Another Ebay question, sorry!!

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MrsNorris

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Sorry this is a bit long! Sold some hoof boots, buyer paid on sat 15th, local PO shut for weekend so sent them on Mon 17th Dec.
On 23rd Dec buyer said she still hadn't had them and demanded a full refund.
I said they were probably held up in the christmas post but she said she needs them urgently for clinical reasons (why buy off ebay just before christmas then??) and wants her money back NOW.
She has also opened a case against me.

As of today. the boots (according to her) are still not there, this makes them 7 working days late from the expected time of delivery due to bank holidays etc. The post office doesn't consider them lost until 15 working days after they were expected.

She didn't request that I send them by next day courier or anything, I stupidly sent them Std first class, so no tracking.

Have since found out that its a common ebay scam for buyers to say they haven't received un-tracked parcels even when they really have, and then get their money back from paypal too!

Don't know if this case is a scam or genuine, but seems a bit strange to demand a refund on the grounds of horses clinical need for boots (he's sloughing his soles apparently!) surely if you needed boots so urgently, you wouldn't buy them off ebay just before christmas?

Just doesn't ring true to me.

What would you all do?
Would you refund now or wait until the boots are officially 'lost' according to post office rules.

The boots are security marked so easy to prove they were/are mine. We know who this person is and I have family in the area, so do you think I should ask my brother to go and talk to her?

This is really stressing me out, I can't afford to lose £95, need the money to buy replacements for my boy.
Thanks for any advise.
 
It's only going to be easy to prove they are your boots if she admits to having some :confused: are they even insured first class standard, I thought there was a 46 quid limit or something (and you won't even get that if they are over that value limit by the way).
 
i think more and more people are doing this if the seller doesnt use any form of tracking or recorded delivery unfortunately . its very sad that people are out to get what they can nowadays. and no i think theres nothing she can do until 15 days after posting so dont give up hope yet!
its for this exact reason that i always post recorded :rolleyes:
 
don't refund! but I thought you could only open a case on ebay after a certain amount of days, thought it was 21 or something ??
to be honest it's not your fault they haven't arrived yet, although should have sent them recorded! wait until the 15 days are up and then maybe speak to her or something? I dont know its a bit of a difficult situation!
 
hollybear said:
Sorry this is a bit long! Sold some hoof boots, buyer paid on sat 15th, local PO shut for weekend so sent them on Mon 17th Dec.
On 23rd Dec buyer said she still hadn't had them and demanded a full refund.
I said they were probably held up in the christmas post but she said she needs them urgently for clinical reasons (why buy off ebay just before christmas then??) and wants her money back NOW.
She has also opened a case against me.

As of today. the boots (according to her) are still not there, this makes them 7 working days late from the expected time of delivery due to bank holidays etc. The post office doesn't consider them lost until 15 working days after they were expected.

She didn't request that I send them by next day courier or anything, I stupidly sent them Std first class, so no tracking.

Have since found out that its a common ebay scam for buyers to say they haven't received un-tracked parcels even when they really have, and then get their money back from paypal too!

Don't know if this case is a scam or genuine, but seems a bit strange to demand a refund on the grounds of horses clinical need for boots (he's sloughing his soles apparently!) surely if you needed boots so urgently, you wouldn't buy them off ebay just before christmas?

Just doesn't ring true to me.

What would you all do?
Would you refund now or wait until the boots are officially 'lost' according to post office rules.

The boots are security marked so easy to prove they were/are mine. We know who this person is and I have family in the area, so do you think I should ask my brother to go and talk to her?

This is really stressing me out, I can't afford to lose £95, need the money to buy replacements for my boy.
Thanks for any advise.
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Sorry but i sent a rug on the 10th of December and the buyer has not received it yet so need to claim.


the ice boot i won in October from the USA also has not come.

I will now send large items with a tracking order.

I am sorry but I do not think its things going awaol.

I think its theft or they would have a huge pile of items and they could track them down

as both my rugs had my return label on the back.
 
I'd hold form for now and let the case run it's course. Tell her that you are simply following eBay policy

You will almost certainly lose the case with no tracking details or proof of posting (proof of posting is free too) but you can only hope that if they are a casual chancer they lose their nerve when they see you aren't easily budged

Not your problem they can't afford boots in an emergency, if £95 is quite literally beyond reach they shouldn't have horses! If they are honest they will know they'll win the case and get their money back
 
FfionWinnie said:
are they even insured first class standard, I thought there was a 46 quid limit or something (and you won't even get that if they are over that value limit by the way).
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Where does it say that FfionWinnie? Have looked on the post office website and can't find any reference to that and I wasn't told it when I sent the boots. Was just told they were insured for a maximum of £46 or their lower market value, whichever was less.

Hope its not the case as it looks like that may be my only hope of getting something back from this.

Can't believe I was so trusting, apparently crooks do this all the time and only bid on items which specify std post with no tracking. Feel like a complete fool!

I did wonder why they had sold for so much, I put them on for £60 and was expecting about that, not £90 odd, but I suppose it doesn't matter what you bid if you have no intention of paying for them!!

Will keep hoping that they turn up and its all just a postal delay and me panicking unnecessarily!! , but I will wait the full 15 working days before refunding the buyer, I don't think that is unreasonable.
 
WelshD said:
I'd hold form for now and let the case run it's course. Tell her that you are simply following eBay policy

You will almost certainly lose the case with no tracking details or proof of posting (proof of posting is free too) but you can only hope that if they are a casual chancer they lose their nerve when they see you aren't easily budged

Not your problem they can't afford boots in an emergency, if £95 is quite literally beyond reach they shouldn't have horses! If they are honest they will know they'll win the case and get their money back
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I do have proof of posting so that may help. :)
 
my case is i have mislaid the proof of posting.


but unless they have someone within royal mail who steals and opens the parcel a shavings bag with return label should return to me
 
Bay TB said:
If you have proof of posting, you just need to scan and email that to Ebay when the case is opened against you.
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Which will do pretty much ****** all because proof of delivery is what is required by ebay, not proof of posting.
 
Not much help to you now but this is why I send (and charge for) recorded delivery for everything sold on eBay, regardless of value.

I'm not sure you can do much apart from refund her and then chase the Royal Mail and try to get some money back from them?
 
im sure proof of posting would help because surely that is proving you do not have the item, and the buyer is saying they do not have it, therefore its the responsibility of Royal mail?
 
Let the case run its course - follow instructions from eBay on the case and cease all other communication with the buyer

However you have to think seriously about insurance, as if the courier or RM loses items, you are going to be the one with the problem

With RM if you have proof of posting you can claim £46 back from Royal Mail

http://www.royalmail.com/delivery/business-delivery-options-uk/standard-parcels

Interesting as this came from when the first class stamp was 46p, they did not increase insurance for the last couple of prices hikes, as otherwise you'd be covered for £60

For other couriers I tend to use myhermes directly, as their insurance is one of the best rates
 
I would wait the full 14 days. Don't giver her the money back yet.

If they are lost you can claim from the post office.
The post office can tell if multiple claims have been made by the same address/ name.

So it would have to be a very organised and crafty buyer to keep getting away with this.
 
It sounds very much like a scam, it has happened to me and yes there are career scammers who will do this whenever anyone hasn't used recorded delivery.

If she has opened a dispute with you then paypal will whip the money out of your account whether you like it or not!
Scan your postage receipt and get that off to ebay and paypal ASAP, and only communicate through ebay messaging so they will have a record.

Always always use recorded delivery for everything however cheap, and if it's worth over £50 use tracked delivery.
 
russianhorse said:
I also thought proof of post was enough of proof to eBay
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ebay want you to prove delivery. As a seller you make a contract to get the goods to the buyer. If you choose to sub-contract the delivery to someone else that's fine but the contract to get the goods to the buyer remains with you. The buyer has a claim against you, the seller. If your sub-contractor fails to deliver you have to chase the sub-contractor, it's not up to the buyer (or ebay) to do that for you.
 
*hic* said:
Which will do pretty much ****** all because proof of delivery is what is required by ebay, not proof of posting.
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They held off longer when this happened to me because I could proove that it was in the post, I then had time to chase the post office. In the meantime goods thankfully arrived.
 
Thanks everyone for your help, will scan and send my proof of postage today.

This buyer was demanding a full refund when the boots were just 3 days late so that also makes me think this is a scam, sent them on monday and she was asking for refund by the weekend!

No-one genuine would be asking so soon, especially in the week before christmas, would they? :confused:

Have sent a message via ebay saying I will refund when the boots are 15 working days overdue and not before.

Will never use ebay or paypal again, don't need the stress!!
 
I had to ring paypal ebay yesterday(I advertised a car and obviously paid the fees but recently got a bill for approx £42 and couldnt understand why so big as I never sold the car....anyway turns out everytime I relisted the car I was getting charged each time...it was the relisting I was getting charged each time as if it was the first time...I had not realised this). Anyway paypal gave me a number for ebay which is 0845 3553 229 if that will help?

I had someone not pay me recently and they do have resolution centre which I went through it talks in riddles and is not easy to understand. I always get a proof of posting and I think its the post office that you need to speak to regarding this?

Good luck nothing suprises me as I have read this before people saying it hasnt arrived. Let us know what happens. Trouble is ebay its impossible for a seller to leave bad feedback but a buyer can nowadays. Seems unfair.
 
hollybear said:
Where does it say that FfionWinnie? Have looked on the post office website and can't find any reference to that and I wasn't told it when I sent the boots. Was just told they were insured for a maximum of £46 or their lower market value, whichever was less.

Hope its not the case as it looks like that may be my only hope of getting something back from this.

Can't believe I was so trusting, apparently crooks do this all the time and only bid on items which specify std post with no tracking. Feel like a complete fool!

I did wonder why they had sold for so much, I put them on for £60 and was expecting about that, not £90 odd, but I suppose it doesn't matter what you bid if you have no intention of paying for them!!

Will keep hoping that they turn up and its all just a postal delay and me panicking unnecessarily!! , but I will wait the full 15 working days before refunding the buyer, I don't think that is unreasonable.
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I was sending a bit back to the hire company and the woman in the PO asked me what the value was and I said 50 and she it's only insured up to 46 and I said well ok that will be fine and she told me I couldn't claim the 46 if it went missing:eek:

ETA seems like she was talking rubbish sorry:



You can claim compensation for lost or delayed Standard Parcels or if it is damaged when it arrives.

For items posted with Royal Mail which have no intrinsic (monetary) value, or where you cannot provide evidence of posting (such as a certificate of posting) and evidence of value (such as an invoice or receipt) there will be compensation for loss, damage and delay of a minimum of 6 x 1st class stamps at the first weight step. In the event of a compensation claim for loss we will refund the postage paid or 6 x 1st class stamps at the first weight step, whichever is the greater.

For lost or damaged items that have an intrinsic (monetary) value, with evidence of posting with Royal Mail (such as a certificate of posting) and evidence of value (such as an invoice or receipt) you will be entitled to a postage refund plus compensation for actual loss up to the value of the item, or the sumd of £46, whichever is the lowest.

Compensation up to £2500 is also available if you use the Special Delivery™ Next Day service.

Read more about compensation.
 
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This is a very very common scam on Ebay but unfortunately it is in the buyers favour now. Once a case has been opened it goes against you and Ebay/Paypal will force a refund :( There are different time scales for Paypal/Ebay cases. If you cannot prove DELIVERY then you will lose, A certificate of posting is not enough for inr.
Proof of posting is only acceptable for a chargeback case/unauthorised use of card.
Ffion is right in that you are only covered for 46.00. And this is the same for recorded delivery, which rarely tracks in parts of the country. My postie just pops them in my door same as normal post. So if you have anything worth more then 46.00 either use a courier with added insurance or send Special delivery
By making your buyer wait you are leaving yourself wide open to neg fb and low stars. I completely understand how upset you feel. I would keep an eye on fb profiles etc...see if they appear,(magically of course ;) ) on their horse. Likewise if you have family there then they can keep an eye too. Also have you checked with local delivery office to see if they are there? Not always do RM leave a calling card.
Good luck x
 
hollybear said:
Thanks everyone for your help, will scan and send my proof of postage today.

This buyer was demanding a full refund when the boots were just 3 days late so that also makes me think this is a scam, sent them on monday and she was asking for refund by the weekend!

No-one genuine would be asking so soon, especially in the week before christmas, would they? :confused:

Have sent a message via ebay saying I will refund when the boots are 15 working days overdue and not before.

Will never use ebay or paypal again, don't need the stress!!
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When I had a problem I contacted both PayPal and eBay (This was a number of years ago though) no sure if they work together now or not, but may be worth contacting both?
 
I have to say I always send everything of importance via special delivery - I was told by the post office recorded isn't worth anything as it just gets chucked into the normal post, so no guarantee it will get to where it's supposed to :/

I rarely sell on eBay now (unless collection only) after someone managed to get their money back AND keep the item because it smelt of smoke, even though we don't smoke ...... Scammers!!
 
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