Any tips for improving a mares milk

[jelibean]

Is it possible to suppliment a mare to improve the quality of her milk? Apart from the obvious of supplying quality feed and hay in the correct quanities, does anyone use anything different to improve the milk or quantity that it is produced in. Sorry if its not clear what im asking but similar to the old wives tale about drinking Guiness when pregnant for Iron??

 

[volatis]

I havent tried it but have heard that cocoa powder is a sure bet.
Is she looking any closer to foaling yet?

 

[Vickijay]

[ QUOTE ]
I havent tried it but have heard that cocoa powder is a sure bet.


[/ QUOTE ]

I heard that too!!

 

[jomiln]

Johanna Vardon told me about cocoa powder being useful

 

[toffeesmarty]

My vet recommended Selenium and Vit E supplement. I sourced it from Feedmark:
http://www.feedmark.com/Product.asp?Product=Vitasel-E

I used it for the last 3 months of pregnancy and up until weaning and the milk kept flowing!!

 

[ofcourseyoucan]

dont feed cocoa powder til she foals! it then helps the production and flow of milk. pre foaling a good balanced diet, dont let her get fat before foaling but enough protein to keep healthy and feed the foal, not too much as you dont want the struggle of foaling a whopper! a good supplement and some red cell! once foaled the mare will need increased feed to keep quality of milk good. Good luck and enjoy your baby when he/she arrives! a good stud vet or stud manager are probably your best advisory.

 

[shirleyno2]

Cocoa powder once foaled definetely works, used it lots of times with excellent success.

 

[vixann]

lol you just want me to feed her Guiness!!!

 

[jelibean]

LOL, the guiness will be for me if your mare gives me any more heart failure.
The cocoa powder info is facinating, does anyone know the science behind that, sorry I appreciate that's sad.
Volatis: vics vet been this morning to give her a once over, he is pretty certain it was a bout of colic yesterday as nothing alarming happening with baby, he also said baby not actually all that big, head still size of a small labrador so confirmed still at least 4 weeks to go, rechecked scan photos, we'd not been able to establish an estimated DD because the exact covering date was a bit vague and vic couldn't remeber the scan date or estimated age of foetus. Needless to say were very pleased we've HOPEFULLY another 4 weeks in the hope her condition improves.
Ofcourseyoucan: its actually vixann's mare, its on my yard for foaling so that I can offer a hand during the run up to and including foaling and foal watch, the mare is getting a really good quality balanced diet and ad lib hay. She eats plenty but is struggling to hold condition, so were slightly more concerned about lack of milk, colostrum ect than her being overweight, fingers crossed she'll pull out all the stops for her bubba.

 

[BallyshanHorses]

I wouldnt jump into feeding cocoa powder to be honest especially if the mare is in bad condition as it will put too much pressure on her body to produce more milk.
If you are feeding her an adequate diet and building it up then you should be ok,making sure she has her vaccinations up to date.Too many people think that if a mare has a small bag then they do not have enough milk but its the quality that counts.I had a maiden foal last year and she had a very small bag for a 17h plus mare and the foal seemed to be sucking a lot.Turns out he was just greedy and the mare had more than enough for him.The best way to monitor is to weigh foal weekely.That way you can then decide if she needs something like cocoa powder.
Ithink a foal likely to make 16h plus should put on between .5-1kg a day so the resulting foal should be putting about 7kg/week.

www.ballyshanhorses.webs.com

 

[jelibean]

Thanks ballyshan we'll bear that in mind, Vix's is in contact with her vet, who certainly isn't drastically concerned at this stage, I personally was just curious about the quality of the milk when she does foal.

 

[BallyshanHorses]

Jelibean.As I have sort of said before there is a huge difference between quantity v's quantity so therefore the foal is the best way forward as regards general wellbeing and weight gain.The foal will tell you what it needs but this inevitably means keeping correct records of birth weight and weight gain and an igg after birth.
I generally weigh the afterbirth,not the foal as to ascertain birth weight.The placenta is generally 10% of the foals birth weight so therefore if the placenta is just say 5.5kg then the foal at birth should be around 55 kg.Very handy to use instead of upsetting the mare and foal so early.

 

[jelibean]

Thanks, nice tip, I feel kind of cheeky stealing all this fabulous information as its not my baby All worth knowing I might add..

 

[BallyshanHorses]

Steal away as I feel this is the nicest part of the forum.I dont see as much sniping on the breeding part as elsewhere and if I can help at all I will.Best of luck with the foal.

 

[Carsmore]

I was also told cocoa powder by Johanna Vardon. We use it for ewes that are having lactation problems too with very good results.

 

[Carsmore]

While I remember Jelibean, did you find that article from Richmond futurity with our neddies in? Id love a copy if you have access to a scanner.

 

[Rollin]

My mother told me to drink guiness - that was before we knew about the problems for babies if mum consumed alcohol.

 

[levantosh]

Just out of curiosity, how much cocoa powder would you give them and I take it it would need to be pure cocoa powder?!

 

[Alec Swan]

Jelibean,

[ QUOTE ]

Is she looking any closer to foaling yet?

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This was actually the second line of the reply from volatis, and it poses the odd question, or two.

If the mare has yet to foal, what makes you think that her milk quality wont be good enough? When is the mare due? Have you bred from horses previously, or this particular mare before? Does the mare have a history of pruducing molk of a poor quality, and if she does, then it would be far more likely that the problem was a dietary one. What makes you think that her milk quality isn't, or wont be good enough? Answer these questions, and I am certain that there will be those, more qualified than I, who will offer help.

I have never heard of, or used cocoa powder, for a mare. What I have done, is use a commercially produced milk powder, and fed it to the mare. She LOVED it, to the extent that when it was offered to the foal in powder form, the mare mugged me to get to it! I have also used the above mentioned milk powder on ewes, with spectacular results! The quantities needed, are VERY small. It's potent stuff!

I would be interested to hear the answers, and perhaps I'm not alone.

Ballyshan, you are right, in that it's such a pleasure when this forum moves towards its intended direction, isn't it?!

Alec.

 

[jelibean]

Alec, I think you must have missed some of my replys earlier. The post originally wasn't aimed at a specific mare more of a general pondering. The reason behind the pondering is that I have a friends mare on my yard as the yard she keeps her others at is a massive livery yard, she opted to bring her mare to us to foal a. Because its much quieter b. We have a foaling box c. I have foaled three of my own and my father in law who lives on site has bred for donkeys years, I don't claim for that to make us experts by any standard but she has asked for us to help point her in the right direction it is her first foal and I personally admire her admitting she is not totally confident to go it alone, we all have to start somewhere, I found most of the answers I needed on this forumn but when it came down to it I'm glad my husband and father in law was on hand the first time. She is also working closely with her vet as the mare lacks a considerable amount of condition, she is an older mare and has regular dental treatment for some problem teeth but she is recievng as much quality food as she needs and has the best medical and general care financially possible. I personally don't believe the mares condition reflects the amount of care / money and nutrition which is being invested in it, we are very aware there could be some harsh underlying problem, but at this stage all we can do is keep our fingers crossed for a healthy live mare and foal. Was it the best mare to breed from, I don't know I didn't know the mare before it came to the yard, I have seen that it has produced numerous foals previously but have no intimate knowledge of her or her ability as a broodmare, therefore as she is 4 weeks from foaling I would have like to have seen some suggestion of her teats altering even if a slight change but the mare isn't doing anything and has also gone slack behind. My vet suggested starting to think about if the mares condition doesn't improve that she may need some help feeding, so its all very "What if" at the moment but having not had any concerns with a poor mare before I felt it would be much better to do some research ready for any eventuality instead of being last minute. Aside from everything else I'm interested to see the resulting foal, as its bloodline is one I've never had any experience of but if Vic wants to share which I hope she will when baby arrives then who am I to steal her thunder

 

[jelibean]

OOOO I'd forgotten about that article claracluck, I will hunt for the magazine when I get back to the office.

 

[henryhorn]

JV recommended cocoa powder to us and yes, it does work!
I fed a large tablespoon twice a day, and the milk flow improved within a day of starting it.
I'm starting to learn that some mares sail through pregnancy keeping their weight effortlessly, others lose it consistently despite vast amounts of food.
One mare we bought in foal was in terrible condition and searching back through her history she has been like that every time. We will investigate possible causes but sometimes I think all you can do is ensure they get adequate vit and mineral requirements and keep feeding even if they don't appear to benefit.
Our first actions were to check teeth, worm, delouse and up the feed, plus make sure she wasn't cold or having enough access to ad lib haylage.
Now she is on pink powders plus hard feeds to ensure the foal won't go short, but she looks poor which considering how much she actually eats shouldn't happen.
You sound to be doing everything right to me..

 

[Alec Swan]

jelibean,

your response to my first thoughts, seems to have the problem resolved, in part. I certainly did miss your other replies! I imagined that the mare was yours. I apologise.

The response from HH makes perfect sense. It really is frustrating, isn't it when the odd horse crops up which no matter what you do for it, little seems to work?

I've never heard of cocoa powder, but if that works, then that's what you do. If she wont eat it, then try a commercially produced milk powder, though as others have found that cocoa works, that I would suggest is the way to go.

Alec.

 

[jelibean]

Ultimately, we don't know what the outcome will be until the time arrives and, her owner will have to make any decision to suppliment when the time comes, but it never hurts to be well informed.
Henryhorn, its a slight relief to hear were not alone, I hope you get to the bottom of your mares issues, I would be very interested to hear your findings.

 

[jmponzo]

I have successfully used the cocoa powder for the mares.
Would like to hear experiences with the Dutch Process vs the Natural.