Are there any rules for kids travelling in the living of a lorry

[Fools Motto]

As above.
Moving horse tomorrow, and fully suspect the kids will come too! One is on a booster seat, the other two are not, but one of which is not mine.
Umm, what to do?

 

[Casey76]

Certainly illegal in France.

 

[buddylove]

Surely they will need to be in proper seats with the age appropriate restraints?

 

[3Beasties]

I 'think' it's legal as long as there is a cut through from cab to living, doesn't mean I'd be happy doing it though!

ETA - Nope, I was wrong - Illegal if under the age of 12.

 

[Shilasdair]

As above.
Moving horse tomorrow, and fully suspect the kids will come too! One is on a booster seat, the other two are not, but one of which is not mine.
Umm, what to do?

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...6/A_guide_for_horsebox_and_trailer_owners.pdf

Page 23.
S

 

[sunnyone]

I'm pretty sure it's against the law. There was a thread on here last year about several lorries being stopped on the way to a show and the police having words to the effect of choose to carry on but leave your children here at the roadside or take them wherever you like but leave the lorry here.
Apologies for not finding the thread for you, but as you are going tomorrow you may not get a swift response with the link.

 

[cptrayes]

Test case was taken recently by an hho member on unrestrained passengers in the living of a lorry. They won, I think on the basis that there is no demonstrable danger to people from traveling in a horse lorry living without a seat belt. I have no idea if this would also apply to children, but if general seat belt law does not apply, then I don't see why not.

 

[Fools Motto]

Trouble is, I'm sure there isn't any seat belts in the living. Does anyone here have 'portable mini mascots' and a lorry - what do you do?

 

[khalswitz]

I'm sure I remember reading that the law is that sideways facing seating without seat belts in a living that is cutaway to the cab is legal. However I don't know about under 16/18's.

 

[Slightly Foxed]

It depends on the age of the lorry. If newish, I don't know from which year, you must have seat belts in the living to be legal. How many of us do??

 

[Clannad48]

I don't know whether it is legal or not but not something I would consider doing, child or adult. The main thing I think that you have to consider is whether you could live with yourself if something happened. OTT I know but it is a possibility, you may drive perfectly safely and slowly but you can't rely on the rest of the driving population to do the same sadly.

 

[khalswitz]

Ah, here is the guidelines on children:

"If you intend to carry children aged 12 years or under, the seat belt wearing regulations require them to use a suitable child restraint. You should bear in mind that child restraints cannot be fitted to side facing seats. In order to fit the required child restraints, you would need to have forward or rearward facing seats with full three point seat belts."

With adults, as long as there is no danger to passengers due to items in the cut-through living area, then it is legal to carry passengers in the living with no belts - however it is advised against.

 

[Fools Motto]

Ah, here is the guidelines on children:

"If you intend to carry children aged 12 years or under, the seat belt wearing regulations require them to use a suitable child restraint. You should bear in mind that child restraints cannot be fitted to side facing seats. In order to fit the required child restraints, you would need to have forward or rearward facing seats with full three point seat belts."

With adults, as long as there is no danger to passengers due to items in the cut-through living area, then it is legal to carry passengers in the living with no belts - however it is advised against.

Thank you. Good to know. I'll have to make other arrangements!

 

[Double_choc_lab]

How times have changed. In the 70s going to shows you would have 10 to 12 horses head to tail with no partitions and kids and tack all in the Luton together.

 

[hoggedmane]

How times have changed. In the 70s going to shows you would have 10 to 12 horses head to tail with no partitions and kids and tack all in the Luton together.

We used to go everywhere like that when I was aged 8-12ish.

 

[khalswitz]

I know people who still go everywhere like that... :S

 

[WelshD]

I'd only carry children in front seats, any adults could risk their necks in the living if they so choose

As a child i was in the living area of a lorry with friends and stupidly tried to open the top of the living area door to let some fresh air in - the top door dragged me through the bottom door and sent me airbourne from the lorry, i dont remember the rest of that day. Its not just accidents you need to worry about its largely unsupervised kids

 

[pennyturner]

We used to carry the kids in the living, but that was before the child seats regs changed. The lorry was so old it didn't have (or legally require) belts, even in the front.

The child safety seat rules are a nightmare for a large family. With 6 kids it's next to impossible to take them anywhere legally, let alone in a lorry.

BTW my H&S risk assessment concluded the safest place for them was probably in the luton, unless you were heading under a low bridge...

 

[khalswitz]

BTW my H&S risk assessment concluded the safest place for them was probably in the luton, unless you were heading under a low bridge...

That's assuming no force from behind (say another vehicle hitting you at speed) to send them hurtling from the luton to the floor... Also assuming lorry doesn't tip in an accident.

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

BTW my H&S risk assessment concluded the safest place for them was probably in the luton, unless you were heading under a low bridge...

Ha!
I 'lost' my daughter off the luton when driving over the Quantocks en-route to Exford - she was asleep & rolled off when I had to stop on a steep hill & go into crawler gear - very cross 11yr old with bruised bum! :biggrin3:

 

[foraday]

From October 2014 new laws come in force for NEW BUILDS!

This is going to effect EVERY horse lorry builder!

All seats must have seat belts fitted!

Secondly there will be no CUT THROUGHS either! UNLESS the horsebox builder has crash tested their beloved 250k brand new horse box with the appropriate testers and get the certificate to then build!!!!

The only GET out really is to buy an old lorry as laws do not apply or get an old chassis and refit coach build on top!

I have never seen such a market for old lorries!

My friend has seen loads of interest in her oakleys! Even the arabs are buying old lorries so they can have their grooms on board! Normally they have brand new oakleys! But of course putting in for a build now will not be completed until after the laws come in so that is it, cannot do!

If you have an old lorry hang on to it as there will be a serious market for them even for 'scrap' if coach built as they will simply take the horse part off the chassis and put on an pre 14 plate!

 

[Orangehorse]

From October 2014 new laws come in force for NEW BUILDS!

This is going to effect EVERY horse lorry builder!

All seats must have seat belts fitted!

Secondly there will be no CUT THROUGHS either! UNLESS the horsebox builder has crash tested their beloved 250k brand new horse box with the appropriate testers and get the certificate to then build!!!!

The only GET out really is to buy an old lorry as laws do not apply or get an old chassis and refit coach build on top!

I have never seen such a market for old lorries!

My friend has seen loads of interest in her oakleys! Even the arabs are buying old lorries so they can have their grooms on board! Normally they have brand new oakleys! But of course putting in for a build now will not be completed until after the laws come in so that is it, cannot do!

If you have an old lorry hang on to it as there will be a serious market for them even for 'scrap' if coach built as they will simply take the horse part off the chassis and put on an pre 14 plate!

Another case of the law of Unintended Consequences.

 

[dieseldog]

You dont have to wear seatbelts in the front? Or has the law changed?

 

[khalswitz]

Depend on the age of the lorry. There is a guide on the Dvla website - certain ages have certain restrictions on which seats need belts.