Another lame horse. Laminitis?

[redapple]

Hi,

So I have a mystery intermittent lameness issue on a horse I ride. She's on a cycle of coming lame every 2-3 months for a week, max 2 and then comes lame again.

Background;

No history of lameness until last summer
Footsore, especially on uneven or rough gound
Intermittent fore lameness. 3 times. Twice right fore, once left fore (?!?)
No heat, No swelling, No obvious sole bruising.

Things that confuse the issue! (I've tried to do in relation to the points above);

She changed yard last summer - different grass and ground conditions.
Has never previously hacked until yard move, only been schooled and very occasional road work. Now hacks 1-2 a week on fairly rough ground (flat but a little stoney). Is unshod
Always mild (worst was potentially 4/10, most commonly 2-3/10)
To her (not super) experienced owners she looks ok! I think they think I look for problems, especially as its low-grade lameness. I also have retired two horses for lameness so I do tend to feel it before others, though I don't feel like I over-do it/imagine it.

Details;

First time, she was lame was summer (2/10 lame, but I saw her parked out outside stable so immediately in and on soaked hay, bute, thick bed etc.). Had farrier who was at yard have a look, he said no signs of lami, and toes a bit long (?!) so owners didn't get vet. I really feel strongly that she had laminitis here, but I've also never had one with it. Also no pulses and mild heat in feet (also very hot weather). Second time lame again, autumn time, bute trial and box rest. Sound after bute trial. This week - potentially 3/10 lame on a front (it's one leg not bilateral, video if anyone wants to see). Bute trial and box rest again. She's being looked at again in the morning (me and YO), will have been off bute 2 days but still on box rest.



I really think that xrays are needed here? But she isn't mine and laminitis wasn't evident according to farrier. I'm worried that the grass will start shooting soon and if she has any rotation etc that it could be made much worse this year. I'm also aware that the pattern of lameness doesn't entirely fit laminitis (or does it?!).

Would everyone else thoughts be laminitis? And problems stemming from laminitis linked to a foot issue? Anything else that fits the pattern?

I'm tempted to really push owners into xrays but concerned I might be wrong and cost them money. I'm also dispensible if i've got it wrong and it looks like i'm just causing issues....! I'm very hopeful that she'll have vet out this week (if not sound tomorrow ) as yard owner is, at least to my face, supportive. But if she's sound tomorrow would you still push for vet based on if it is laminitis needing to get ahead of it pre-summer? Owners are very lovely and helpful but I would say cautious about getting vet treatment.

Sorry for very long post!

 

[Equi]

Where is the bute coming from?

Farriers (at least we hope) know feet...but how many actually look past what the balance/shoe looks like? A horse i looked after for a friend when pregnant had a few issues like this..not lame to the extent of looking lame for long and farrier saw nothing wrong etc. I took him to a vet who checked his whole body and saw nothing either though he did not look at his feet (because i initially thought it was a back issue) I eventually got a barefoot specialist out (which other NI users will know is HARD to do) and within two mins he said he is a laminitis sufferer and highly likely to have navicular or ringbone. The horse was never rode again by me and owner retired him because she didnt think anything was wrong thus wouldnt get vet but she couldnt ride at the time, but i reckon with some proper foot care/diet he would have been ok to hack at least.

 

[redapple]

I feel like I probably shouldn't say about Bute... But I'm also probably not that identifiable (hopefully not) and I know I'm not the only one that does this.

1st time - Had some on hand from a prescription for another horse
2nd time - Vet via phonecall and prescription (I believe anyway)
At the moment - Again from a stash...

 

[Equi]

It’s not illegal (or is it?) we all do it lol but when it’s something that’s gone on quite a while I’d have wanted a vet to say bute it. Giving bute then saying oh he looks ok today is not quite solving the issue.

 

[redapple]

Not sure on legalities, it's potentially frowned on for professionals to be giving/sharing bute without vet recommendation. Would never make me think negatively about anyone but people can be weird!

I would agree but owners are used to the plan of action being bute, rest and assess. I don't think I could persuade them to get vet without trying this first. Though I do wonder if given the reoccurrence even if she is sound after this box rest/bute it's still worth getting a vet.

 

[Equi]

In your position all you can do is give your opinion and see what owners will do I suppose. But you need to make it clear you won’t ride a lame horse until it’s been checked

 

[SEL]

If the YO can't persuade them sometimes another professional can. Obviously the farrier is out, but is there a friendly physio who could do some bodywork and express concerns that the horse needs a vet?

 

[catkin]

Please try to get a vet to see this horse. You do not say how old he is but the intermittent footyness particularly in autumn could mean that the horse has PPID (Cushings) or metabolic syndrome (EMS). The former needs to be medicated, the second strict management, and you will need a vet to diagnose as they are the only professionals that can do so.

 

[holeymoley]

Sounds like she has low grade laminitis in the background. Especially if she's constantly foot sore. What is her diet? Also what is her trim like? If you say she has long toes that won't help with any flare ups as pressure will be going on to them and excerbating the pain. I would get some blood tests to see what's going on. Also a vet to check with hoof testers.

 

[holeymoley]

Also, if she's coming down with it just now, as mild a winter as we've had, there will still likely be endocrine issues- ems, cushings which will need managed.

 

[ester]

I wouldn’t necessarily dive into xrays from what you’ve said but if she’s 3/10 lame now it would make sense for someone to work that up.

 

[redapple]

Because "horses will be horses" she came out perfectly sound this morning Never would I feel annoyed about a horse being sound but it does complicate issues! EMS/Cushings is an interesting thought but she doesn't have any coat changes, fat deposits, change in energy?

 

[ester]

Can you start keeping a diary/use the laminitis app to see if there’s is any pattern with that?

 

[Gloi]

If she's unshod and regularly going footsore then if she us being ridden you should try putting boots on her, at least in front. With intermittent work she may not be growing a strong enough hoof and getting bruised.
Testing for Cushings is sensible , the long coat and fat deposits aren't always shown at first.

 

[redapple]

Yes absolutely.

Would there be any harm in shoeing her if she does have either? She could do with getting fitter hacking but I don't want to end up with bruised soles.

 

[redapple]

If she's unshod and regularly going footsore then if she us being ridden you should try putting boots on her, at least in front. With intermittent work she may not be growing a strong enough hoof and getting bruised.

I've thought about hoof boots but worried about them rubbing and hurting the horse! Zero experience with them however.

 

[Gloi]

I've thought about hoof boots but worried about them rubbing and hurting the horse! Zero experience with them however.

If they fit properly they wont rub unless you have an unusually thin skinned horse , and in that case you can put gaiters under them.

 

[Pinkvboots]

Bute and rest is fine for a week but if still lame you need a vet and then possibly a lameness work up to find out the cause, otherwise it's just a guessing game.

I know a lot a if horses have had foot issues this winter due to the wet conditions, both of mine have had soft sensitive heels which can make them sore for a few days.

 

[Gloi]

Yes absolutely.

Would there be any harm in shoeing her if she does have either? She could do with getting fitter hacking but I don't want to end up with bruised soles.

You really need to find what the matter is before shoeing her just in case

 

[vmac66]

I wouldn't put shoes on a horse with sore feet, they mask problems rather than make them better. There are various hoof boot for sale groups on Facebook.
There are so many boots available now that you should be able to find some that fit. My mare had Scoot boots with gaiters all round. Hoof boutique online are very helpful.

 

[ycbm]

It’s not illegal (or is it?) we all do it lol but when it’s something that’s gone on quite a while I’d have wanted a vet to say bute it. Giving bute then saying oh he looks ok today is not quite solving the issue.

Yes in the UK it is definitely illegal to give a horse Bute without a vet prescribing it after checking that the horse is signed out of the food chain.

 

[Equi]

Yes in the UK it is definitely illegal to give a horse Bute without a vet prescribing it after checking that the horse is signed out of the food chain.

Yes now you say it I realise knew that but my brain forgot horses can be in the food chain lol