Any saddlers in today? Or people who are good at fit. It's about adjustable saddles

[Natch]

Thought you probably did - just checking

Glad she's well. I'm getting back on Murphs in a few weeks time - neckstrap could well take a lot of use for the first few rides!

 

[martlin]

Honestly. The blisters her Stubbens give me are something to behold! And they really effing hurt as well! She is all long and skinny and I am short and fat. I think that is why she loves them and I hate them!!

Can't be that, cos I am short and fat, too In fact, I believe the cushion I have grown myself over the years is helping the comfort

 

[pixiebee]

I would not have another Wintec after the things I've heard about them. I'd try Thorowgood. I lost four horses in under seven years and each of them had to have a new (second hand but new to them) saddle and to part exchange my current one cost me and arm and a leg, as of course you never get the value off the saddle that you are selling. In one case I bought a Black Country saddle brand new costing £650 and 8 months later when my 6 year old broke his leg in the field and it didn't fit my new horse I lost £300 on it by part exchanging it with another one. You can't tell me that a saddle depreciates in 8 months by £300. Most saddle fitters are a waste of space and a rip off.

Like any professional you have to take what they are telling you as the truth otherwise there is no point in going to a professional. But some of the unscruplious ones do take advantage of this fact.

sorry but I do not agree, it takes years of tudying and practise to be able to PROPERLY fit a saddle to a horse. So many people try and save money and buy a cheapy adjustable thing and plonk it on the horses back, purely looking at the width. The bigger issue is the tree shape on the horses back, as ive said before, you can change the width of a saddle till the cows come home but if the tree is not the right shape on the horses back it will never fit. It is a huge bug bear of mine, my horse came to me after having a badly fitted saddle and a year later and we are only just improving. Its not fair on the horse to make him work in something that does not fit, thats like running miles in shoes too small or miles too big and flapping around.

The best adjustable saddlew are the Kent and masters because not only can you change the gullet wisth, you can adjust the entire balance of the saddle bu adjusting the actual tree. Wintects are a waste of money imo unless you have a horse with a 'wintec' shaped back that it!!

Rant over!

 

[coss]

Not true. Flair is pure air bags, which came signficantly altered with pumps. Cair is sealed foam bags (think crisp packet, filled with foam then sealed) and have no ability to adjust at all. The only thing you can do is add shims above the panels. Cair is fine if the saddle is an excellent fit, but if it's not quite right, the panels never 'bed' and spring back into the 'not quite right' shape every single stride. That makes them sore. Flair is mush much softer but has a similar effect, and a lot of movement in them, which some horses hate. I much prefer good quality flocking: it beds to a perfect shape then stays there!

Apologies - this is how it was explained to me by a saddler when i was using a flair saddle! Also - reading about flair on the WOW website (brochure, page 20/21 has a diagram showing air around foam. your description of Cair is again different to how its been described to me but sounds a good description on further reading.
I also prefer good quality flocking over air as know far too many horses that have had muscle issues after use of air saddles - be it flair/cair or WOW.

 

[cremedemonthe]

sorry but I do not agree, it takes years of tudying and practise to be able to PROPERLY fit a saddle to a horse. So many people try and save money and buy a cheapy adjustable thing and plonk it on the horses back, purely looking at the width. The bigger issue is the tree shape on the horses back, as ive said before, you can change the width of a saddle till the cows come home but if the tree is not the right shape on the horses back it will never fit. It is a huge bug bear of mine, my horse came to me after having a badly fitted saddle and a year later and we are only just improving. Its not fair on the horse to make him work in something that does not fit, thats like running miles in shoes too small or miles too big and flapping around.

The best adjustable saddlew are the Kent and masters because not only can you change the gullet wisth, you can adjust the entire balance of the saddle bu adjusting the actual tree. Wintects are a waste of money imo unless you have a horse with a 'wintec' shaped back that it!!

Rant over!

Thank you Pixie Bee, you took the wordfs right out of my mouth!
Oz (Saddler for 25 years)

 

[Jesstickle]

Well, one of the saddlers out our way came and reflocked two saddles for two different horses of two owners and both suspiciously grew white patches on either side of their withers about two months later. Both had been in their saddles for a good year before the reflocking with no problem. So I'm not convinced saddle fitters always get it right! Especially as fitter was incredibly dismissive of it and said it couldn't have been them. One horse I'd call a coincidence but two was enough to convince me not to use them!

That said, I am no saddle fitter and that is why my post is clearly written to fitters asking for help and explaining that the saddle will be fitted by a saddler as well. I appreciate the skill that good saddle fitters have

 

[weeanne]

I cant see past saddle co especially for young horses. New and second are both very reasonable

 

[pixiebee]

Well, one of the saddlers out our way came and reflocked two saddles for two different horses of two owners and both suspiciously grew white patches on either side of their withers about two months later. Both had been in their saddles for a good year before the reflocking with no problem. So I'm not convinced saddle fitters always get it right! Especially as fitter was incredibly dismissive of it and said it couldn't have been them. One horse I'd call a coincidence but two was enough to convince me not to use them!

That said, I am no saddle fitter and that is why my post is clearly written to fitters asking for help and explaining that the saddle will be fitted by a saddler as well. I appreciate the skill that good saddle fitters have

was your saddler a master fitter? a master saddler is not neccassarily qualified to fit, they are two different things!

 

[Jesstickle]

was your saddler a master fitter? a master saddler is not neccassarily qualified to fit, they are two different things!

Yep, master fitter. And not my saddler I hasten to add. Was two horses on the same yard as me at the time. Fortunately I didn't have them look at my saddle

 

[pixiebee]

Yep, master fitter. And not my saddler I hasten to add. Was two horses on the same yard as me at the time. Fortunately I didn't have them look at my saddle

sorry, misread your post!!! seems odd both horses had white marks, i guess maybe they were just unlucky with who they used? odd though as becomming a master fitter is hard slog !

 

[superpony]

I have a bates gp and dressage for my tb. One of the few saddles which fit him and I love it! They also keep their value if you want to sell them.

 

[sbloom]

You can't tell me that a saddle depreciates in 8 months by £300. Most saddle fitters are a waste of space and a rip off.

Like any professional you have to take what they are telling you as the truth otherwise there is no point in going to a professional. But some of the unscruplious ones do take advantage of this fact.

Yes saddles do depreciate rapidly, just like cars as someone pointed out. VAT needs to be taken off, as the fitter never received that, then you need to add on a margin to cover the cost of stockholding (£500 tied up in one saddle for up to a year?!) and a margin for selling and fitting it.

When I'm out fitting I explain as much as I can, have the owner FEEL for themselves the pressure spread under a saddle. Not all of us are trying to hoodwink people. I can't imagine many at all are.

Saddle company saddles actually have a 10 year guarantee on the trees as they are synthetic so very unlikely to twist, and if someone tells you the tree has twisted they are more than likely having you on/fleecing you.

This is only one story, but I have a customer who had been to see several SC saddles and she said every one was twisted. ONly then did she come to me, she wasn't an existing client and had no reason to criticse them. I'm sure most are straight, but it IS possible for synthetic trees to be twisted during the saddle manufacturing process.

sorry but I do not agree, it takes years of tudying and practise to be able to PROPERLY fit a saddle to a horse. So many people try and save money and buy a cheapy adjustable thing and plonk it on the horses back, purely looking at the width. The bigger issue is the tree shape on the horses back, as ive said before, you can change the width of a saddle till the cows come home but if the tree is not the right shape on the horses back it will never fit. It is a huge bug bear of mine, my horse came to me after having a badly fitted saddle and a year later and we are only just improving. Its not fair on the horse to make him work in something that does not fit, thats like running miles in shoes too small or miles too big and flapping around.

The best adjustable saddlew are the Kent and masters because not only can you change the gullet wisth, you can adjust the entire balance of the saddle bu adjusting the actual tree. Wintects are a waste of money imo unless you have a horse with a 'wintec' shaped back that it!!

Rant over!

Totally agree with the first paragraph. The second? I've never heard K&M claim they can adjust the whole saddle, though I have heard it from SC. Seeing the adjuster that SC use, and knowing how saddles are made, I have no idea how they achieve that. The balance of a saddle is usually adjusted to a small extent with flocking, but the depth of the panel at the back is critical, and it clearly comes as a standard depth on an off the shelf production line saddle. Only bench made saddle makers can offer a deeper or shallower rear gusset as an option.

A blog post from a saddle fitting friend of mine on the subject:

http://saddlefitter.blogspot.co.uk/2009/11/from-tree-up-sub-topic-adjustable-trees.html#more

 

[coss]

A blog post from a saddle fitting friend of mine on the subject:

http://saddlefitter.blogspot.co.uk/2009/11/from-tree-up-sub-topic-adjustable-trees.html#more

what a super article

 

[criso]

May I just meekly make the point that just because a saddle's gullet headplate is adjustable, doesn't mean its going to fit. Too many other variables on the horse's back

.

I don't think anyone was suggesting that, but for someone in the original poster's position with a youngster, a properly fitted adjustable saddle may be able to adjust as the horse develops more than a non adjustable one.

My personal bugbear is when saddle fitters only deal with one make of saddle and try to suggest it can be made or adjusted to fit any horse. As they don't have an alternative to offer they try to make it work when it clearly won't. I know of two saddle company fitters guilty of this but at the other end of the market have heard about the same happening with custom made Devoucoux.