At my wits end trying to find something to keep condition!

[liss1987]

Hi, I have a 21 year old TB who was given to me as a rescue who i managed to get looking good this summer, but he really struggles through winter.

He is currently being fed speedibeet, calm and condition and blue chip every day but his withers are like a shark fin and he has no fat at all over the top of his ribs and his bum.

He has cushings disease which he is on prascend for, and has mild arthritis. I have tried so many different feeds on him over the months to try and keep a nice amount of weight on him but nothing except sunshine and summer grass seems to keep the weight on him.

Can someone who has had a similar experience with their TB please advise me on what I can use, regardless of cost, to help keep his weight on him? its horrible seeing him look so scrawny and shabby

Below is a photo of him summer just gone looking great and then one taken of him about 2 weeks ago looking not so great

 

[ellie11987]

My choice would be ready mash extra and micronised linseed split into many small meals as you can. Plus ad lib haylage. Good luck

Edit: is he barefoot? (are they over-reach boots or hoof boots? Can't see properly in pic) If he is then look at ERS pellets with speedibeet and linseed.

 

[Mrs_Wishkabibble]

Simple Systems Lucie Nuts are the only thing I find keeps weight on my 23 year old TB
I think Dengie do the same called Alfalfa pellets.

I soak them and mix with soaked unmolassed beet, Hi Fi and conditioning cubes and adlib hay.

 

[TwoStroke]

Does he have enough good quality forage, and can he eat it ok - teeth up to date? Any other possible health issues such as ulcers?

I wouldn't ride him until he picks up, tbh.

If he does well on summer grass, have you tried the red bag grass nuts from simple systems? You can soak them into a mash to make them easier to eat for oldies.

Other than that you could add something like yea sacc to help his digestion, and micronised linseed and/or rice bran for extra calories.

 

[liss1987]

thanks for your replies guys,

hes barely been ridden during winter, hence the simple boots wasnt worth shoeing him if he wasnt being ridden.

theres lots of good food options for me to look into there, his teeth are fine and hes up to date on worming, he has unlimited hay and he does eat a lot of it, but he bloody loves grass and sometimes snubs it for the poor quality 'end of winter' grass that is growing at the moment. why he prefers that to all the lovely sweet hay i dont know! (the other horses cannot get enough of it)

if i feed him near a nice patch of grass, he will stop eating his food and go for the grass instead, so i have to feed him on concrete.

hes been on blue chip for a while and it has done nothing. i am so disappointed as id heard so many good things about it

 

[Firewell]

I'd def try the grass nuts then! I've never tried them myself but it would seem to make sense. Its been a long hard winter. Is he warm enough? My TB has 3 rugs on in this freezing weather.
Equijewel is a good supplement for weight gain.

 

[liss1987]

Yes I think the grass nuts are the next thing on my list!

 

[liss1987]

And he's in a big thick heavy weight with neck at the mo as its so cold, sometimes I put a fleece under too but he's always nice and warm if I put my hand under so I assume he's toasty

 

[Queenbee]

thanks for your replies guys,

hes barely been ridden during winter, hence the simple boots wasnt worth shoeing him if he wasnt being ridden.

theres lots of good food options for me to look into there, his teeth are fine and hes up to date on worming, he has unlimited hay and he does eat a lot of it, but he bloody loves grass and sometimes snubs it for the poor quality 'end of winter' grass that is growing at the moment. why he prefers that to all the lovely sweet hay i dont know! (the other horses cannot get enough of it)

if i feed him near a nice patch of grass, he will stop eating his food and go for the grass instead, so i have to feed him on concrete.

hes been on blue chip for a while and it has done nothing. i am so disappointed as id heard so many good things about it

No offence hun, it aint worth shoeing anyway its false economy.

I would stick something like:

Timothy chop (simple systems)
Copra or Linseed meal
Vitamin E
Speedie beet


down his neck...

If you do not see the increase weight wise you would like, add more of the linseed and copra.

Ensure worming and teeth are done.

Ad lib haylage or hay and three or more feeds a day at the moment.


edited to say ****** the grass nuts... he needs proper calories, linseed/rice bran or copra

 

[Queenbee]

My choice would be ready mash extra and micronised linseed split into many small meals as you can. Plus ad lib haylage. Good luck

Edit: is he barefoot? (are they over-reach boots or hoof boots? Can't see properly in pic) If he is then look at ERS pellets with speedibeet and linseed.

if he is barefoot dont touch ready mash extra... way too much starch

 

[maccachic]

The top photo is that how he normally stands? If so I would look at balance of feet and any pain / compensatory issues.

Oil is great for getting calories into horses (how ever introduce it really slowly) and most skinny horses are not getting sufficient calories.

 

[TwoStroke]

Queenbee, the red bag grass nuts have decent energy levels and plenty of protein (much better than Timothy chop ); they are a good base for horses that do well on spring grass. You can only feed so much linseed etc, but the grass nuts are a conserved forage and should be tasty enough to tempt him to eat up.

OP, it sounds like he's out as grass 24/7? Is it possible to bring him in for a few hours a day to focus on a good feed and some haylage?

If not imo the key is finding a fibre feed that tempts him more than the grass, which is why I suggested the spring grass nuts. Then you can add an oil based supplement in for extra calories, like linseed or rice bran (equijewel or omega rice from falcon feeds, maybe).

 

[HazyXmas]

I would also be wanting to stable him. If it's not possible for him to be in overnight, then at least 6-7 hours during the day so that he can rest properly & eat in peace away form other horses.

3 feeds a day & ad-lib haylage. I'm another fan of linseed, speedie beet & oil, maybe with the grass nuts?

We might have another month of this weather & he doesn't look as though he'd cope with that at the moment.

Good luck.

 

[amandaco2]

tones of hay- as much as he can eat
add linseed meal, ers pellets, linseed and oil on top. releve and grass nuts can also help.
check teeth and worming status too!

 

[Crazy Friesian]

I have a Connie that I bought over a year ago. I had known the pony previously before I bought him and had noted that in the 6 months I had not seen him he had lost a little bit of weight. Didn't think a huge amount about it, put it down to the rubbish summer etc... Shortly after I bought him I noticed that he was still continuing to drop off. By now we were half way throughout winter. The grazing wasn't good. I put it down to the moving and other circumstances not relevant here.

Having history with this guy I knew how well he used to look and on what diet (very plain, no cereal, sugar etc). But given that he obviously wasn't thriving now I changed his diet.

He was always on ad lib hay anyway. But I included Equijewel, Fibremash, linseed, Top Chop, balancers (btw wouldn't touch them!) etc. You name it, I tried it with this guy - supplements such as Pink Powder, protexin, charcoal, herbs.... I had nutritionists and vets involved. Teeth were checked, worming program etc. Eventually the vets decided it was time to have him in and scope and blood test him. "All" they found was a huge bot burden - a total shock to me and very embarrassing. Given that I didn't know what his worming programme had been before I bought him, it was possible that something was missed in that time. That was duly dealt with and so we carried on...

I hoped the spring grass would put some weight on him and put him in my orchard with all the lovely herbages etc...Nope... Still no weight gain. He was worm counted... No problems there... By now I was tearing my hair out. Even the vets were stumped.

This was a young pony who should have been backed and having a great time going out and about (though I never put pressure on any of my horses, it has to be said) But I was frustrated as I couldn't even think about starting work with him looking like a hat rack and no energy to boot.

A friend suggested I tried a supplement by Alltech - LifeForce. I have always been wary of these supplements - apart from the potential cost of them. I have other horses and a budget! This is a Connie for goodness sake! They are supposed to live off fresh air! LOL So yep - skeptical is NOT the word...

But by now I had nothing to lose. I had tried everything I possibly could.

All I can say is, it worked! It bloody worked! I noticed within the first week that he was brighter. He started to put weight on by the end of the first month. He has continued to put weight on and his attitude to life has just done a total 180. So much so that I took the plunge and turned him out with my stallion who needed a friend after I lost my old lad last year.

This was something I wouldn't have considered before incase he got stressed and dropped weight off that he couldn't afford to lose! I wish I had known about this supplement while my old lad was alive as I always struggled to keep weight on him.


March last year


Mid Jan this year


February this year

I would say that if you have tried everything else, you have nothing to lose. For all the supplements and feeds I tried with him, vets bills etc, the cost of LifeForce turned out to be cheaper and more effective.

 

[magusequus]

Hi
Had TB with weight issue myself tried simple systems and grass nuts at huge cost to no avail, I then had an equine nutritionalist out and she advised a feeding programme for him which was beet, Winergy equilibrium condition and vegtable oil, she gave specific amounts including require hay weight to feed and checked in on his progress which was fab he put lods of weight and muscle on, he literally was a different looking horse she was £60 for the consultation however saved me a fortune in feed experiments have fed two other rescue TB's the same since and had same results. Due to his condition might be worth getting her out google Clare MacLeod or look for Equine nutritionalist in your area

 

[CalllyH]

I would again second life force by Alltech, the horse I ride had dropped alot of weight over winter and ad libbing is fine but empty calories sometimes and found there wasn't a Need to do this when she started using Lifeforce. we were given a free sample of it and it helped hugely, definatley a convert here.

Definatley worth looking at.

 

[lisagaleotalanza]

alfa oil
linseed
soya flakes
vit/min supplement

 

[Jesstickle]

I am struggling too. Mine always picks up really well once the grass comes in so am thinking grass nuts might be the way forward for her too.

Currently she is on calm and condition with a good measure of linseed chucked in, ad lib haylage and plenty of high fibre nuts in her snack ball and she still looks naff.

Do you have to soak grass nuts or can you feed them dry?

 

[liss1987]

I spoke to simple systems and because of his cushings they recommended not giving him grass pellets (cushings horses are prone to laminitis) but they have given me some feeds he can have which will hopefully get him to put on weight
He does have problems with his feet, but when that first photo was taken he was recovering from an abscess so it may be why he was standing a little off and he was also on a hill.
He can be brought in in the nights but he prefers to be out as he gets agitated when stabled as he's lonely as none of the other horses are stabled. He gets unlimited haylage, we have a massive feeder that is always full and he gets 2 feeds a day.
I'm tempted to try the supplement that the lady with a Connie tried as I have literally tried everything like she did, spent a fortune on vets etc and never found any problems other than his cushings (which can cause weight loss also).
You've given me lots of things to have a look into though guys so thanks for all your comments

 

[Potato!]

I have a Connie that I bought over a year ago. I had known the pony previously before I bought him and had noted that in the 6 months I had not seen him he had lost a little bit of weight. Didn't think a huge amount about it, put it down to the rubbish summer etc... Shortly after I bought him I noticed that he was still continuing to drop off. By now we were half way throughout winter. The grazing wasn't good. I put it down to the moving and other circumstances not relevant here.

Having history with this guy I knew how well he used to look and on what diet (very plain, no cereal, sugar etc). But given that he obviously wasn't thriving now I changed his diet.

He was always on ad lib hay anyway. But I included Equijewel, Fibremash, linseed, Top Chop, balancers (btw wouldn't touch them!) etc. You name it, I tried it with this guy - supplements such as Pink Powder, protexin, charcoal, herbs.... I had nutritionists and vets involved. Teeth were checked, worming program etc. Eventually the vets decided it was time to have him in and scope and blood test him. "All" they found was a huge bot burden - a total shock to me and very embarrassing. Given that I didn't know what his worming programme had been before I bought him, it was possible that something was missed in that time. That was duly dealt with and so we carried on...

I hoped the spring grass would put some weight on him and put him in my orchard with all the lovely herbages etc...Nope... Still no weight gain. He was worm counted... No problems there... By now I was tearing my hair out. Even the vets were stumped.

This was a young pony who should have been backed and having a great time going out and about (though I never put pressure on any of my horses, it has to be said) But I was frustrated as I couldn't even think about starting work with him looking like a hat rack and no energy to boot.

A friend suggested I tried a supplement by Alltech - LifeForce. I have always been wary of these supplements - apart from the potential cost of them. I have other horses and a budget! This is a Connie for goodness sake! They are supposed to live off fresh air! LOL So yep - skeptical is NOT the word...

But by now I had nothing to lose. I had tried everything I possibly could.

All I can say is, it worked! It bloody worked! I noticed within the first week that he was brighter. He started to put weight on by the end of the first month. He has continued to put weight on and his attitude to life has just done a total 180. So much so that I took the plunge and turned him out with my stallion who needed a friend after I lost my old lad last year.

This was something I wouldn't have considered before incase he got stressed and dropped weight off that he couldn't afford to lose! I wish I had known about this supplement while my old lad was alive as I always struggled to keep weight on him.


March last year


Mid Jan this year


February this year

I would say that if you have tried everything else, you have nothing to lose. For all the supplements and feeds I tried with him, vets bills etc, the cost of LifeForce turned out to be cheaper and more effective.

Omg sorry that you have been having trouble with Topper. Is that why you blocked all contact? Ive always wondered what happened to him!! If you had spoken to me i would have let you know what worming programme i'd had him on whilst i'd had him! In the 5 months that i had him he didnt drop any weight infact he put it on from the day he arrived and when you came to see him you commented on how well he was looking!

 

[Cortez]

Oil. Any vegetable oil from the supermarket, nothing fancy. Add that to the feed slowly, up to 8oz a day over several feeds, and he'll get the extra calories in a digestible form.

 

[blood_magik]

I've had good results using alfa a oil, alfabeet and baileys topline conditioning mix.

My big lad has gone from this:

to this:

Calm and condition didn't put any weight on Beau or my older boy.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Yes I think the grass nuts are the next thing on my list!

I think SS grassnuts are very over-priced. I get unbranded ones for just over £8 as opposed to almost £11 - these feed companies really annoy me.
OP, grassnuts will almost undoubtedly put weight on your horse - feed them soaked with chaff to avoid choke.

ETA - ad-lib haylage rather than hay would probably help too.

 

[Puppy]

Those of you recommending 'lifeforce', please may I ask where you buy it from? TIA.

 

[Jesstickle]

Those of you recommending 'lifeforce', please may I ask where you buy it from? TIA.

http://www.rutlandhorseextras.co.uk/

 

[Puppy]

Thanks JT

Blimey, it's not cheap, is it. I think I shall wait and see what you make of it before I buy any

 

[Beau jangles]

Have you considered a test for cushings they tend to eat like a pig but not put any weight on , maybe worth a chat with the vet over the phone see if any of the other symptoms match up , the laminitis trust are doing a voucher for free cushings test just now , I just got my boy tested and he is borderline so will develop it at one point in the future

 

[RhaLoulou]

Have had really good results with Cushings mare: Alfa oil, alfabeet, high fibre nuts, Lo cal and initially Outshine. She has put weight on over winter and I in work and now looks fab. She is 26 and her teeth are not the best. Really like the Alfa beet as you can get more water into them.

 

[Shutterbug]

Alpha A oil with conditioning cubes and linseed worked great for my boy when he dropped loads of weight while suffering from a tooth issue - the ready mash did nowt for him.