Argh why can’t I push my bum back?

J

Jingleballs

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I can do it on the ground, I know in my head what I’m supposed to do but when jumping I just cannot get myself to do it!

Instead, I tend to stand in my stirrups or sit too upright – examples here http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=366334 - these jumps are tiny but at home we're working on jumping 2'3 to 2'6 so nothing big and I don't feel insecure - in fact XC instructor said I was pretty much in balance with him.

My friend is giving me lessons at the moment – we are currently focusing on getting pony more forward going so that it’s easier for me just to go with him over the fence and I just need to sit and hold him together and give with my hands when he jumps but I would appreciate any tips on how I can work on my own position!

I have no idea how it’s supposed to feel – when I did ride round with my bum back it felt very odd but maybe it’s just something I need to get used to? It seems to come so naturally to other people and it’s really frustrating me that I can’t get it right :(
 
I found it helpful to practice my jumping postion in walk,trot and canter before actually jumping, you could even start at a halt with someone holding your horse for you
 
Benji1 said:
I found it helpful to practice my jumping postion in walk,trot and canter before actually jumping, you could even start at a halt with someone holding your horse for you
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Thanks - as random as it sounds I may get my friend to sort my position in walk and them film me riding w/t/c in that position so I know how it feels.

I normally do dressage so I'm so used to sitting deep with nice long legs that it feels odd to ride round with what feels like my bum sticking up in the air!
 
Instead of just "pushing your bum back" think of it as a single move that tips your hips back and up and your shoulders forward and down (like a kettle being poured like this!) This will create the profile you are after whilst allowing you to keep your balance like this :D :D :D
 
Oooh like the kettle comparison *now has images of riding round the arena chanting "I am a kettle, I am a kettle"*
 
Thinking of pushing your bum back is the wrong way of going about it- you need a more secure lower leg position and you need to fold and take your shoulders a little more forward from the waist
 
Yep I always taught to think of it as folding from the hips and dropping down to meet your horse, well done by the way!
 
Change your saddle (if your still using the one from your past post) then concentrate on your jumping position.

You will never be able to acheive what you want, jumping in the saddle, just not designed for the job, you can't put your stirrups up, nor can you slide your bum back, there not cut out for a jumping in.
 
Someone on here posted a few weeks ago that think of your jumping position like going for a wee on a public toilet, you know how you crouch so not to touch the seat leant fowards.....this has really stuck in my head and my jumping postition is much better! So thanks who ever posted that!!
 
As your instructor said, you look ballanced.Our position is however dictated to some degree by the size and conformation of our pony/horse. With an upright sort of action and straight sholder, it is harder to get the sort of position you would like.If you shorten your stirrups a couple of holes,it will help. But you will also have to work on your leg muscles as well. A neat ballanced two point position is incredibly hard work .Ride a bit shorter hacking out and gradualy build up the strength in your legs, it wont happen over night.And dont worry too much ,your instructor obviously thinks your not doing a bad job.:)
 
Thanks for all the tips!

Mike007 - you think I should pop the stirrups up a hole? I was riding a little shorter and my friend/instructor told me to put them back down as I looked perched??

Kenzo - interested as to why you think the saddle won't help? It's a T4 GP so should be fine for the heights I'm jumping. I've always felt secure in it - my jumping position is much more secure in that than the WH I used to have.
 
I think Kenzo made a good point about the saddle,but I suspect you are limited a bit by what will fit him. It is important that a saddle fits the rider too.
 
i stuggled with this, but what really helped was putting my stirrups shorter and keeping my lower leg forward and heel down (more like a hunting seat?) whilst going over the jump
 
Mike007 said:
I think Kenzo made a good point about the saddle,but I suspect you are limited a bit by what will fit him. It is important that a saddle fits the rider too.
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Yes he is hard to fit - I've gone through about 5 saddles in a year and this is the best GP fit we can get - his dressage saddle is a much better fit for both of us.

As I said, 2'6 is the max we'll do so it's not a major issue.

Can I ask, what exactly do people think is wrong with the saddle in relation to my own shape?

I do have very long legs which can be a problem in a 17' saddle - tried the cob version of the T4 and me knees were hanging over the knee rolls!
 
Sorry, overlapping posts here. You will look perched ,to start with,but it is the best way to get the strength in your legs.As I said ,try hacking out like that ,for a while,to get the strength and coordination,maybe even go up another couple in a week or two.This is not for jumping ,this is an exercise for you. When riding try not to sit in the saddle too much but a bit like a jockey. Then when you are fit enough ,you will find a decentposition relatively easy.
 
The best thing that worked for me was trotting and cantering around the school, with my instructor on the ground shouting 'fold' 'sit up' 'fold' sometimes for 5-10 minutes non stop... also standing up in your stirrups and finding your centre of gravity/balance will help to strengthen your leg muscles, and when you fold, make the fold from your hips and be conscious that if the horse was taken away from underneath you, you would land on your feet- so your bum almost counteracts the weight of your shoulders, head and upper body.
 
Babybear said:
Thanks for all the tips!

Mike007 - you think I should pop the stirrups up a hole? I was riding a little shorter and my friend/instructor told me to put them back down as I looked perched??

Kenzo - interested as to why you think the saddle won't help? It's a T4 GP so should be fine for the heights I'm jumping. I've always felt secure in it - my jumping position is much more secure in that than the WH I used to have.
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Because its a T4 GP thats why.

I was not knocking the type or make of saddle you choose to ride in or what fits your cob best, I'm not one of these that thinks '' oh it's cheapo saddle, you need an expensive jumping saddle to jump properly in'' that is not what I meant.

Where the stirrup bars are, the knee rolls, the seat...practically everything on that particular model goes against obtaining a good jumping position, all I'm pointing out is that it may not always be you, the saddle will have alot to do with it.
 
Thanks Mike - I'll do that!!!

Planning on hacking tonight so will whack them up a hole or two - incidently, when I was riding shorter I could feel the spring more in my knees and ankles if that makes sense!
 
Kenzo said:
Because its a T4 GP thats why.

I was not knocking the type or make of saddle you choose to ride in or what fits your cob best, I'm not one of these that thinks '' oh it's cheapo saddle, you need an expensive jumping saddle to jump properly in'' that is not what I meant.

Where the stirrup bars are, the knee rolls, the seat...practically everything on that particular model goes against obtaining a good jumping position, all I'm pointing out is that it may not always be you, the saddle will have alot to do with it.
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Oh no I absolutely didn't think you were having a go about the type of saddle at all! :) I was just interested in why this was not thought to be a good saddle for jumping.

Unfortunately, coblet changes shape a lot and the thorowgood saddles have been a godsend after constantly buying new saddles for him.

If I have to put up with a less than perfect (but still reasonably secure) jumping position in order to have a saddle that fits him then that's fine - it's good to know thought that it's not all down to my **** riding lol!
 
The saddle,I must confess to being rather old fashioned in what I like. Your pony doesnt really have enough back to take a much larger saddle.I would prefer less of a deep seat on it so that you can move back without getting too high out of the saddle.I would want it a bit more forward cut,but you are limited in this by his sholders.I think there is still a lot you can achieve position wise in this saddle though
 
Babybear said:
Oh no I absolutely didn't think you were having a go about the type of saddle at all! :) I was just interested in why this was not thought to be a good saddle for jumping.

Unfortunately, coblet changes shape a lot and the thorowgood saddles have been a godsend after constantly buying new saddles for him.

If I have to put up with a less than perfect (but still reasonably secure) jumping position in order to have a saddle that fits him then that's fine - it's good to know thought that it's not all down to my **** riding lol!
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Ok, just didnt want you taking offence thats all, I know some people do lol and what I said may of come across the wrong way, which it wasnt meant to.

They do a cob style that is more forward cut though, its the lastest one, just in case you were not aware, so if you did fancy something that you know will fit your cob but want to do more jumping in the future, it maybe worth trying one, I think if you were ever in the postition to try another saddle (more forward cut) you'd probably see what mean on my previous post. :)
 
Babybear said:
Thanks Mike - I'll do that!!!

Planning on hacking tonight so will whack them up a hole or two - incidently, when I was riding shorter I could feel the spring more in my knees and ankles if that makes sense!
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As with all exercise, dont overdo it. It is the quality of the position you hold ,that will determine which muscles build up.It is no advantage if you shorten them and simply stand up straight.
 
Kenzo said:
Ok, just didnt want you taking offence thats all, I know some people do lol and what I said may of come across the wrong way, which it wasnt meant to.

They do a cob style that is more forward cut though, its the lastest one, just in case you were not aware, so if you did fancy something that you know will fit your cob but want to do more jumping in the future, it maybe worth trying one, I think if you were ever in the postition to try another saddle (more forward cut) you'd probably see what mean on my previous post. :)
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Thank you - I did read about the new cob version - the original one was really forward cut and strangely narrow at the front- so much so that it really impeded his huge shoulders so we just went for the standard version.

TBH, jumping will only ever be a fun hobby - dressage is a better discipline for both of us (because I'm a wuss and don't like falling off) but it's good to know that if we ever did decided to take it more seriously there are other adjustable saddle options!
 
Mike007 said:
As with all exercise, dont overdo it. It is the quality of the position you hold ,that will determine which muscles build up.It is no advantage if you shorten them and simply stand up straight.
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Noted!! Will just pop them up one hole, the same length I was originally riding at and practice short periods of my jumping position tonight. :)

Thank you so much everyone for you advise - it really is appreciated!
 
"**** riding" , my a***;) you dont give yourself enough credit. i think because he was so down hill and often used to nosedive after fences, causing you to fall off, you have developed a position that is secure to you and defensive. Its also harder to balance in a jumping position on a smaller horse if you are tall - as i have found out. i actually think your riding is pretty darn good woman - as you have adopted a style that enables you to stay on over the fence and not interfere with the horse.

i guarantee if you jumped Finn, your position would be more what you are looking for in yourself. bigger horse, jumping saddle with flatter seat... have you thought about having a jump on someone elses horses to see?

one thing i really found helped me(but i still dont think its comparing apples with apples here) was hacking at jumping length and trotting and staying in 'rise' - balancing for as many strides as you can, not using your hands to balance. it really strengthened my lower leg.
 
Thanks N - yes I've had to develop a slightly defensive seat - I'm hoping that once we get him more uphill he'll come up better in front making it easier for me to move with him - he is actually miles better in front of a bigger jump but seems to refuse to put the effort in to a small one.

Nat had suggested I get lessons on one of her horses to fell how a horse should jump which I might just do!

Will be practicing the trotting exercise tonight on our hack (poor pony thought he was getting a day off too :D)
 
neversaynever's suggestion is the same she suggested to me ages ago and i def think it helped me get a more secure lower leg ;) although i tend to do it in canter work :)

ditto too about it being a secure position that works for you guys :) that's what it actually boils down too - getting safely over withpout hindering the horse - which you do :) oh - and come and try jumping HRH one day :D i bet it feels a million miles apart from Mr C - the horse def makes a difference :)
 
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