At my wit's end.... ulcers.

A good friend has put her horse onto Aloe Vera as she suspects he has ulcers and certainly shows all the signs. He is noticeably a lot happier since she put him on it and working so much better than before. Might be worth trying particularly as it is not an expensive option.
 
now_loves_mares said:
You've had lots of good information so just to echo another poster, my vet also recommended corn oil. One or two mugs a day (can't remember which :o )
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Mine said 100ml in each of the morning and night feeds - which works out at about a cupful. You can buy it online in big tins, but I am not organised enough and get Sainsbury's own which is about £1.69 a litre. They seem to be the only supermarket which do their own brand (near me anyway!)
 
Why oh why can't they talk!!!!!!!!!!!!


Ok feel completely free to discount this advice, I know I would have a few months ago, but try this lady if you are really desperate

http://www.equinebodytalk.co.uk/

Sounds barking, I completely agree, but to cut a very long story short, I have recently used her distance healing for my hanoverian youngster, who through a series of terrifying incidents had become wildly stressed about stabling and this was spilling out into other areas making my wonderfully level headed brave mare a dangerous liability to herself and others. She bust out of her box overnight in fear and was so so stressed and emotionally upset.

A series of distance treatments and the difference was amazing and quite scary frankly. Don't ask me how, but it worked. Plus information was imparted from the lady that was impossible to guess or know.

Freaked me out, but I was desperate to de-stress my horse.

I'm not a fluffy tree hugger, not really into this kind of thing before and only went to her as I met her through sharing a yard for a brief time.

Probably opening myself up for ridicule, but I have a calm, happy, unstressed, non weaving horse, whereas before I had a seriously traumatised, ultra speed weaving, non eating, rearing at door frightened mare, who had racked up £2,500 worth of injuries through her fear.
 
AVOID LONG TERM USE OF ULCER MEDICATIONS

They either turn off the acid-making machinery in the stomach or they neutralize acid. Stomach acid is a necessary component of your horse's immune system, destroying harmful pathogens that your horse picks up from the ground. Acid is also necessary to start protein digestion.

http://gettyequinenutrition.biz/Tipofthemonth/Tipofthemonth.htm
 
Hi,
Mine had grade four ulcers (which took forever to go, and I also ran out of insurance money!) which were treated he was on clam and condition before he was scoped the specialist that he needed to have his diet stripped right back. I was not even to give him feed balancers as the starch levels were too high. I was told to cut the c & c as the starch was way too high, he now only has Alfa a (unmolassed), speedi beet, high fibre nuts (only as he won’t eat otherwise) and 500mls of oil a day to put the weight back on he also has Feedmarks Ulcer calm.

I had a very successful end to the season after I changed to this so I won’t ever be changing back; the vets said that as long as he gets good quality forage that there is no need for any additives as he will be getting everything he needs for the level of work he is in.

From everything I have learned from my experience the main thing is you need to reduce as much as possible sugar and starch from their diets, I no longer give any apples carrots or mints if he gets a treat its only high fibre nuts. Its only since I changed the diet that he has started to put weight back on, he had lost a lot from the ulcers.

Fingers crossed for you that you can get the ulcers under control; you will get there I'm sure.
 
Now loves mares, yes, thanks he has access to long stem forage at all times and I always give him alfalfa before he is ridden/ worked/ travelled etc.

Doublethyme, there was a time when I thought all that was bonkers, however having met someone in a totally unrelated way my opinion did change. Thanks for the suggestion.

Maccachic, this is something that has played on my mind for quite some time. I sometimes wonder whether some of the symptoms he displays are actually down to what I am putting in him :( but then I try and take him off and he gets worse. And I'm told by my vet repeatedly the only way to manage him is on the patented form of omeprazole. Sigh.
Although very sharp and sensitive he has such a lovely nature and I just feel that is being ruined and it bothers me.

Fraggle rock, thank you for sharing your experience, I found it very interesting.

As for all the suggestions of different supplements, GermanyJo, Dressagelove, Lucie07 and anyone I may have missed out - thank you. I am very grateful for the advice and recommendations.

I think I have a plan coming together. Obviously I can only try things slowly and need to give them time to work so it's going to take some time but I intend to have him for a long time and need to find a way to make him happy - long term.
 
This may well be of no use, or repeating what others have said. My new horse a TB came to me very laid back, wonderful to handle and under saddle. after 4 weeks he was jumpy, nervous and eventually bronced in spectacular style with me...

It took some time to put it all together but it seemed likely to be related to gastric discomfort. I spoke to vets and said i was concerned about managing him for the period of starvation required before scoping (based on how his behaviour had deteriorated) and decided to try him on an 'off the shelf' supplement (Ulcer Calm), hes turned out 24/7 and gets 2 mugs of fast fibre, a decent handful of Dengie Healthy Tummy, brewers yeast and 'equibites' - he gets this twice a day - he is a totally different horse, an absolute pleasure to own and more importantly ride... I cried at the end of a lesson i had last week as he felt so fantastic! I make sure he's always warm, and has access to plenty of forage (there is some grass in the field, but we add hay 2/3 times daily or they have a big bale in the field with them.

I think the C&C has quite high starch levels, so maybe worth finiding an alternative to that? I hope you can get sorted OP, wishing you the best of luck!
 
My horse had ulcers and I treated him following GG treatment with chlorella and green clay to rebalance his hind gut. My holistic vet who suggested the chlorella and green clay regime could instantly tell he had hind gut discomfort as he was always on high alert. Link to my threads below

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=560473&highlight=chlorella

I feed him Pure Feeds working feed now and ad lib hay.

Another interesting site for you is

http://www.lunatunesfreestyles.com/horse_ulcers.htm

Hope these help :)
 
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I have to second egusin. I'm onto the second week on it and there is a marked improvement in my horse who has suspected ulcers, though I have not had him scoped as I cannot face fasting him as I'm worried it will make him colic.

He was really stressy and irritable about being groomed, rugged, girthed, and had become quite anxious about feed times. He wouldnt settle on a feed and would flit between his bucket and hay for hours.

Since being on egusin for almost 10 days now he is much less irritable, still makes faces but thats all, whereas only a week ago he was lashing out and trying to bite me when I did his rugs. He is also quite happy to be groomed now, and when i feed him he is calm and pleased to see me, rather than stressing out! He now also eats his bucket feed, licks the bucket, then goes onto his hay. I've just ordered a second tub of the SLH to get us through to the other side of Christmas and new year. It's expensive stuff, but it has definitely helped considerably with my horse though we still have quite a way to go.

Good luck.
 
Full fibre diet, literally just hay and something like fast fibre or hifi lite, then a balancer or general supplement if they need it?
Don't know much about dengie happy tummy but have heard its not as good as it sounds.
 
We here in the US have a non-prescription version of Gastrogard that is identical to it which is called Ulcergard. Problem is that it is just as pricey as Gastrogard. :(

There is an alternative that a lot of horse folks at COTH use. The nickname is blue pop rocks. It's the same active ingredient as Gastrogard (omeprazole) which is coated with a blue substance that protects the medication until it gets to the stomach and gut. The company is Indian; and the products are not exactly legal in the US. But we order them and receive them in the mail. It used to be that their product was only in one form--the blue pop rocks--; but now they also have it in a paste form. What many of us do is give it preventatively BEFORE and during high stress times. I have no idea if you can get it in UK or not, but here is the website: www.abler.com. The cost of one day's prevention treatment is $1.75, a tube of their paste is $15.75. If you use the pop rocks for treatment, they recommend 3 sachets a day, which works out about $5.25 per day.

Alfalfa is also recommended as an ulcer preventative because it is high in calcium. Papaya juice is often recommended, and there are some herbal preparations with slippery elm (Fluid Action and others) that are supposed to help.

If you have a nervous horse, IMO, ulcers can't be treated just with diet.
 
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vineyridge said:
We here in the US have a non-prescription version of Gastrogard that is identical to it which is called Ulcergard. Problem is that it is just as pricey as Gastrogard. :(

There is an alternative that a lot of horse folks at COTH use. The nickname is blue pop rocks. It's the same active ingredient as Gastrogard (omeprazole) which is coated with a blue substance that protects the medication until it gets to the stomach and gut. The company is Indian; and the products are not exactly legal in the US. But we order them and receive them in the mail. It used to be that their product was only in one form--the blue pop rocks--; but now they also have it in a paste form. What many of us do is give it preventatively BEFORE and during high stress times. I have no idea if you can get it in UK or not, but here is the website: www.abler.com. The cost of one day's prevention treatment is $1.75, a tube of their paste is $15.75. If you use the pop rocks for treatment, they recommend 3 sachets a day, which works out about $5.25 per day.

Alfalfa is also recommended as an ulcer preventative because it is high in calcium. Papaya juice is often recommended, and there are some herbal preparations with slippery elm (Fluid Action and others) that are supposed to help.

If you have a nervous horse, IMO, ulcers can't be treated just with diet.
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I don't think they are selling Ulcergard OTC here but I'm sure they're working on it. ;) Generally, medications (for horses and humans) are MUCH more stringently controlled here and don't appear in the market as quickly or as readily. Only 4/5 years ago people were raving about this just available analgesic paste, Finadyne . . .aka Banamine.;) (I had to import Furacin from Spain at great cost a few years ago!)

People do import omeprazole from the US but really, they shouldn't, as it is not available for equine use off prescription here. There have been a few discussions on here where people admit to doing it, which I always think is not so sensible.

I would also agree with your last statement - while diet can be an essential part of the solution, it is rarely all of it. And while some horses clearly do get intractable/difficult to treat ulcers, I am suspicious in many cases that there might also be an underlying stressor, such as undiagnosed unsoundness/discomfort or an environmental factor, especially if the feeding and management seems spot on. It can be very difficult - is the horse uncomfortable because it has ulcers or is whatever is making the horse uncomfortable also contributing to the ulcers?
 
TarrSteps said:
People do import omeprazole from the US but really, they shouldn't, as it is not available for equine use off prescription here. There have been a few discussions on here where people admit to doing it, which I always think is not so sensible.
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That is the point made by VR what people think they are importing from the States is actually coming from India and is just as illegal to use there as here. The only non prescription alternative to GG is ulcerguard that is available legally in the US. Most people are importing the Abler product which they assume comes from the states because of how the website is set up when if you read the small print you will see that it is dispatched from India.
 
Princessbeanie, thank you, my horse has been on Succeed for a year.

Vineyridge, thanks, I know all about the Abler products.

-- should anyone use them and want them cheap feel free to message me, I don't use them --

Tarrsteps,

"I would also agree with your last statement - while diet can be an essential part of the solution, it is rarely all of it. And while some horses clearly do get intractable/difficult to treat ulcers, I am suspicious in many cases that there might also be an underlying stressor, such as undiagnosed unsoundness/discomfort or an environmental factor, especially if the feeding and management seems spot on. It can be very difficult - is the horse uncomfortable because it has ulcers or is whatever is making the horse uncomfortable also contributing to the ulcers?
Click to expand...

I totally agree with this. After my horse had been checked by my vet I managed to get an appointment with a brilliant chiropractor (was a feat in itself seeing as she is virtually retired and doesn't see anyone new!) and she found something which was rectified and he is now a different horse in that area and so much stronger for it. I had really hoped this may have been the underlying cause of the ulcers but it appears not.
As for an environmental factor, I have my own views on what kind of yard would suit him... however this yard in my area just does not exist!! I have him at the best place available. Ideally he would live at home with me with only me handling him, where I could literally tailor every single thing to his needs. However... I don't live in the ideal world!!!

I have changed things and set wheels in motion and for now I just have to wait and see if this particular path suits him... if not, thanks to you all, I have other avenues to explore. I will do an update in a few weeks for anyone that may be interested as you have all been very kind and helpful.
For now, it's early days and I think I might be seeing positive signs.
 
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Great to read your update. I've been trying to sort out my boy since he was scoped and diagnosed with Grade 4 ulcers in November. After a month on GG the re-scope showed no real improvement, so a biopsy was taken. In the intervening time we had also had a full lameness workup and full bloods run. Nothing - not anywhere.

He is much improved in his condition, behaviour and outlook at the moment, but is still on a low dose of GG. Time will tell if he maintains this when weaned off the GG. For the moment, he is on Saracen Releve, Alfa A oil, Micronised linseed, Rice Bran oil, pink powder, magnesium and feedmark Ulcer Calm.

Threads like this are excellent. Though the fact that there are so many ways to ease the symptoms of gastric ulcers can be daunting and quite soul destroying at times, looking on the positive side, there is always something else to try.

Stoxx, it's good to hear that your boy is feeling so much more comfortable. I wish you both well at the Regionals.
 
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