Awkward pony?

[char3479]

My daughter has a lovely pony, who refuses to move in the school. Hacks out on his own happily, follows other ponies in the school happily, but won't move in the school on his own without me chasing him with a lunge whip. We've tried schooling whip, short whip, spurs, makes no odds. New saddle fitted, back x-rayed, feet scanned, regular osteopath, lessons with a qualified instructor (who also resorted to a lunge whip), teeth okay, tack fitted by a qualified fitter. Professionally broken by very experienced people we know. We adore him, he's lovely, but he refuses to move. The general consensus is that he is just stubborn. But my daughter has hit him quite hard on occasion, out of sheer frustration, and it certainly hurt, and he still refuses to move so I can't believe it's him being stubborn. Any experience or ideas much appreciated...

 

[Julie Ole Girl]

Well this is probably not helpful but I had a horse like that. He would just plant. Eventually I gave up and just sat on hom

My daughter has a lovely pony, who refuses to move in the school. Hacks out on his own happily, follows other ponies in the school happily, but won't move in the school on his own without me chasing him with a lunge whip. We've tried schooling whip, short whip, spurs, makes no odds. New saddle fitted, back x-rayed, feet scanned, regular osteopath, lessons with a qualified instructor (who also resorted to a lunge whip), teeth okay, tack fitted by a qualified fitter. Professionally broken by very experienced people we know. We adore him, he's lovely, but he refuses to move. The general consensus is that he is just stubborn. But my daughter has hit him quite hard on occasion, out of sheer frustration, and it certainly hurt, and he still refuses to move so I can't believe it's him being stubborn. Any experience or ideas much appreciated...

I had a horse line that. He just planted and refuse to move. When I gave up a d just sat there doing nothing and eventually he did move off. He must've got bored. Probably not very helpful to you though.

 

[Havital]

The only idea I have to share is never hurt an animal. Knowingly “hitting” a horse and being aware it is hurting them is never ok.

 

[Melody Grey]

Does he do it on the lunge/ loose schooled or just with a rider?

 

[char3479]

You know, I posted this and erred about mentioning the hitting, because I knew someone would simply criticise that element of the situation. I fully appreciate that sentiment, but I can assure you that it is not a regular occurrence, hence 'on occasion' and it is a child in tears and frustrated.

 

[tda]

I wonder if he's been a lead rein pony in the school, what's he like if you clip a lead on and walk with them?

 

[char3479]

Does he do it on the lunge/ loose schooled or just with a rider?

He won't move on the lunge without being chased with the whip. Likewise loose schooled.

 

[I'm Dun]

test for PSSM Type 1

 

[char3479]

I wonder if he's been a lead rein pony in the school, what's he like if you clip a lead on and walk with them?

This would make sense, but I know his full history and he's been quite a decent show pony since 3/4 yrs then we took him (I don't think he as very good under saddle, but he was super in hand)

 

[Cortez]

The only idea I have to share is never hurt an animal. Knowingly “hitting” a horse and being aware it is hurting them is never ok.

Have you ever trained a horse to do anything useful?

 

[Melody Grey]

This would make sense, but I know his full history and he's been quite a decent show pony since 3/4 yrs then we took him (I don't think he as very good under saddle, but he was super in hand)

I think you may have answered your own question there- It sounds like his confidence is in hand then. Try walking/ running alongside at an increasing distance to build his confidence.

 

[char3479]

test for PSSM Type 1

That's really interesting, thank you. He improves drastically after a good, long warm up.

 

[char3479]

I think you may have answered your own question there- It sounds like his confidence is in hand then. Try walking/ running alongside at an increasing distance to build his confidence.

I also thought that when I answered! He does like me walking next to him, and he seems to take confidence from it.

 

[tda]

I also thought that when I answered! He does like me walking next to him, and he seems to take confidence from it.

I'd do that then for a while, whilst also maybe teaching clear voice commands (from child) to get them going together

 

[Maryann]

If he will long rein that might help him get into the habit of going forward when asked.

 

[stangs]

How often is he in the school? He sounds possibly very school sour - I'd be tempted to not bring him in there for a good couple months and then try again.

Also, what happens if you warm him up hacking and then bring him into the school?

Have you ever trained a horse to do anything useful?

Regardless, children shouldn't get in the habit of hitting a horse when frustrated; it ends up becoming a go-to as they get older. Losing your temper with an animal certainly won't train it to do anything useful.

 

[char3479]

How often is he in the school? He sounds possibly very school sour - I'd be tempted to not bring him in there for a good couple months and then try again.

Also, what happens if you warm him up hacking and then bring him into the school?


Regardless, children shouldn't get in the habit of hitting a horse when frustrated; it ends up becoming a go-to as they get older. Losing your temper with an animal certainly won't train it to do anything useful.

Yes, I agree he probably could be school sour. She isn't in the habit of it. Indeed I have taken her stick away on the two/ three occasions it has happened and she is well aware it isn't the right way forward. It was desperation, hence my post on here for opinions other than the many professionals including instructors, vets and chiros who we''ve already asked.

 

[WelshD]

I’d wonder if he was fed up. So many ponies don’t see the outside of a school.
If he hacks happily maybe use that as a warm up and spend a minute or so in the school before untacking.
then build it up from there

 

[paddy555]

Professionally broken by very experienced people we know. ..

ask them to ride him in the school to try and see if the problem lies with the school or the rider. If they can get him to go in the school ask them to show your daughter what tactics to employ.

 

[GrassChop]

Interesting with the lead rein aspect. Would be good to see if he goes with someone leading him with the rider instead.
Does he show any ulcer symptoms at all?

 

[Winters100]

Could you give a bit more information. How old is your daughter and how experienced? How long have you had the pony and how was pony when you tried it? Have you tried having a more experienced child or a small adult ride the pony?

 

[Parksmum3]

I had a similar situation a lot of years so. When I was about 10years old I had a ex riding school pony on loan for 6 years, I adored him, but for approx the first 2-3 years he was like this. Fab to hack, only in company back then due to my age wether it be another horse and rider or someone walking. In the school he was absolutely brilliant as long as he was either following another horse or someone was walking next to him (he was mainly a lead rein pony whilst the riding school was open) Have me in the arena on my own was a nightmare just couldn’t get him to move. anyone on the yard had to litlery hide around the corner out of sight for any chance of me getting him to move, as if he saw anyone or any movement he would plant and that would be it. It took a lot of months just me and him in the arena standing at the gate, me trying to get him to walk on. In the end the only thing that helped was getting on him at the top end of the school so he was away from the main yard and gate and just walk half the way down the long side of the arena, build that up after a few days to attempting a 20metre circle away from the gate. This may or may not help, I was young not experienced and it took slot of time, tears and frustration but gradually over the years I could eventually ride him with people watching and even other horses in the arena. As long as it’s not pain related don’t give up hope, reward baby steps, if you get on and one day manage a few steps it’s still a step forward. good luck ?

 

[Caol Ila]

As a teenager, I had a quarter horse who was a serial planter, and once we sorted out the saddle and a number of other issues, the behaviour was still there. Yeah, I tried using brute force. I was a frustrated teen, and in the '90s, "make her do it" was the go-to approach to horsemanship. It didn't work. But there was a woman at the yard qualifyng as a TTEAM practictioner (Google it), and she took us under her wing. It was a softer, gentler approach, addressing her issues more laterally, rather than head-on confrontations. Over time, communication and confidence improved to the point where the horse no longer planted. It just went away.

My Highland has it in him to do that. I am 100% sure that he did it while in training at a pro yard (well before I bought him), and they powered through it, and now he's even more inclined to do that when he's stressed. Which is cool. Right now, I am bringing him along slowly and trying to avoid setting up situations where he's going to plant, and I'll be tempted to use force to move him forwards. The arena (while ridden... he's fine in-hand) is one of those situations, so I'm just not. When I feel like his confidence and skills in other situations, i.e. the trail, where he's happiest, has developed to the point where we can address that, I will. For me, that means the horse looking to its rider for direction, rather than gluing its feet to the floor and saying, "I am not here; this is not happening."

Today, I asked him to lead a section of track that he's not fond of, and he usually plants. When he does, OH on foot (he'll follow OH anywhere; I think he likes him more than me) or another horse will scoot in front of him. Then he'll go, nae bother. OH was just behind us, ready to scurry to the front if needed, but pony bravely led the whole scary section. He looked askance at the hay bales of doom, but he did not drop behind the leg, a warning that he's going to balk, and kept going. I was so pleased with him. I think allowing him to develop confidence at his pace is the way forward.

 

[cauda equina]

What's the surface like in the school?
One of mine hates any sort of deep going

 

[stangs]

Ditto the thought on the surface. If it's very deep, it might be uncomfortable for him to move in, especially if he's on the smaller side.

As for short term solutions, when he's planting, if she focuses on getting him to turn, on a small circle on the spot, that will stop him from being able to 'lock up' down his back. But it should be light, lots of release and little pressure. I like Mark Rashid's ideas for this type of thing. Asking head to turn one way, then releasing, and slowly building up the turn. Consequently, there's no fighting; you're 'rewarding' anything that the horse does that's mildly positive.

 

[Lipglosspukka]

When you say the pony hacks out happily, will the pony hack alone? Will the pony ride away from others out hacking?

I'm just wondering if the pony actually understands what is being asked.

 

[Berpisc]

Thinking laterally, a couple of good suggestions from Caol Ila and Parker, also you say he will hack alone well. Perhaps work on "schooling " when out on a hack; simple transitions, etc getting the pony and daughter developing a positive relationship while the pony learns to listen to your daughter. Perhaps leave going in to the school for a while if you think he is soured from being in there. You and your daughter could also do ground work exercises (you would need to supervise your daughter if she is younger as timing is very important) in the school? Have a look at Richard Maxwell/Mark Rashid (as above ) or similar stuff? Groundwork is good if done well to build up a sound relationship with your pony and things do transfer to ridden.

 

[char3479]

Interesting with the lead rein aspect. Would be good to see if he goes with someone leading him with the rider instead.
Does he show any ulcer symptoms at all?

He does go being led, sometimes reluctantly. I have suggested ulcers to the vet, but she is quite confident that he doesn't present as having ulcers. I haven't written off scoping him yet though...

 

[char3479]

What's the surface like in the school?
One of mine hates any sort of deep going

Surface is sand and carpet fibre and it could do with being levelled, but I don't think it's deep. He also does it on other surfaces, but I suppose that could be out of habit...

 

[char3479]

When you say the pony hacks out happily, will the pony hack alone? Will the pony ride away from others out hacking?

I'm just wondering if the pony actually understands what is being asked.

Yes, he does both absolutely perfectly. It's one of the reasons we love him so much.