too late". I know how I'd feel if eg I found Sunny had been collapsed in the field all night due to oxygen starvation. I can't keep him in a hermetically sealed unit with never any more company, never any more grass or the feel of the sun on his back. Be brave for her. If she could speak, what would she be saying to you? Do you think she's had enough? Thinking of you poppet xxx
 
a very kind member has given me contact details of a very good vet who i emailed this morning and described sadies symptoms. H e promptly replied and completley hit the nail on the end with a diagnosis. I was so relieved that i was being listened to and that my gut feeling was right. There isnt a great deal that can be done apart from one more thing which we havent tried. I have spoked to my vet who has also agreed with other vets diagnosis so she is now starting a course of treatment on a trial period to see if she responds. this is the last chance saloon and im hoping with all my heart that she responds to treatment and i get my old horse back to her normal self.
thank you to everyone who has replied and will keep you all updated
 
Interested in what the vet diagnosed, and the treatment she is being given. Is it related to the larynx problem or the treatment she received last week?
 
Ok, just read up a bit of history on your mare from a previous post.

I hope you don't mind me posting it again.

I my opinion, this horse's quality of life is not what I would call acceptable. The fact that she doesn't appear to have led down in 18 months, the fact that she is lame with arthritis, has COPD, and coupled with the severe breathing problems, are all a worry. Does she not lie down because she can't get up again? We had my sisters old pony PTS for exactly this reason, he looked fantastic, but the thought that he would be down and unable to get up, no, he was not going to end up undignified, he was too proud for that. So under our vet's advice, and our own experience, we made the decision when the time was right for him.

Sorry if this sounds a bit harsh, but horses can't speak, they suffer in silence, and it's up to you to make the best decision for your horse.

All the best

"i have a 21 year old sport horse that i rescued 4 years ago from the sales. she is a lovely mare and when we could ride her she built my mums confidence up no end but she does have her problems.
she has a collapsed larynx which doesnt cause her any problems but obviously she does make alot of noise whilst eating but the noise seems to be getting worse.
she has arthritus and doesnt take any medication unless she is having a really bad day which to be honest isnt very often but she is lame walking up or down a hill but is fine on the flat.
she does have mild COPD which is managed fine but she does have discharge from her nose through the winter as she is stabled more. i have tried leaving her out 24/7 but her legs sieze up
she used to lay down all the time. many people on the yard used to laugh at her as you could hear her snoring a mile off but no one has seen her lay down in at least 18 months
she also has an old tendon injury that flares up occasionally
she seems ok in herself and is up to weight etc but do i put her through another winter and risk her struggling in the field or finding her on the floor an not being able to get up??
and what about her larynx an her COPD when shes in for longer periods.
the field she is in gets very muddy around the gate and i used to close my eyes watching her coming through it last year as her legs just seem fragile or it might be me being paronoid. she might be tougher than i think and cope fine with the winter
have any of you guys been through similar and what did you do??
i dont want to seem heartless and pts if she will cope this winter but i dont want to find her in pain and have no other decision??
shes 16.1hh middleweight idxtb with green irish book who was originally from ireland so im assuming shes been well used then discarded and she also had her 1st foal at just 2-3 years old.
thanks"
 
I'm afraid I don't think your vets are at fault, she's just getting older.
I think as a responsible loving owner you have a duty to ensure her quality of life is good, and sadly her life sounds pretty horrible from your post.
I have probably seen and managed more oldies than most and my owners all understand I will always be honest enough to tell them when I feel their horses really have had enough. It's never an easy decision for them or for me, saying today you die is an incredibly painful decision to make, but you need to try and be objective and look at life from her point of view.
From what you say she really is in some considerable distress a lot of the time, and that must be terrifying for her struggling to breathe. Why are you turning her out if it distresses her that much? I admit to never having heard of her illness but it sounds like emphysema and once the elasticity in the area has been lost, there is no cure.
I would have a frank discussion with your vet and ask what he would do if she were his, at least that way you will know if it's pointless carrying on attempting to treat her.
I am sorry because I am sure this reply won't be what you would like to hear, but sometimes you have to be brutally honest I'm afraid.
 
Just wondering how your horse is responding to the new treatment, and curious to know what the diagnosis is. It would help others in a similar situation to hear the outcome.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top