Barefoot Geeks what do you think... nearly 3 months in

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twinkle

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Well im not new to barefoot but im no expert ither, as my first experience with it was a great success with my very laminitic pony who is now doing amazing, after having her shoes removed she was just about to be pts when i thought i would give it a go! she had 12degrees of rotation in both fronts and has prevously had roation before in both fronts from another episode a year earlier (she dont have any grass) just soaked hay is cushing and ir! she is no doing amazing and the only thing thats changed is her shoes have been removed now 2 years in and no episodes of lami (touching wood)


So moving on to Ollie who i bought on the 11th July who is a 5year old xracer he was slightly short in front but yet has amazing movement and for some mad reason i went and bought myself a lame horse with dodgy feet but he is lovely.

So he came home a week later and he was very footy over stones and didnt really want to go forward when i got on him.

So i decided to take the plunge AGAIN (after having him shod once and shoes where falling off two weeks later) so i had the shoes removed on the 29th july! He was sore, very sore stood like a laminitic when shoes where both off. He was on two bute for the first 2 weeks with boots and pads to keep him comfy and i couldnt face seeing him so sore! which did make me second guess myself!

Slowly but gradualy i took bute away (now on none was only for first 3 weeks) he has got better and better and we are now walking out on the roads with boots and pads and he is striding out were as before think a toddler could have walked faster down the road!

He is sound in his pads in trot on hard and soft but without boots is still slightly lame in trot but hes feet have still got a LONG way to go!

just thought i would post so if anyone is going threw the same thing miht take a bit of comfort in it working!

I wish i had had xrays at the beg as almost positiive he had navicular (heel pain or soft tissue damge in his foot)

heres some piccys>>

Though you would like to see wh we are talking about this is Ollie

kellysiphonepictures2012035.jpg


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kellysiphonepictures2012170.jpg

Boxy foot just after shoe pulled Left Fore
kellysiphonepictures2012185.jpg

Flat foot just after shoe pulled Right Fore
kellysiphonepictures2012173.jpg


right flat fore around 7weeks later
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right flat fore around 11 weeks later
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right flat fore around 11 weeks later
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boxy left fore around 7 weeks later( shock horror )
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boxy left fore around 11 weeks later
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boxy left fore around11 weeks later
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think is is about 7 weeks as alot different now
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he will be 3months barefoot on mon 29th
 
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Thanks guys pretty chuffed was really worried!

Did from the side in shoes just cant see it on the head on pic.
 
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1) What is the horse eating?

2) Have you ruled out ulcers?

3) Has a body worker checked him (back end in particular)?
 
Another completely naive view, from my view the box foot looks far far worse than when it was shod :confused::confused:

Come on talk me through it.... :D
 
Buds_mum said:
Another completely naive view, from my view the box foot looks far far worse than when it was shod :confused::confused:

Come on talk me through it.... :D
Click to expand...

I know nothing but from my completely foot novice point of view I thought the loading surface area had increased and in this case that would be better right? The heel was working its way down which I thought was good? :cool: that is my 'I know bu*ger all' assessment anyway. Good job people wait for the experts to come along ay :)

Ask Oberon!! Oberon!? :D

P.s Thanks for the rug - so sorry I was lame at getting back to you - she has only tried it on as I haven't clipped yet and so she is sweating just standing in the field naked :)
 
Oberon

he is feed
hifi lite
soaked hay
copper
zinc
micronised linseed
salt
yeasacc
magnesium

He hasnt been checked for ulcer as he isnt showing any signs of them! have experience with ulcers as my other horse has previously had them. so if that ever popped it horrible head up or any symtoms he would be scoped asap.

he was checked my my bowen therapist when i got him she has who picked up on left shoulder tension (boxy foot) and SI area right hind side i massage him daily to have bodyworker friend helps me.
 
Billie1007 said:
I know nothing but from my completely foot novice point of view I thought the loading surface area had increased and in this case that would be better right? The heel was working its way down which I thought was good? :cool: that is my 'I know bu*ger all' assessment anyway. Good job people wait for the experts to come along ay :)

Ask Oberon!! Oberon!? :D

P.s Thanks for the rug - so sorry I was lame at getting back to you - she has only tried it on as I haven't clipped yet and so she is sweating just standing in the field naked :)
Click to expand...

Hehe I have no idea!! Like following these posts though, i'm picking bits up :p

Glad you like the rug, hope shes forgiven you for it not being pink ;)
 
We can't see a proper view, side on, of what the boxy hoof looked like originally. So we can't see if it was better or worse before.

The shot of the boxy hoof at 7 weeks is pretty alarming. But you have to temper that view with the fact that the whole hoof is too long, which makes it look worse.

The pic at 11 weeks looks better as the hoof is getting shorter overall.

Boxy hooves can be genetic (there is some thought that improper diet inutero causes it).

Or they can develop.

Some people say it's because the leg is shorter.
Or some say it is because the STRIDE is shorter (more up and down than the other leg).
This is why I recommend investigation the body and checking for problems (often in the diagonal hind). There is a guy on the Phoenix forum (username Tommy Onions) who is really good with this stuff.

Problems come when we mess with a boxy hoof without understand why it's boxy.

All that glitters is not gold and we need to consider function over form....

This is a horse from my yard. All the interventions to his boxy hoof eventually led to navicular. He has been sound for years now and his hooves match almost 100%

http://www.progressivehorse.co.uk/html/shoko.html
 
twinkle said:
Oberon

he is feed
hifi lite
soaked hay
copper
zinc
micronised linseed
salt
yeasacc
magnesium
Click to expand...

That sounds fair :)

twinkle said:
He hasnt been checked for ulcer as he isnt showing any signs of them! have experience with ulcers as my other horse has previously had them. so if that ever popped it horrible head up or any symtoms he would be scoped asap.
Click to expand...

I just wonder with his history of racing. Sometimes gut insufficiency means they are absorbing the minerals and nutrients as well and this shows up in the hoof. If you've ruled it out, then cool :).

twinkle said:
he was checked my my bowen therapist when i got him she has who picked up on left shoulder tension (boxy foot) and SI area right hind side i massage him daily to have bodyworker friend helps me.
Click to expand...

Problem to the diagonal hind to the boxy hoof ;)
 
The boxy foot was always boxy. The toe was artificially long protected by a shoe, as you can see by how it broke straight off when he shoe was taken away. So the boxy foot is still a boxy foot. BUT

if you compare the sole shots, there is a VERY significant widening at the heels, and the bearing surface of the heel has moved backwards by a fair distance as well. It's a much healthier boxy foot than it was!

OP don't try and stop it being boxy. If it is, it is. My own experience is that boxy feet grow on horses with one leg shorter than the othe - it's a height adjustment thing. If you take height off that foot it will probably pop back up again in no time!

Things looks as if they are heading in a good direction.
 
Dear jesus bloody christ. I created an account on here JUST to tell you how hilariously terrifying you all are!!! I am sure all you keyboard warriors will like the chance to mouth your divine opinions from behind your little keyboards and mobile phone screens ;) Its always the same miserable old hags on here, copying and pasting bits and bobs to support thier god almighty opinions on their personal (godlike) takes on life - because you know, if you arent agreeing then your obviously disagreeing, everything is black and white, right?!

You guys seriously, honestly, religiously believe that that hoof looks better! Good god. Shoot the poor horse now and put it out its misery if you are going to let its feet progress like that. It sickens me. Other than that there isnt much to say on the matter. You only post on here to get nice ass licky comments saying WELL DONE WELCOME TO THE CULT!!

All you "Barefooters" are completely bonkers. There is a reason "Barefoot Trimming" isnt covered by insurance! Gives horses without shoes trimmed by a farrier a bad name!!! I mean yeah SURE there are some improvements when done correctly with x rays - but I could do the same thing using flipping x rays!!! anyone ever used x rays with a real farrier to trim the horse?! And im sat here saying I could do a better job... REALISED THATS NO DIFFERENT TO BAREFOOT AS ANYONE CAN QUALIFY OVER A WEEKEND!!!!


AAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!



(see... youve even turned ME bonkers now ;) )

lol.
 
Nooo Brightbay, let's give it something yummy like oats, a super duper conditioning mix and lots of molasses, and see what happens! :D
 
I think that troll's definitely got shoes on :D Can't feed it, haven't got a goat handy, sorry :(

Oooh, just a minute, my latest rehab had his feet balanced by remedial farriers using xrays. He was still lame. Funny, but he seems to be as sound as a pound without any shoes on - mind you his feet are a very odd shape. Perhaps I should try and make them look more symmetrical? Anyone :D ???





ps for anyone who has been concerned by elements of that post, barefoot trimmers DO have insurance and yours should have it, as it is straightforward for them to obtain and any serious trimmer will have it. And NFU is the only insurance company covering the horse itself which is raising any problems with barefoot trimmers and I believe their wording covers anyone with a proper trimming qualification (not sure about that, if you are with NFU you might check)
 
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That trimming doesn't look very good to me, feet are looking pretty ragged? Which would suggest to me that it hasn't been balanced properly.

I find oats really good for my BF TB pretty sure that balance vits / min and Lucerne cleared up an ulcer issue and he is a completly different horse this season and he is round which is something I never thought I would say about him, he is now only on chaff vits/mins and grass yay!.
 
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Very interesting pics, Im trying to learn about feet at the mo from what i can glean on here, the rockley blog and Google, why do people think the boxy foot looks worse now out of shoes?
 
cptrayes said:
Oooh, just a minute, my latest rehab had his feet balanced by remedial farriers using xrays. He was still lame. Funny, but he seems to be as sound as a pound without any shoes on snap



ps for anyone who has been concerned by elements of that post, barefoot trimmers DO have insurance and yours should have it, as it is straightforward for them to obtain and any serious trimmer will have it. And NFU is the only insurance company covering the horse itself which is raising any problems with barefoot trimmers and I believe their wording covers anyone with a proper trimming qualification (not sure about that, if you are with NFU you might check)
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petplan weren't sure when asked they would have to check with underwriters.. although they also suggested putting a claim in for barefoot as treatment go figure :rolleyes: As it is its academic as his fronts are excluded anyway :p
 
Will post some more pics tomorrow to show how much better his feet look now!
The cracking is the nail holes growing out they will split until the nail holes have grown out, which they now have!


Why I would go and shot this horse is beyond me (who's the crazy now?) as he is getting better and better
Now sound over stony paths which he wasn't in SHOES! poor horse, I would say yours should be worried if just shot it is the answer!

As for the boxy hoof. I don't want to change it nor does my very experienced trimmer. Just want it to become a more sounder heal tier foot which I believe it def is becoming no where near perfect but is going in the right direction.

Don't no if some of younarelooking properly as how can you not see the difference in the 2nd boxy foot picture where it looks like a stiletto and has now took itself down the trimmer didn't he did.
 
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HANG ON A MINUTE. From what CPT said about that boxy hoof it seems like I actually may have learnt somthing...... Thank you Obi and CPT for encouraging my interest! Love hearing from you utter hoof geeks! Ok, ok so I didn't say exactly the right thing but I did work out what was good about the 11 week old boxy (nearly..... right?). Self congratulatory post. Feel free to ignore.
 
To me, those front feet look like they have event lines a-go-go, and can anyone tell me why the hoofwall is apparently separating from the laminae? Don't look great now to me?
 
He would have event lines as the place I was at which I'm now not had a lot of grass to much of the green stuff for him to handle. He was also having dietary tweaks. Theses pictures are about 5 weeks old if not longer.
 
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