Any vets on here I could PM?

Nudibranch

Nudibranch

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I need more info on potential problems with euthanasia using Somulose. Have posted before about my old pony's horrendous experience and the vet responsible is in more or less complete denial. Not wanting to sue or even refer to the RC (I expect they would just support the vet regardless) but I do want to write to them again and re-express my concerns. I don't believe the practice is prepared to review its procedures and I really think they should. The vet has also lied about some things which I am really angry about, but it's just my word against his so I don't expect to get anywhere. But if there are any vets on here who would be prepared to give some advice that would be really helpful.
 
Search NOAH online (national organisation animal health) you need the compendium manual, search euthanaesia or somulose it will tell you all about how fast the drug should be inserted to effect cardiac arrest etc etc. good luck. It also says something about having a back up if the drug fails, very interesting reading.
 
I am just appalled that it has got to this... do you have BHS or insurance cover ? they could possibly help you - I fully understand you are doing this for answers rather than compensation - so good luck

x
 
If you go through the RC, it wont cost you anything and really is just a matter of filling out a form. Your vet will then have to answer your concerns in full to the satisfaction of the RC. If you truely believe that errors were made it honestly is the best way forward. Its really the only way to make the practice take account of its actions and review its procedures. They cant ignore it or brush it under the carpet.
 
There is the odd practising vet on here, but expecting them to stand up and criticise an unknown colleague, wont happen. They, quite correctly, have an established etiquette. If they weren't present, at the time of euthanasia, then they wont be in possession of the facts.

I'm so sorry that you've had an unhappy experience using a lethal injection. Not always, but generally, a huge sedative is administered firstly, and then the lethal aspect follows that. In the case of an emergency, then most would dispense with the sedative, and this is where the ugly aspect of LI can occur, and it's for that very reason that I would always prefer that a horse be shot.

I'm NOT a Vet, but I've attended the last few minutes of the lives of many horses. If you would like an unbiased opinion, then by all means ask, and if you'd prefer to do so by PM, then that's fine.

Alec.
 
I think Alec has given some excellent advice, I'd also say that if you are concerned re practices etc, then you should flag this up to rc. It is such a shame that you and your horse had such an awful experience with the injection, I have never seen such a peaceful and graceful exit from this world than when with the use of lethal injection, so to read what you have been through is quite upsetting, sadly these issues occur with the bullet too, my friend went though exactly the same when her horse was PTS by bullet, it haunts her 18 months on. These things happen, but it does not make them right, and if you feel the need to take things further, and you feel you are being ignored by the practice then another letter will not help, malpractice (if that is what it truly is) is malpractice and should be flagged up to rc. I realise how painful this is for you and how desperate you must feel but asking for advice from vets on here is not the way to go. Write down all you have and hand over to people who will look into this from an informed and unbiased position.
 
There is only one thing I really need to know, which could be answered by any vet without any kind of issue. That is, should a sedative be administered before using Somulose? In a non-emergency situation, where the euthanasia was planned.

And fwiw, I have always previously had my horses shot - by the knacker man, who has always done an impeccable job. Unfortunately, as I have said before, I allowed myself to be persuaded by the vet I trusted and who subsequently caused the whole sorry mess. It will not happen again to any of my animals. However I think the practice need to make sure it doesn't happen to anyone else's animal either, and that means having a back up protocol.
 
I would say standard protocol should dictate yes, but it doesn't always. My friends horse wasn't sedated before being shot... I really can't recall if ebony was or not, but she went calmly. If you want a definitive you need to ask what official guidelines are, check the link 'advice on euthanasia' it's a sticky on this forum, that may have the answer but all you are really going to get on here are opinions.... I know there are certainly other practices who do not sedate as standard.
 
my horse was sedated before the injection

i really feel for you OP - ive had mine PTS a couple of months ago and she went peacefully - was still traumatic so i cannot imagine what you went through x
 
My horse wasnt sedated before she was injected - nor did we insert a catheter, which we would normally do. Apart from a moment where we thought she might go over backwards,as she suddenly sank backwards with stiff front legs, it was fine and she went as quietly as most of them do. Mine was planned (but only so far as "if shes not significantly better tomorrow then I am going to call it a day")

Im really sorry to have seen what you went through, but no two vets do things the same (though there are often certain protocols for practices) and as others have said, its not really a very fair thing to do to another vet to ask them about what they would do.

Talk to the RVC, follow their protocol for complaints. I truly hope you can find closure on this soon so you can grieve properly :(
 
I'm sorry you and your horse had such a terrible parting. I have heard of this happening occasionally with injection method.

In my experience, vets have always administered two injections, the second being the lethal one.
 
I have seen a chicken PTS by lethal injection, and because it is not possible to find a vein on them, they are injected into the muscle and struggle around for a rather large period of time until they die because the medication is not administered IV.

There are a lot of questions to be asked here, and personally I would be allowing the RCVS to ask them. i.e. Was your horse catheterised into the vein?
 
I have had two pts via injection, both emergencys. One was sedated other not. The one who wasn't sedated took longer for him go. But this could be due to lots of factors.
 
there are no requirements to either catheterise a horse or sedate it before giving a lethal injection. Every vet has their own preferences. Unfortunately sometimes things dont go as they should - every animal responds differently to the drugs depending on how good their circulation is, age, any underlying illness etc.
 
You need to report this to the RCVS complaints committee. They will go through the event with a fine tooth comb and through the practise and make sure the vet in question is upto date with his courses procedures etc.


Ive seen one with and one without - the one without had a broken shoulder, foreleg swinging in the wind and was rearing vertical so it wasnt possible to take your time - nor to shoot which is usually my preference.
 
To instigate cardiac arrest the drug has to be injected completely between 10-15 secs, if this is not done, cardiace arrest will be delayed, possibly what happened to your lil mare.
 
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