Arthritis and cold snap

[pottamus]

Hi my lad has arthritis which seems to have flared up this year. He is doing well however this cold snap (minus 4 last night) seems to have set him back a bit. He was a lot stiffer coming out of his stable this morning whereas yesterday he was walking well in the field and bucking when I went to get him in. The ground has frozen solid overnight and has hard ruts so I just wondered how this affected yours with arthritis.
I find it all a worry to be honest and just trying to cope with it as best we can...so all advice welcome. Thanks

 

[Noodlebug]

My mare has been suffering with her foot! She had a crack in it and the blacksmith cut it away. That was about 4 weeks ago and she has been stiff on this ever since. When it was warmer at the beginning of the week she was sound and there was no heat in her leg but since its turned colder she definately stiffer on it and I am now thinking it could be arthritis and not the actual foot if that makes sense.

 

[mynutmeg]

Unfortunately it's normal for arthritis to worsen in cold snaps (and just changing weather in general). If it's lower leg then try some bandages or chaps to keep the area warm, otherwise just make sure he's kept as warm as possible and maintain your normal management. If he's really suffering then maybe talk to your vet about trying some low level bute or similar to help him cope

 

[1stclassalan]

Unfortunately it's normal for arthritis to worsen in cold snaps (and just changing weather in general).

Speaking as someone ( and of course someone who can actually speak ) who has severe arithritis - 50% loss of movement in both wrists, elbows but luckily just incredible pain the knees and feet! The weather hardly affects it at all - the only thing that is NORMAL for my arthritis and the weather is - I can guarrantee that it's the first subject of conversation!!! As far as I'm concerned - it's a myth.

When you come to think about it - why should it have any effect? What is there about a drop of rain that cause the body to feel anything apart from being wet? My body is about 87% water, most of the time it is surrounded by air containing a large proportion of humidity - that fact that certain weather conditions make the air loose it's water in the form of rain doesn't make much difference to the general principle. Temperature might have some effects but my circulation is good, I don't spend much time sitting about ( I even exercise sitting at the keyboard!) but my feet have been painful for years and are either boiling hot or freezing cold without much connection to the weather so that's puzzling.

What you have to bear in mind when it comes to ALL medical diagnosis is - the data is collected by Doctors and they are among the foremost box tickers of all time - the joke is that they are anxious to put you in one.... and one way or another - they do. Hahah.

While I'm on the subject - it doesn't matter what I eat either - my disease is completely non-dietectic - with the possible exception of large amounts of red wine - which is a disaster!!!

talk to your vet about trying some low level bute or similar to help him cope

I was one of the last people to be prescribed Bute - it works wonderfully, but only masks the problem a best - proper arthritis is one's own immune system attacking what it's supposed to be protecting and once it starts it usually carries on going. The upside of horses not living as long as humans is that most avoid degenerative disease - children do develop the problem but in the main it's a disease of older and particularly previously damaged folk.

 

[mynutmeg]

it's a disease of older and particularly previously damaged folk.

The later part is me

I suppose it depends on the type of arthritis - I'm guessing from the wide spread that you have rheumatoid arthritis. I had (just had more surgery to treat) severe osteoarthritis to both ankles due to trauma and always found that a change in weather made me much sorer and stiffer. I don't know why (have heard theorys on air pressure, temp change etc) but it is something I find makes a difference. I'm definately worse in the winter than in the summer.

Osteoarthritis isn't the immune system attacking the body - it's wear and tear. The body will re-model the joint to some extent due to inflammation so anti-inflammatories can slow down the progress of osteoarthritis a bit but the main reason for giving it is to control symptoms and relieve pain.

 

[HashRouge]

My mare was quite stiff when she came out of the stable this morning. Her arthritis is in the coffin joint, so lower leg, and is just down to general wear and tear. It seems like the combination of cold weather and hard ground does make her stiffer, and I suspect the fact that when it is very cold she stays in at night doesn't help either. But then, her field is very exposed and it was so bitterly cold with that wind last night that I don't think she'd have been very happy staying out! I just try to make sure that she gets as much time out as possible, and a few days off until it gets warmer. She isn't really ridden much anyway atm, though we do a lot of long reining and walking out in hand, so I'm happy to let her have a holiday until it warms up if she needs it

 

[1stclassalan]

The later part is me

Sorry to hear that - it's a pain eh!

I suppose it depends on the type of arthritis - I'm guessing from the wide spread that you have rheumatoid arthritis.

The laughable proper name for my type is - non-sero ( or sero-negative) which basically means the serum test shows NOTHING! But I nevertheless display inflammed and painful joints - hence the "itis" which means irritated - and it certainly irritates the hell out of me! Oh and BTW "arthro" stands for joint I think - as in arthropod.

So from this you may deduce that the entire array of medical science is at a COMPLETE LOSS as to what is actually causing my problems - but I really do have them and they've thought up a really cool sciencey name for it! This in iteself is quite good for doctors in general because they usually think you are mad if you complain about things they can't immediately see!

Osteoarthritis isn't the immune system attacking the body - it's wear and tear.

This is both right and wrong.

By my understanding, it's the immune system that decides what one's body is in shape and operation and attempts to keep things ticking along in the manner it found when it first switched on - so for ANYTHING bad to occur - something has gone wrong with it first. Thus a damaged joint is not perfectly repaired but left in a condition that causes further inflammation and this in turn encourages a vicious spiral of yet more eccentric repair.

The body will re-model the joint to some extent

The immune system has a copy of one's original DNA as a reference - when working properly it should rebuild any joint or organ perfectly - as it doesn't - there are imperfections in the system AND degenerative diseases of the system itself - we have NO IDEA what they are or how they work - hardly anyone is looking.

......so anti-inflammatories can slow down the progress of osteoarthritis a bit but the main reason for giving it is to control symptoms and relieve pain.

Quite so, but my symptoms overwhelming react to the amount of work / rest that I have as compared with the weather element - temperature is far more operative but affects me in both extremes of heat or cold.

 

[coffeeandabagel]

my horse hasant read the report saying that he has osteoarthritis but in spite of being warm under his rugs he was stiffer coming for his hay this morning than any other day since he has been turned out 24/7 (nearly a month now) and its the coldest windiest day we have had, but dry. So I would say cold does effect it!

BTW - he is only 8 this year and has it very badly in his sacroilliac joints and neck. If he is still sore tomorrow he will get bute for breakfast.

 

[1stclassalan]

my horse hasant read the report saying that he has osteoarthritis but in spite of being warm under his rugs he was stiffer coming for his hay this morning than any other day since he has been turned out 24/7 (nearly a month now) and its the coldest windiest day we have had, but dry. So I would say cold does effect it!

BTW - he is only 8 this year and has it very badly in his sacroilliac joints and neck. If he is still sore tomorrow he will get bute for breakfast.

Yeh, get your point about him not reading it - haha. But how do you tell that he is stiff / stiffer in his neck? I could understand if you said - feet because lamenes is much more noticeable and more easily quantifiable - but necks? Do tell?

 

[coffeeandabagel]

he is 17.1 hh and long backed. Today instead of flowing down the hill he stumbled and, dont laugh, had a different expression on his face. The biggest problem is his SI joint not the neck - and that really affects how he copes with slopes.

 

[mynutmeg]

Sorry to hear that - it's a pain eh!

The laughable proper name for my type is - non-sero ( or sero-negative) which basically means the serum test shows NOTHING! But I nevertheless display inflammed and painful joints - hence the "itis" which means irritated - and it certainly irritates the hell out of me! Oh and BTW "arthro" stands for joint I think - as in arthropod.

So from this you may deduce that the entire array of medical science is at a COMPLETE LOSS as to what is actually causing my problems - but I really do have them and they've thought up a really cool sciencey name for it! This in iteself is quite good for doctors in general because they usually think you are mad if you complain about things they can't immediately see!

This is both right and wrong.

By my understanding, it's the immune system that decides what one's body is in shape and operation and attempts to keep things ticking along in the manner it found when it first switched on - so for ANYTHING bad to occur - something has gone wrong with it first. Thus a damaged joint is not perfectly repaired but left in a condition that causes further inflammation and this in turn encourages a vicious spiral of yet more eccentric repair.

The immune system has a copy of one's original DNA as a reference - when working properly it should rebuild any joint or organ perfectly - as it doesn't - there are imperfections in the system AND degenerative diseases of the system itself - we have NO IDEA what they are or how they work - hardly anyone is looking.

Quite so, but my symptoms overwhelming react to the amount of work / rest that I have as compared with the weather element - temperature is far more operative but affects me in both extremes of heat or cold.

It's my own fault for sitting on mad tb types I got off lightly given what happened and my current should be the last round of surgery for a while and should pretty much get rid of the arthritis as there is no longer any joint
The medical community are quite good at not being able to diagnois and well done for getting them to twig that it's physical and not mental - thats a very big uphill struggle often.

A lot of the degenerative disease (certainly within DNA) is due to the telomeres shortening every time the cell reproduces. It's a lot to do with small mutations happening during the reproduction of the DNA and those not being picked up by the cellular processes designed to correct any mistakes and over time these accumulate. Unfortunately although the processes of this degeneration is for the most part understood we don't have any way of correcting the damage. As you said there are also other processes that are not well understood at all.

Appologies to OP for a slight drift off-track

 

[1stclassalan]

A lot of the degenerative disease (certainly within DNA) is due to the telomeres shortening every time the cell reproduces. It's a lot to do with small mutations happening during the reproduction of the DNA and those not being picked up by the cellular processes designed to correct any mistakes and over time these accumulate. Unfortunately although the processes of this degeneration is for the most part understood we don't have any way of correcting the damage. As you said there are also other processes that are not well understood at all.

Oh ho,ho, "telomeres" is not a word on everyone's lips - what do you do for a living may I ask? Feel free to pm if it's a secret or something the animal rights folk will burn your house down for!

I always equate the "mistakes" in translation from the DNA unwinding and the two strands of RNA constructing new helix to old builders plans being left on the table during several lunches, folded and opened many times until little holes appear - and then asking around the site who can read the small print!

 

[Irishbabygirl]

My arthritic old boy has been quite stiff lately - in fact I've spoken to the vet and we've decided to keep him on a bute a day now to keep him comfortable.
I also keep him out 24/7 as much as possible which helps him but I do have a huge mudless field surrounded by natural shelter which I'm very lucky with so know its not an option for everyone.

 

[mynutmeg]

Oh ho,ho, "telomeres" is not a word on everyone's lips - what do you do for a living may I ask? Feel free to pm if it's a secret or something the animal rights folk will burn your house down for!

I always equate the "mistakes" in translation from the DNA unwinding and the two strands of RNA constructing new helix to old builders plans being left on the table during several lunches, folded and opened many times until little holes appear - and then asking around the site who can read the small print!

At the moment I'm a ward clerk but am studying through the OU to get into med school with a view to start next year if I can get in

I like your analogy

 

[1stclassalan]

At the moment I'm a ward clerk but am studying through the OU to get into med school with a view to start next year if I can get in

I like your analogy

Well done you - and for the record I like your avatar horse - does he comes in a slightly bigger size?

Woops - I've just clicked your photos! Apologies to Roo whom I now see is a mare!

How high?

 

[mynutmeg]

Well done you - and for the record I like your avatar horse - does he comes in a slightly bigger size?

Woops - I've just clicked your photos! Apologies to Roo whom I now see is a mare!

How high?

have pm'd you - we seem to have slightly hijacked the original thread (sorry op )

 

[melbiswas]

As a Domiciliary Physio, visiting mainly elderly patients, I can confirm that the weather does seem to affect some arthritis sufferers (as well as some with neurological problems).
Sometimes it is the cold, for others it is a change in the weather.

It has been reported enough for studies to be carried out which looked into temperature, atmospheric pressure, humidity etc and I understand no correlation has been found.

My patients don't seem to agree with this!

 

[mynutmeg]

As a Domiciliary Physio, visiting mainly elderly patients, I can confirm that the weather does seem to affect some arthritis sufferers (as well as some with neurological problems).
Sometimes it is the cold, for others it is a change in the weather.

It has been reported enough for studies to be carried out which looked into temperature, atmospheric pressure, humidity etc and I understand no correlation has been found.

My patients don't seem to agree with this!

it makes you wonder what criteria they are using to determine whether these things are having an effect.
Some of these studies do need to listen to anacdotal evidence from patients

 

[4x4]

Well I suffer from not medically determined arthritis and it is stiffer when it is colder, today I have sported several new pains in the wrist and elbow. A friend of mine had that sero-negative arthritis and she had various drugs prescribed for it, I don;t know what she was taking at the time but she died when her aortic valve ruptured. No-one ever found out if it was drug related or not. Has anyone had any success with cider vinegar for either horse or prson?

 

[Jojo_Pea4]

Mine has it in his hocks, he has had some stiff days but more when ridden than walking out in the field. I was expecting him to be really bad tonight but he was normal.

I find with my boy he struggles more in the heat and my dog is stiff in extremely cold and very hot days. But his routine is the same everyday i just keep him well rugged on cold days.

I am thinking of starting magnetics boots on the stiff days.