Barefoot v Shod Feet

[carmmaponys]

I honestly don't think you will find anyone who will demand that every horse will require shoes no matter what...but you WILL find plenty who will claim the exact opposite.

Unfortunately, while most people who shoe will be happy to just trim wen it suits, you will rarely find somone who is a barefoot convert preaching that shoes can be a necessary evil.....at least not till a while doen the track when a few of them realise not everything suits every horse and both practices can have their place.

Ummm is it the horses that need shoes or the owners that need for the horses to wear shoes? for reasons such as cost or the performance required of the horse. See i think i do believe pretty much all horses dont need shoes maybe with the very odd exception but at the same time whilst one horse may not be able to cope with its work load barefoot another might so yes shoes are a necassary evil sometimes in order for the horse to achieve top performance with no interuption to his schedule. I dont think it is wrong or right it is a choice, saucy nights was barefoot and raced and won there are alot of horses competeing at the top of there game, such as lucinda mcalpine who keeps all her horses naturaly and barefoot. How long it takes to get there is different for every horse and is also very dependant on owner commitment. It is fact that horses have a job to do it is fact that alot of them can do it barefoot also fact that some cant go barefoot at the performance asked from them. When we talk about barefoot it should be noted that balance is the issue with out balanced feet you cant achieve a balanced horse with healthy feet. I think that all Daeps like myself and EPs and any other hoof care providers would aggree that without owner commitment then shoes may be the better option for the owner.

 

[maggiesmum]

cult |kəlt|
noun
a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object : the cult of St. Olaf.
• a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister : a network of Satan-worshiping cults.
• a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing : a cult of personality surrounding the leaders.
• [usu. as adj. ] a person or thing that is popular or fashionable, esp. among a particular section of society : a cult film.

So apparently we're a small group of people with sinister religious beliefs who worship our trimmers (or maybe our horses feet)

Or maybe as point 3 suggests its a thing that is popular, in which case yep, its a cult!

 

[MagicMelon]

Bare in mind that when you go from shod to barefoot, your horse will be very footsore.

I think it very much depends on your horse. I keep 2 of mine barefoot (properly barefoot trimmed), both have had a history of laminitis and one of them was shod for years (farrier advised it) however he had foot problems quite often including on average 2 absesses every single year. A couple of years ago we decided to get a barefoot trimmer to him and have done ever since. Yes, he is footsore on hard ground but as soon as he hits grass he's more sound than he was when he was shod! He hasn't had any absesses since either (touch wood). The shetland we also have barefoot trimmed (as opposed to farrier trimmed) and her hooves have never looked better and she's 100% sound and never been footsore because of it.

Although not properly barefoot trimmed, I do take my competition horses shoes off about now until the outdoor / BE season starts again in May. He is never lame and absolutely loves it! He's a TB x but has extremely good feet anyway. I think that helps a lot.

I would always choose to keep a horse barefoot by choice. Unfortunately its just not possible when competing on grass though as need studs.

 

[Jericho]

I have spent the last 9 months trying to get my mare happy barefoot and with the encouragement and advise of my farrier. But she obviously wasnt happy and was very tiptoey 9 months on so I made the decision to use front shoes.

She is back to striding out and having confidence in going forward again. It really wasnt what I expected as she has fantastic feet, shod and unshod but she obviously was very sole sensitive and sadly it didnt work for her. I followed lots of advice - we have pea gravel and sand in her paddock which she loves standing in, shod and unshod, I kept her in off the grass for the week - still the same. I feed her the barefoot diet (no sugar, seaweed, brewyers yeast, mag ox etc), I built the work up. I tried boots but she still didnt feel right and they didnt suit our hacking environment.

I do believe that barefoot is best and most natural for the hoof but in order for my mare to be happy and to enjoy being ridden she needs shoes. Maybe in a different environment she wouldnt. Part of me feels guilty that I compromise her foot health, part of me is very happy that she is happy again (but I also know that I may be sacrificing her long term health by shoeing her just because I want to ride her)

Do I keep her unshod and unridden so that she has perfectly healthy feet? I guess its the same question as do I put saddles and a riders weight on her back so that I minimise all risk of a back problem? Do I never ask her to jump fences so that she reduces all chances of injuring her legs?

 

[carmmaponys]

I have spent the last 9 months trying to get my mare happy barefoot and with the encouragement and advise of my farrier. But she obviously wasnt happy and was very tiptoey 9 months on so I made the decision to use front shoes.

She is back to striding out and having confidence in going forward again. It really wasnt what I expected as she has fantastic feet, shod and unshod but she obviously was very sole sensitive and sadly it didnt work for her. I followed lots of advice - we have pea gravel and sand in her paddock which she loves standing in, shod and unshod, I kept her in off the grass for the week - still the same. I feed her the barefoot diet (no sugar, seaweed, brewyers yeast, mag ox etc), I built the work up. I tried boots but she still didnt feel right and they didnt suit our hacking environment.

I do believe that barefoot is best and most natural for the hoof but in order for my mare to be happy and to enjoy being ridden she needs shoes. Maybe in a different environment she wouldnt. Part of me feels guilty that I compromise her foot health, part of me is very happy that she is happy again (but I also know that I may be sacrificing her long term health by shoeing her just because I want to ride her)

Do I keep her unshod and unridden so that she has perfectly healthy feet? I guess its the same question as do I put saddles and a riders weight on her back so that I minimise all risk of a back problem? Do I never ask her to jump fences so that she reduces all chances of injuring her legs?

It is very difficult to go barefoot with a basic farrier trim as they balance using different methods ie static mechanics static meaning something that is not in motion all living things are moving the only time your horses is static is when he is no longer alive. If the feet are perfectly healthy then the horse would be sound and what exactly do people percieve to be a good foot because i used to think some of mine had good feet until i learnt what realy is a good foot and when true balance is achieved you would be amazed

 

[cptrayes]

"Do I keep her unshod and unridden so that she has perfectly healthy feet?"

Definitely not! She's there to ride and she and you are getting on better shod. Please don't feel guilty. There are plenty of horses who are happy in shoes their whole life long.

My guess about her problems, from what you say, would be a possible mineral imbalance but it could be difficult to get to the bottom of it and shoes may be a better option for you if she appears completely healthy. For the hoofnerds among us , my own experience of excess manganese and iron in my pasture and water supply is interesting. Fed seaweed, high in iron, my friend's horses went more footie. Fed Copper Trition to counteract the manganese and iron, one is rock crunching and the other nearly so. But you really need a forage analysis on each field you use (they can differ markedly) and each batch of hay/haylage that you get if they come from different fields. And frankly, what a pain, especially if you are in a livery yard and have no control over the hay supply! I can understand why some people go back to the shoes. I feel very lucky to have control over my environment to be able to make it work even with the difficult ones.

 

[HollyWoozle]

I really like the idea of going barefoot A) because it seems more natural, B) because it would cost less and C) because Belle doesn't like the process of being shod.

Belle had only fronts on when she came and we were told no backs as she didn't need them. We left her like this to begin with but after a short while it became apparent that her feet just weren't coping with the roadwork we have to do (although we don't hack that much, we do have to go on roads each time). Yes, I am aware that many horses can do plenty of roadwork unshod, it's just that it didn't suit my horse and therefore I prefer to have her shod. This is what works for us - she seems comfortable and happy, her hooves are in good condition and I feel at ease going on the roads.

If I had a horse that was able to manage barefoot comfortably, I would certainly consider taking this option. I don't think anyone can really argue that shod or unshod is better, shod is better for some, unshod for others.

 

[Jericho]

It is very difficult to go barefoot with a basic farrier trim as they balance using different methods ie static mechanics static meaning something that is not in motion all living things are moving the only time your horses is static is when he is no longer alive. If the feet are perfectly healthy then the horse would be sound and what exactly do people percieve to be a good foot because i used to think some of mine had good feet until i learnt what realy is a good foot and when true balance is achieved you would be amazed

I do hear what you are saying, but I trust my farrier, he has spent a long time supporting and encouraging me to stay barefoot and has explained exactly how and why he trims her where if indeed he feels the need to trim her (on 2 consecutive occasions he has said she didnt need it at all. He has made mistakes but he has learnt about my mare from this and takes care to not do it again. He has worked with barefoot trimmers and spent time researching the movement towards barefoot.

He has said it has been useful to him to see how she balances her feet unshod and how she wore it down slightly unevenly, not so he could try and 'make' her foot correct with a shoe but to support the way she moves naturally. If she was a wild horse living on sparse rough grazing and travelling miles and miles a day over rough terrain and trimming her own feet I have no doubt her feet would be perfect as would 95% of all horses hooves. Unfortunately selfishly I cant provide that for her.

 

[cptrayes]

Alternatively Jericho, if she moves less than fluently on bare feet and did so as a baby, she'd have been the one that the lioness caught to feed her cubs. It sounds like your farrier is a great guy and knows what he is doing. Some of them do!

 

[cptrayes]

Yes, I am aware that many horses can do plenty of roadwork unshod, it's just that it didn't suit my horse and therefore I prefer to have her shod.

Did it make her unsound Hollywoozle? It's quite unusual not to manage smooth tarmac on back feet. My worst horses have always managed that. But they do wear very short, and that's correct for a barefoot foot as long as the horse is not unsound. By "not unsound" I don't mean that it never feels treading on a big stone. I'm always amused by people who think it is somehow OK that a shod horse will often tread on a stone big enough to bruise it for long enough to bruise it and then say "ooh, tut tut, look at that!" when a barefoot horse has the sense (brainwise and footwise) to remove its foot from the potential damage quickly.

 

[chessy]

My girl is barefoot, I think she has been so for the vast majority of her life (if not all of it!)

Her feet are in fabulous shape, she can walk across all terrains without a care in the world!

 

[Spinal Tap]

I do know people who seem to think that it's a problem that my mare takes the odd false step on stones & generally opts to walk on grass verges rather than stony tracks, but she can feel what's under her feet and wants her feet & legs to stay safe. It's the most basic instinct a prey animal has

 

[teddyt]

Yes afarrier is trained in the Trade all based on suposition whilst myself and many more are trained based on science,Proven theories.

Codswallop. Farriers are trained from both science, proven theories AND practical experience. Much longer training than most trimmers actually.

It is very difficult to go barefoot with a basic farrier trim as they balance using different methods ie static mechanics static meaning something that is not in motion all living things are moving the only time your horses is static is when he is no longer alive. If the feet are perfectly healthy then the horse would be sound and what exactly do people percieve to be a good foot because i used to think some of mine had good feet until i learnt what realy is a good foot and when true balance is achieved you would be amazed

A VERY sweeping statement.

It is this attitude that puts me off trimmers and gets up my nose. Farriers are perfectly capable of trimming a foot without then fitting shoes. There are good and bad farriers, as there are good and bad anything. But i lose any respect for someone who is supposed to be a professional when statements like these are made.

This whole barefoot trim vs farrier trim is just a big myth put out by trimmers to brainwash owners. If someone cant get customers by showing how good they are rather than relying on slagging off other professionals then im not interested.

There are good farriers out there. Mine is one of them. He shoes some of mine but the majority are shoeless. And SHOCK HORROR they are all sound with good feet.

 

[Oberon]

Not wishing to wade into this inevitable bunfight on farrier v trimmer or shod v barefoot

however

I have yet to actually meet a professional trimmer who has slagged off farriers.

I have met many farriers who slagged of trimmers though.

There is room on this earth for both professions - why can't we all just get on?

 

[tallyho!]

tallyho- you have taken my post wrongly. I explained a differing point of view to what you have been told, thats all. No animosity at all. Thats why i said its just my point of view and put a smiley. Thats why i said that if your horse is better then thats great! Thats what matters. but i believe that some of the suggestions didnt have great foundations. Possible, yes. But not the definite solution that they were 'sold' as. Its possible that raised liver enzymes were due to F4F but its also possible it was from years of medication to help with the laminitis. You cant say for sure.



How do you know? You have got very defensive with me offering a different view. Possibly because others have been rude. But dont let that get in the way of a discussion. Just so you know, i have previously taken shoes off a horse that had been shod for 20 years. Not because he was retired but because i FELT it may improve his feet. It has. I have also taken shoes off a horse with navicular. He was sound with shoes and he is now sound without shoes. So yes actually i can come to terms with horses not wearing shoes. And i can come to terms with owners doing what they feel is right. What i cant come to terms with is minimally trained EPs giving advice as if it was gospel when there are other possible explanations. Some sell barefoot as though its black and white- shoes are evil, no shoes are best. Your horse cant eat a carrot or it will die stuff.

I could go on explaining and answering some of your questions about my experience and knowledge but i wont. As i said, just my point of view. A different one to that which you have accepted but i can assure you there is no animosity towards you- i was just offering alternative information.

Happy to call a truce. Not asking for your expert opinion anyway - but you didn't offer alternative info teddyt, you just questioned my posts in 'know-it-all' manner. You see, if my farrier (supposed remedial one recommended by vet practice) and vet (at the time) were the ones I pinned my hopes on had made him better with all the drugs and supplements and fancy shaped shoes they sold me and he was happy in his own skin I probably would still be paying for shoes.

I'm not saying you personally are wrong, but it does bring to question how all those years of 'training' couldn't help but an airy-fairy EP came along and my horse walks and eats normally again, well, doesn't take a genius to work out who I'm pinning my hopes on now.

My carrot-hating, you-face qualified, gospel-preaching "trimmer" has done more for me in 1 year than 4 years of conventional therapy ever did. Which come to think of it, the different diagnoses were:

Navicular
Seedy toe (doesn't have)
Spavin
Concussion Laminitis (more x-rays)
P3 Rotation (duh)
Kissing spine (wtf???????? were they on effin drugs?)
Can't eat grass or it will die. But carrots are fine.

Should have sent him to the glue factory shouldn't I? Infact I recall farrier saying "why don't you just get a tb?"

Again, not an attack on farriery - I'm SHARING my experience.

 

[teddyt]

Not asking for your expert opinion anyway - but you didn't offer alternative info teddyt, you just questioned my posts in 'know-it-all' manner.

I questioned your post by saying i was intrigued by some of the things you had said. I was intrigued. You had said a supplement was killing your horse. You had said that he had bruises caused by calcium deficiency. I asked for more info because i thought these ideas, although possible, were a bit far fetched. But what you replied with didnt convince me. I then did offer alternative explanations. You've obviously missed them.

As i said before, your horse is better and thats what matters.

I have yet to actually meet a professional trimmer who has slagged off farriers.

I have met many farriers who slagged of trimmers though.

There is room on this earth for both professions - why can't we all just get on?

My experience is different. Ive read many a dig on here at farriers from trimmers. Just like the one below by carmmaponys saying farriers are all trained based on supposition. And the repeated saying by people who have barefoot horses that farriers trims are different (often with a negative connotation) and farriers dont watch horses move. Where does this come from?

I agree, there is room for both but whilst minimally trained trimmers spout tenuous information then i doubt it will happen. Unfortunately many trimmers have 'bought in' to a system and they themselves are disseminating the information they have been given in the same enthusiastic manner to which they were taught. Unfortunately, much of this info is lacking in a decent foundation. Instead there is often a reliance on running down traditional methods in the aim of boosting the new ones.

Believe me, if a trimmer could actually give some decent trained knowledge i wouldnt need to defend farriers quite so much. cptrayes is excellent on here- very informative and she doesnt spout the airy fairy rubbish of many. But in the barefoot world people like her are few and far between. IMO!

 

[tallyho!]

Thanks teddyt, he is much better and I have to say I can't believe my eyes sometimes. He's happy, I'm happy. It's all good right now.
There is another farrier who I now trust and does actually work with my EP on other horses elsewhere.

It's obvious some farriers are better than others and some 'trimmers' are better than others and it's how the horse is that matters.

 

[Tinypony]

Where are the many digs against trimmers here against farriers? Could someone link to them? I normally read these discussions (not sure why, they are rather repetetive), and don't recall this. I have read people who have barefoot horses saying what went wrong with their farriers, but the trimmers don't post often, and when they do it's not to make digs at farriers.
I think this is an interesting perception.

 

[Spinal Tap]

Thanks teddyt, he is much better and I have to say I can't believe my eyes sometimes. He's happy, I'm happy. It's all good right now.
There is another farrier who I now trust and does actually work with my EP on other horses elsewhere.

It's obvious some farriers are better than others and some 'trimmers' are better than others and it's how the horse is that matters.

Yep - I had to change trimmers once because the one I was using wasn't doing a good job. But that compares to changing farriers 9 times, there were two good ones but they retired & emigrated respectively, the rest I just packed in and went elsewhere I wasn't alone either, there have been lots of 'farrier shenanigans' at the yards where I've kept my horses and there still are. Only last week a friend asked me for a different farrier's number because the one she uses won't do anything about her horse's collapsed heels, she's at her wit's end. It's really not good round here

 

[Oberon]

Teddyt, that's why I made the distinction of a professional trimmer and not an over enthusiastic forum poster. You don't find so many professional trimmers posting on a forum, they often don't like to dispense advice without seeing the horse.

I think Cptrayes will tell you herself that she isn't a trimmer (just a geek like the rest of us

 

[gekko]

• a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing : a cult of personality surrounding the leaders.

Try that definition from your list...it's very appropriate in many situations....

Yes, I am a Master Farrier. I also have a couple of degrees and quite a few other qualifications, some of them very applicable to horses, some not. (most of them not! lol)

Vet Science is not among them, so nope I'm NOT a Vet... HOWEVER....some other specific areas I do have qualifications in are as an AI tech in a variety of livestock species and qualifications in human emergency medical care which of course transfers across to animals...because we are in a remote area with the closest vet being around 300km away someone has to deal with sick and injured livestock...guess who?

We actually own and operate a vet clinic/AI centre, employing visiting vets, (an equine specialist,who will look at small animals under sufferance, if he can't fob it off, a small animal only vet and a small animal vet who will deal with horses if we bribe/threaten him! lol)...but in between clinic days (which rotate around the vets/specialties) I deal with all the things that can't wait... lots of suturing, LOTS of colics(sand colic is quite common round here), fractures etc...oh, and injured wildlife - lots of road trauma...with one of our vets prescribing drugs from our stocks via phone to cover the legalities...All the follow up with dressings, treatments and removal of clips/sutures between clinics also falls back to me post surgical cases etc.."at the direction" of the treating vets.

Honestly you guys don't know how spolit you are with vets on hand at the drop of a hat and everything right next door!

It's a case that If I can't treat the problem (usually done in consult with one of our vets for legalities and so on) or at least stablize an animal for a 3hr + trip, euthanasia is probably only the other option.
Of course colic surgeries are out...lol, it's either got better with non surgical treatment or it's lead injection time. Scheduled things beyond dressings and medication prescribed by our vets is out, as is anything beyond "ER" or anything "surgical" thats not immediately critical...it either gets transported 3 hrs or waits to the next clinic day. ...or patched up enough to travel or wait...i.e.local, stiched up, dressed and a splint/cast, start AB's, tetnus jab etc...and the vet will reasses in a few days and operate/treat further/whatever...
On our Clinic days, I step back to play the role of vet nurse except in my specialist areas...( I do the AI rather than the vets and consult for hoof/leg stuff etc, because they usually require corrective work somewhere in the process and I see a damn sight more feet than vets!)

There ISN'T much I can't handle in emergency situations, with my experience and what we have on hand.
I have also performed necropsies for insurance companies and take samples for Primary Industries in sudden stock deaths etc and assess cruelty/neglect matters for the RSPCA (again over 300km away)... Having a working knowledge of anatomy in a big range of critters helps!
Fecal worm counts and other basic lab work is also part of the deal... The basic Lab is here for the AI/ET etc, but we do whatever else we can in house as sending stuff off for labwork isn't exactly a 1hr turnaround!

Think yourselves bloody lucky you live on a postage stamp with everything at hand!

 

[cptrayes]

Oberon I am hugely offended by you calling me a geek. Hoofnerd, yes, browser of hoofporn, yes, and many other things, but surely geeks wear glasses and anoraks? Ooops, that's me then

Gekko I respect your abilities but your way of discussing things is, to a person born and brought up in the UK, aggressive, destructive and sometimes downright rude. If you could tone it down a bit it would be good to have a serious discussion about how we make barefoot work in a difficult climate here in the UK.

Yes folks I'm not a paid trimmer and if I was I wouldn't post. But I am a bit unusual in my desire to research, experiment and learn. And fairly rare in eventing (given up now) and hunting unshod horses. I was, for a long time, closely involved with one of the trimming organisations and I pick up information from wherever I can. But no, you won't catch me saying anything airy fairy because I personally only believe what I can see or feel for myself, or where there are properly controlled trials that have documented results or where sheer weight of numbers suggest that something is going on that we need to take note of. (I once had a troll on HHO say that they had heard a kitkat a day keeps horses sound. My reply was that if I personally knew 100 horses fed a kitkat a day for a year and none of them were unsound, that I'd buy a shopful of kitkat.) That's about where we are with barefoot now, and it's great to have got rid of most of the trolls and have serious discussions on this forum about whether horses in general or a horse in particular, need(s) shoes. I'm glad it helps people and it's fun to do though I spend far too much time on here!!

 

[gekko]

I am blunt. I don't sugar coat. I state facts. I state my opinions(without sugar coating) based on my observations, qualifications and many years of experience. I call a spade a spade and at times I will even call it a @#$%^ shovel!

Deal with it! ;-p

If you require sugar coating to ease swallowing the information, feel free to add your own sugar! Put on some rose coloured glasses before reading my posts! LOL

Oh and by the way, if you don't want to swallow the information and it needs to take another route...brace yourself, I won't be adding sugar OR lubrication! LOL

Honestly, my own opinions have a lot in common with many barefooters, right up to the point that they talk through their hat about shoes with no real knowledge, or deny that any horse could possibly be best off in shoes. That and their claims that a few weeks is equal to 4 years and ongoing study when it comes to training....

 

[soloequestrian]

I call a spade a spade and at times I will even call it a @#$%^ shovel!

No you don't, you yell random and unfounded obscenities at the person holding the spade. You don't read posts carefully, and you don't discuss, you just spout your opinions. You are thoroughly unpleasant, and certainly don't show any evidence of being the well-qualified person you claim to be. Why on earth are you on this forum?

 

[Tinypony]

No Gekko, I've had a read and I agree, you're rude. Which is a shame really, because if you have useful contributions to make to the discussion, that tends to mean that people switch off and don't read your posts properly.

 

[gekko]

Awww youre upset? My work here is done!

You won't see random or unfounded obscenities, just well found and well directed ones at appropriate times and places....and believe me, some of the rubbish spouted by certain folks round here has required severe self restraint! I have felt like beating some folks with the spade at times!

If you actually read through this thread, you will find my opinion is one of the more balanced and accepting...But I HAVE spoken up against distortions and wild statements by some folks who really need to realise they don't quite have all the facts or a balanced view of them.

Feel free to skip by my posts should you be horribly offended by the unsweetened truth and ungarnished facts. If you can't add your own sugar (or artifical sweetner, for those watching their calories) just deal with it or skip it, either way I won't be offended (or more honestly, give a damn).

 

[soloequestrian]

You won't see random or unfounded obscenities, just well found and well directed ones at appropriate times and places....and believe me, some of the rubbish spouted by certain folks round here has required severe self restraint! I have felt like beating some folks with the spade at times!

Yes, but that's the point, you will. You called me 'ignorant and deceitful' for saying that shoes cause damage, and then went on to say exactly the same thing yourself. I'm not remotely upset, just curious, and much less willing to read anything you now write with anything other than several tons of salt, as I suspect many other forum users will be.

 

[tallyho!]

Awww youre upset? My work here is done!

You won't see random or unfounded obscenities, just well found and well directed ones at appropriate times and places....and believe me, some of the rubbish spouted by certain folks round here has required severe self restraint! I have felt like beating some folks with the spade at times!

If you actually read through this thread, you will find my opinion is one of the more balanced and accepting...But I HAVE spoken up against distortions and wild statements by some folks who really need to realise they don't quite have all the facts or a balanced view of them.

Feel free to skip by my posts should you be horribly offended by the unsweetened truth and ungarnished facts. If you can't add your own sugar (or artifical sweetner, for those watching their calories) just deal with it or skip it, either way I won't be offended (or more honestly, give a damn).

Pass the salt someone...

 

[RolyPolyPony]

My boy is barefoot, as are all of the liveries at the yard, bar one. One horse is just transitioning and although is still a bit foot sore on stoney ground, he has no problems on tarmac. I personally don't see the need to shoe horses. They've gone thousands of years barefoot in the wild, why shoe domesticated horses? But that's just a personal opinion!

 

[teddyt]

Where are the many digs against trimmers here against farriers? Could someone link to them? I normally read these discussions (not sure why, they are rather repetetive), and don't recall this. I have read people who have barefoot horses saying what went wrong with their farriers, but the trimmers don't post often, and when they do it's not to make digs at farriers.
I think this is an interesting perception.

Heres one from earlier in this thread-

... all 24 of my ponies are barefoot and trimmed by myself or partner as qualified Applied Equine Podiatrists.
...... Yes afarrier is trained in the Trade all based on suposition whilst myself and many more are trained based on science,Proven theories.
..... Take a look at http://www.applied-equine-podiatry.co.uk or http://www.appliedequinepodiatry.org

Followed later on by-

It is very difficult to go barefoot with a basic farrier trim as they balance using different methods ie static mechanics static meaning something that is not in motion all living things are moving the only time your horses is static is when he is no longer alive.

carmaponys is a trimmer and i consider saying that farriers are trained by supposition whilst trimmers are trained on science and proven theories to not only be a dig at farriers but total cobblers! To go on to say that a farriers trim is only suitable for a dead horse i also consider to be a huge dig.

I think Cptrayes will tell you herself that she isn't a trimmer (just a geek like the rest of us

My mistake, i think i knew that, just forgot. Her research and experience shows though, she is somewhat different to most other barefoot owners that post. mmm geek a possibility