Are vets still about the care or more about the profit?

[Apercrumbie]

While I do have to sit down every time I see a vet bill, I have to say ours are pretty good. My horses tend to get ill over Christmas, just to be helpful of course, but the vet tried to time each call out so it wouldn't cost too much. She was very honest about which tests were worth doing and which ones weren't. Another at the practice also spent hours with my horse when he was extremely ill. I cannot rate my vet practice highly enough.

Our small animal vet does seem to be more profit driven, but the vets themselves clearly adore animals and are very good.

 

[hnmisty]

My dad was the total opposite when he worked in practice. He'd tell the owners to buy something from the pharmacy but he found they wanted a big fat bill!

He's worked for DEFRA now for about 30 years, hates the institution but finds the welfare cases satisfying (he's good at them) and likes the farmers. He'll do overtime (like tonight, overseeing cattle being evacuated from the levels) not so much for the money but to help the farmers and the animals.

He's my dad, so obviously I'm biased, but I think he's a great vet

The equine vet we used at home is good, he said my old girl had mild Cushing's but she was doing just fine so no point medicating.

 

[avthechav]

Apologies as I have only skimmed through this thread but I would imagine for most vets its about both. I dont see how you can be a vet without it being about the care...the hours are too long and the worklife balance too rubbish for it not to be. My lovely vet saw my horse trot up at 9am on a Sat as a favour for me. (Wanted a reassessment but couldnt get daylight time off work in week in winter and didnt have anywhere suitable and lit for a trot up), when I rocked up he had already been out on two non-emergency calls to fit people in around their commitments!

However how can it not also be about the profit too? It is their livelyhood afterall. I'm a teacher and although I dont do it only for the money, I wouldnt do it without the money. I do think with most vets if you are honest about what and how far you are prepared to go/spend they are accomodating.

Maybe I have always just been lucky!

 

[Kitei]

Our small animals vet clinic is fantastic, and purely care-driven. I did approach them about the horses, but they said that, whilst the 'company' do include farm animals, they recommended I went to another vet (gave me contact information for said vet) as they felt their level of training with equines was superior to their own. Yup, they refused 3 horses because they wanted me to get the best care for them.

They were fabulous with my cat, when he was hit by a car and fractured his pelvis.

Summer just been, my mother's dog scratched his eye and dived into water infected with blue algae (un-signposted). He was dreadfully sick for days, and both eyes ulcerated. Dog was uninsured, and vet was fantastic. She charged £5 per consultation (and, actually, did some of them free-of-charge), rather than the usual £35, and was very apologetic that she had to charge her full price for the drugs she needed. (My parents were, at this point, in a tight spot financially) She did her very best with him, and saw him weekly for almost 3 months. When my mum first took him to them, the prognosis was that he was likely to lose one eyes, and be partially blind in the other, but thanks to the dedicated care and attention that our vet gave him, he regained 100% vision in both eyes, with no scarring. She was absolutely fantastic, and we're very grateful to her. Money was definitely not her objective; we ended up paying maybe £350 less than we should have done, possibly more.

I trust them 100% to always put my animal's needs before their own profit. Am a bit sorry I don't have my horses with them, really; would love to support them further!

 

[Bedlam]

The problem is we're too used to our own healthcare being free. We'd rather pay a plumber to come out to a burst pipe in the middle of the night than a vet to a colic.

Come on guys - of course they are running businesses! You wouldn't work for free or discount willy nilly for whatever it is that you do - so why on earth should they? Who pays them if you don't? Your GP gets paid by the NHS....your vet doesn't. Doesn't mean you GP cares any more about you than your vet cares about your horse.

 

[Spring Feather]

All of the vets I use are most definitely about giving the very best care (and I deal with many vets). If they weren't, I would not hesitate to dump them.

 

[Murphy88]

Bedlam has hit the nail on the head. Maybe if we all had to pay for healthcare then we'd have even the vaguest idea what it costs to run a health care business. Each consultation fee is is paying nurses/receptionists wages, bills, buying equipment, and on and on and on.

I earn £1200 a month. No extras on top of that. Today I had a lie in and started work at 6am, and finished work at 9pm. Lunch is a rare occurrence. Tomorrow, I'll have to start at 5.30am to have my patients done. I work every day of the week. At peak foaling season, I expect to be starting at 4.30am and finishing at 10pm. I am doing this to further my career and because I want to be the best vet I can. Certainly the equine vet sector in the uk is increasingly following the internship pathway where most new grads that want to do equine will have to spend a year or 2 working themselves to the bone to get a foot on the equine vet ladder.

I work in the USA at the moment, and while we have clients that can't afford large bills, I have not heard anyone complain about the cost of a bill, and we are talking $1000s of dollars for most cases. That is cause over here people realise the cost that goes into running a veterinary practice, and also realise that vets are professionals who have spent a lot of time (and money) studying, and should be able to charge for their services as such.

 

[SatansLittleHelper]

Personally I find my vet brilliant. Never pushes expensive treatments/tests/diagnostics and will happily tell you that you are wasting money doing X, Y and Z when something simple will do. Have always been able to do payment plans for bigger bills too.
They have a living to make and families to feed too...!!!

 

[Pale Rider]

Definitely profit, no question.

 

[Polonaise]

A vet cannot ethically refuse to PTS ANY animal that is bought in to see them

A particular vet may refuse to pts in certain circumstances but must then arrange euthanasia with another vet in a timely fashion.

 

[rara007]

I think Murphy88 has good points

 

[JanetGeorge]

Certainly the equine vet sector in the uk is increasingly following the internship pathway where most new grads that want to do equine will have to spend a year or 2 working themselves to the bone to get a foot on the equine vet ladder.

SO true! My vet (who is brilliant with horses) is Senior Partner of a general practice (when he started being my vet he was the most junior underling!) Back then there were no equine practices within 30 miles. His biggest problem is keeping junior vets who are GOOD with horses for more than 18 months - and then they run off to an internship with Rossdales or one of the other equine specialists. The other senior vets are cattle, or pet vets, and pretty useless with horses!

And the problem is exacerbated by the advances in veterinary science - vets can't keep up with horses if they don't do a lot of horse work. I now have a deal with MY vet in that if I have a horse who is in trouble - and he's off duty - I can call him at home rather than relying on a vet who WON'T know what's wrong (if I know, I can tell them what to do!)

Any vet HAS to have at least part of his mind on 'profit' - or the practice would go broke. And if he's honest, he'll give you a couple of options and tell you which is most likely to give you a good result - and which will be most expensive!

 

[hnmisty]

This generation of vets will be lucky to buy into partnership at all. With wages starting at £20k, how on earth are they expected to buy into a practice without help from family/a lottery win/living off bread and butter?

My dad saw an influx of Spanish vets at DEFRA about 15 years ago, now he says lots of them are Lithuanian.

 

[Jsye]

At the moment i'm musing this too.
Had vet out for injections and asked to have a look at horse and he wasnt 'quite right' on his back end last week. Vet thinks he now has laminitis in front and has prescribed box rest + bute and said i NEED blood tests AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

Horse isn't fat, has no fat pads, has no lami rings in feet. Hes TB who has recently gone barefoot (i explained this) and he has thin soles so he feels his feet without his boots on. Vet seemed to ignore me saying all of this and said that he was concerned about his footy-ness and thinks he is laminitic. Obviously his feet are warmer than a shod horse as there is more blood flow. No obvious digital pulses in his legs.

My farrier doesn't think he has it, and now i'm just thinking its a money making tactic. I definitely think something is happening in his back end, possible arthritis maybe in his hocks. I just don't like how this vet seemed to completely ignore everything i told him about MY horse - I know him best!

Another vet is out tuesday for these blood tests but I'm gonna get a second opinion off him before he takes the blood. Urgh.

Edit to say : I don't mind paying for all of this i don't resent the bill. I just wish this *certain* vet would listen to me and at least see him trot up in his hoof boots. I just felt like he completely ignored me and watched my horse as if he had solid rock crunching feet when in fact he has really poor feet. :-(

 

[wench]

I've come across vets who will screw their clients out of every last penny they can on the insurance.

A couple of years ago I had a vet out to X-ray some parts of my horse. I asked for a hock to be xrayed, whilst the vet was there, at an extra £10, I wanted to see if it was ok. Vet refused and said there was nothing wrong.

Guess what there was something in there and I had to foot another bill for the vet coming out with X-ray machine and if they had done what I'd asked in the first place it would have saved me a whole pile of cash.

I am now insistent with vets, and they will do exactly what I want doing, no more, no less

 

[sarahann1]

My vets are great, 100% about care and very supportive of trying different things to solve a problem, they are very happy to chat through various options of what might be wrong and what treatments may or may not help. They happily listen to what you have to say about your horse and what's 'normal' for the horse. Can you tell I really like my vets

In some ways their lack of money drive is a pest because getting invoices out of them can be a tricky!

 

[putasocinit]

Senior vet came out for inections, new pony was petrified of him, not sure if its a male thing or vets, anyhow vet was as petrified of the pony, resulting in the needle hanging out of his skin whilst vet ran out of stable in fear of being kicked telling me to hold rearing pony and squirt the contents in, he didnt introduce himself to the pony in the beginning just walked up to him and grabbed his skin, he also forgot to bring his vet stamp with to do the passport, subsequently i used different vets for the 2nd injection with more success.

And charged me two call outs at the same yard on the same day at the same time to do two horses. They have lost my business

 

[RaposadeGengibre]

When I was working/seeing in the surgeries (well over 5 years ago), the vets, Ive been in touch with, were more after care, not profit and quite often waiving consultation fees in really small case or owners panic. But again, they are an old school and prob retired by now (one definitely is).
After being back in the country, I had to pay a visit to a vet after my greyhound run through a hedge and managed to cut his skin almost invisibly under his coat (considering he is a bare a*se dog). I saw it only after the sod became feverish and had a nice little pocket (to my excuse, we had our stuff delivered so ve been running around like headless chicken). Went to vets (first I saw in the town) for a/b. We have been there literally less than 5 min (seriously - there is a wound, there is a pocket, thermometer on the bum, done) and were charged "by the book" - my initial shock after being back. Needless to say, after I started asking around and peeps actually didnt recommend that surgery.
The vet back in Portugal never charged me through the nose and quite often I would get stuff or prescription for "diy". But she is "a one man band" with really small clinic. Once (and only) I had to go to a different surgery - again, the very same sod had an experience with very popular there processing caterpillars just before Christmas, when my usual vet was off. Admittedly, it WAS pristine, with overnight kennels, theatre, separate consultation room and reception, washing facilities.. beautiful!(and a two men band actually). But apart from shamelessly trying to move us to his surgery, charging for everything and anything, he misdiagnosed the problem even after I repeatedly told him the situation which could (and would!) potentially kill the pup. I didnt insist thinking the chap has grown up in this country, studied here, may be he is correct but did squeeze some bits "just in case"(luckily didnt need it). Yeah! From very early morning OH was running around trying to find an open pharmacy to get something to at least keep the poor dog hydrated and reduce allergic reaction.

 

[honetpot]

I am a nurse and at one point I worked on a cruise ship, it was staffed by 3 RGN, and a doctor, with sick bay, full pharmacy and equipment.
I was astounded by the amount of people that went on board without their normal medication, sea sickness pills, and basic medication even if the trip was booked well in advance. They were horrified when they were charged £50 to see a doctor, even through they should be able to claim back on their travel insurance. What they could not understand was their fees paid for all the equipment just in case it was needed and most of the drugs would end up destroyed when they went past their use by date.
Thirty years ago my vets call out fee was £18, which covered also covered the first half hour of the consultation, equine hospital were virtually unheard of and there really were very few diagnostic tests apart from x-ray, two vets I used worked from home. Now they would have at least to have a small surgery, staff , have to follow loads of rules regarding clinical waste, storing of dangerous substances , the dreaded H&S and that before they buy equipment and put a car on the road. Its like an iceberg, the customer only see a small part.
The only thing I wish is that they would fully inform the customer of their choices, often newish horse owners feel pressured to have everything done when often there may be a less costly way. I think insurance companies have also influenced costs, they are out to make money so its in their interests to publicise expensive treatments so you take out the insurance and then the vets feel they can spend the budget. My advice is always to shop around and ask the price, I will often check with the office staff as some vets have no idea about the billing.

 

[Zero00000]

I do think with some vets it is more about the money.

I use 3 vets for my small animals, Vet A is fantastic for my rabbits but a bit of a drive away Vet B I prefer there after care when neuter/spaying Vet C is closer and I use for my other animals.

Recently took my 6yo rescue cat to Vet C due to blood in eye and swollen belly, vet saw and felt tumours in the cat, despite my wishes vet pushed for xray and ultrasound to confirm, to which I eventually agreed, to then be told it wouldnt be for another 12 days,
That day came, it came back he was full of tumours as was always thought, I was told there cancerour or benign there would be no need to do a biopsy as either way it was inoperable, I didnt want my cat to suffer but they pushed for further appointments, 'take him home, watch him like a hawk' by this point I was too angry to care and took him to Vet A, who took one feel of him and agreed my choice to have him humanely PTS was the best option, I played with him, gave him some treats and he gently fell to sleep.

I was going to persue the other vet, I had to pay out for meds, xray and ultra sound and prolong my cats suffering, but having lost his brother 2 months before as well, I simply did not want to lengthen it and carry on bringing up all the memories, losing a family member was hard enough.

 

[smiles24]

Definately care. When my vet makes sure he's on the end of a phone for me when I'm at Rossdales having my youngster put to sleep, just incase I need someone to talk to that's caring.