Are we over supplementing?

Sanversera

Sanversera

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I've read that some supplements for humans are actually harmful, linked to cancers or heart attack. I'm now wondering if always supplementing our horses with balancers or herbs is actually a good thing.
 
I really only feed supplements on vet’s recommendations/if it’s actually needed and I’m not a fan of mixing them. For a supplement to have an effect it must be unsaturated and therefore able to react, so I don’t mix them (usually) to avoid any reactions with other supplements. But that’s just my personal overthinking.

I’m really in the school of thought that, for the most part, as long as they have access to varied grazing, horses will usually pick what they want when they need it (particularly natives).

Horses have survived for millennia without us feeding them supplements, even while under human care, so why should we start stuffing them with random stuff unless they actually need it?

ETA: I’m not saying we shouldn’t supplement at all, but I think it’s a good idea to consult a vet first and do some solid research. Plus, only using it if it’s actually needed. Effectively equivalent to asking a GP/pharmacist what they would recommend/what’s effective for you.
 
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I feed supplements and will continue to. Surviving is very different to thriving, especially if we are asking more of them than simply being in a field. And in my mind, there are many supplements doing a lot of good to a lot of horse's and humans.

ETA: Obviously some care needs to be taken & I'd alway research including contra-indications and get advice from a specialist if in doubt before feeding.

Of course over supplementation can be harmful but too much of anything can be harmful to animals and humans - I mean, it's possible to kill oneself through drinking too much water but I wouldn't recommend not drinking any water as a direct response to that (especially if you exercise) ...
 
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Don't take the ones that are linked to heart attacks and cancer. I doubt its Boots Multi-vitamins on 3 for 2 that are giving people cancer, which is what most balancers are equivalent to.

There are problems with the legalities around what can and can't be called a supplement in humans. People were taking flipping ivermectin and calling it a supplement. But just use your brain a bit.
 
Depends what supplements you're talking about doesn't it? Pretty much all farm animals need additional minerals, depending on what's missing in the soil and on their blood tests. For example my goats need additional copper - pretty much standard for goats, it's how they are - while my sheep also need it in smaller amounts as our land is deficient. This despite having about 42 different plant species in the grazing (last count) and a kilometre of native mixed hedgerows. I doubt anyone anywhere in the UK has completely balanced land, especially when it's single species grazing/monoculture grass and not necessarily managed ideally.

So I don't see why horses should be any different. Blood test and find out if it worries you.
 
I’d be more concerned about the fact that supplement companies are so unregulated and can sell pretty much anything as a supplement with no legal obligation to specify how much of each thing is included. As long as you list ingredients that’s fine!! It’s such a scam!

Could be 0.1g or 10g of something so what is included could be totally ineffective. Also very few do any sort of research to evaluate the effects.

I have far more respect for supplements that specifically say what amounts they include and have some independent research on their benefits..if it’s not there I don’t buy it.

Also it’s up to owners to do due diligence and find out if there is a possibility of too much of one ingredient etc if they are supplementing a lot, although a few companies will advise you.
 
Bobthecob15 said:
I’d be more concerned about the fact that supplement companies are so unregulated and can sell pretty much anything as a supplement with no legal obligation to specify how much of each thing is included. As long as you list ingredients that’s fine!! It’s such a scam!

Could be 0.1g or 10g of something so what is included could be totally ineffective. Also very few do any sort of research to evaluate the effects.

I have far more respect for supplements that specifically say what amounts they include and have some independent research on their benefits..if it’s not there I don’t buy it.

Also it’s up to owners to do due diligence and find out if there is a possibility of too much of one ingredient etc if they are supplementing a lot, although a few companies will advise you.
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I agree 💯%
 
Owners need to do proper due diligence: why are you supplementing, is there clinical evidence to substantiate why a product/ingrediant will help, and is the packaging transparent about the precise ingredients (there are sublties in the terms used which affects the quality of the ingredients) and content per recommended serving. Fillers are not necessarily bad, they be so you can feed 25gms (and not 22 for example, ie so they can use standard scoops) or they may keep ingredients apart as they don't interact well with each other.
 
We have learned over the years not to feed ready mixed supplements, because it is likely that a minor, unnecessary ingredient will cause an unwanted reaction.
Now we supplement with single ingredients only, so that we can monitor carefully any reactions and recognise their effects.
 
Blood testing will give a general idea however I know from my own personal experience that blood tests don’t show the whole picture. I’ve had countless blood tests, always come back as ‘normal’ however I’m a changed woman since supplementing with vitamin d & k2, magnesium and iron every day for the past 18 months.
 
In animals though they do tend to be more useful - certainly pinpointing which of the major minerals are low. They're not used as diagnostics for anything else unlike human tests from the GP. Failing a blood test, get a forage analysis done although again this won't give you the whole picture.

If your horse has a specific condition such as EMS, PPID etc then you have a head start as to what you might need to supplement. But I don't think a scoop of a decent all round balancer from a reputable manufacturer (e.g. Forageplus) who have done the work behind it, is going to give anyone's horse cancer.

Fwiw it's the OVER supplementation in humans that can cause issues according to some research. That's different to saying all supplements. I need more vitamin D. Nobody knows why as I'm outdoors all the time. I just do. But I wouldn't have known if my GP hadn't been suspicious and done a test.
 
Nudibranch said:
Fwiw it's the OVER supplementation in humans that can cause issues according to some research. That's different to saying all supplements. I need more vitamin D. Nobody knows why as I'm outdoors all the time. I just do. But I wouldn't have known if my GP hadn't been suspicious and done a test.
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Same here, I was told that some of us just don't absorb it well as we get older. I've been told to take it for life.
 
My position on this is a healthy scepticism that many of these supplements are required or do any good in the quantities supplied. That being said I do feed a basic joint supplement and recently added linseed oil to help combat rainscald. But some of the recipes for mixing feeds are bordering on cordon bleu and dread to think how much people are shelling out!
 
I’m sure some people with the money and time probably do.

We give ours a good quality vitamin and mineral supplement. Plus then anything medically needed. So the head shaker gets a head shaking supplement. Older ones might get a joint supplement and/or Boswellia as needed.

Most get vitamins and minerals only, in a token handful of feed.
 
I've recently done a revamp of what I feed my boys and I've taken a long hard look at the supplements I was using, and found that a few crossed over, so I've dropped those.

The ones I am sticking to have a valid reason, have been vet approved and I can see a difference (as can others) when my boys don't have them.

I feed MSM for joints, Biotin as both boys can do with a hand with their feet, Actigen which is for tummies as Rabbit is prone to loose stools, and Baggs prone to ulcers and then some Turmeric to disguise the taste of the other supplements :) I buy my supplements (bar the Turmeric!) from Progressive Earth so I know that they don't have any bulk or fillers in them :)

I think over-supplementation of things like herbs etc isn't as harmful as over-supplementation of things like iron, selenium etc x
 
Ros Canter was asked this question at Blenheim yesterday. Walter is out 24/7 and fed grass nuts twice a day. A bit of comp mix before big events. She doesn't feed any supplements at all.

Their grass is managed with daily poo picking and fed depending on which horses are in which fields.

We are victims of marketing!
 
marmalade76 said:
Same here, I was told that some of us just don't absorb it well as we get older. I've been told to take it for life.
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Only 10 % of our Vitamin D comes from diet, so it's more likely that our skin cells are just lazy buggers at manufacturing Pro-Vitamin D3 or converting to Pre-Vitamin D3. The metabolism of the latter (to D3 itself) relies on heat and I'm always cold, so maybe that's it? Fellow Vitamin D pill popper, here. I was deficient in JULY!

My YO is a real sceptic about supplements. It drives her mad that some people on the yard are feeding herbs (no idea why it should bother her!). Mine just get a complete feed (Pure Easy) and I add in brewer's yeast and linseed for condition and sweet itch.
 
Fransurrey said:
Only 10 % of our Vitamin D comes from diet, so it's more likely that our skin cells are just lazy buggers at manufacturing Pro-Vitamin D3 or converting to Pre-Vitamin D3. The metabolism of the latter (to D3 itself) relies on heat and I'm always cold, so maybe that's it? Fellow Vitamin D pill popper, here. I was deficient in JULY!

My YO is a real sceptic about supplements. It drives her mad that some people on the yard are feeding herbs (no idea why it should bother her!). Mine just get a complete feed (Pure Easy) and I add in brewer's yeast and linseed for condition and sweet itch.
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I do like the Pure feeds! Mine has been on Pure fibre balance for a year and a half and I do love that I don’t need to add anything to it..and that it’s one bag!

I do feed a joint supplement though as my mare has arthritis…although I have done my research and feed one that has sufficient levels of the key ingredients x
 
Bobthecob15 said:
I do like the Pure feeds! Mine has been on Pure fibre balance for a year and a half and I do love that I don’t need to add anything to it..and that it’s one bag!

I do feed a joint supplement though as my mare has arthritis…although I have done my research and feed one that has sufficient levels of the key ingredients x
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Can I ask which joint supplement you feed please.
 
I think it can be worth analysing forage. I've had some very odd results from grass on the glacial drift around me, including one with iodine so high it wouldn't be safe for broodmares full stop and I was advised to feed hay all year round with my gelding. Mostly, it won't show anything really bad, but it's usually interesting. I feel that since we often keep them on the same bit of land for extended periods it can be worth supplementing to correct the worst imbalances, or at least sourcing hay from an area likely to have different mineral ratios.
 
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I’m on a livery yard where the tack room is full to brim with supplements. If you are feeding a good quality feed that suits what your horse’s type/workload is with good quality, ideally ad-lib, forage, I do not see the need to be giving them every single supplement/herb under the sun. Obviously every horse is an individual and may need some extra joint support, or may be nutritionally deficient in something else such as zinc, copper or calcium, and it is more than ok to supplement these when proven that your horse has these issues (ie through blood tests). I find that people often give supplements for the sake of giving them, with no evidence that the horse needs it, or worse, without doing their own research into them further than a simple google search. That then poses the question of, is it doing more harm than good in terms of disruption of microbiomes etc? Especially as I know a lot of people are bulk buying raw materials such as herbs like mint etc., rather than using the ready made supplements by feed companies. At least if you are going to use supplements, use ones that are manufactured to a standard and are guaranteed to have what it says on the tin in a given quantity than feeding your own ‘natural’ remedy that isn’t guaranteed to have X amount of mineral in Y amount of weight.
 
What I find odd is the term 'balancer'. Is there such a product called 'Balancer'? How can something be a balancer when it's not tailored to the individual?

Supplements are whopping business I am sure, and since forums, that business has obviously grown to an indecent level. Companies check out forums to see what is recommended, so that they know what to produce.
 
I’m a sucker for a supplement can’t deny it. Currently youngster is on Ulsoothe as has history of ulcers and colic surgery, Magic calmer because his behaviour has been previously challenging, PE Hoof Balancer because he’s barefoot and his feet are easily chipped. Vit E for muscle function as just restarting ridden work and balancer not yet fed at full dose as building up due to taste being a potential issue.

Other horse is on Rigcalm at the moment due to field change issues but probably will come off that when finished. Nothing else at the moment.
 
I only feed a balancer + salt.
2 years(ish) ago I stopped the balancer after reading all the ' is it really necessary' stuff.
That winter my cob suffered 3 separate abcesses, different feet, so not one that just didn't heal.
Put him back on the balancer & not had one since (frantically touching wood 🤣)
 
I am a sucker for a supplement - and something that smells good haha. I once got the Garlic, parsley and Linseed oil because I smelt it in the tackroom and thought my boys deserved something so delicious smelling!

I feed pretty basically - a basic lite chaff, with TB health musli mixed in to make it interesting (and to make the bag last longer because it is ££££££) as a base, lite & lean balancer, YuMove (which smells fishy and awful), Vit E (which smells like paint stripper) and a little scoop of my herb mixture (because it smells so good!). One gets a bute a day too for his arthritis - but adding the YuMove has made a world of difference to him <3

I probably don't need to give the herby mix due to what's in the musli, but once it's mixed, they don't get much of that per feed.

I also suuplement with carrots and apples because they LOVE them, and why shouldn't they have something they love <3
 
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