Barefoot

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251libby

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wow I haven't posted in months and now two posts in an evening!

My horse has been only shod in front for years now, her back hooves are fine, shes never showed any signs of being even a bit foot sore and her hooves are strong no cracks, perfect little feet as my farrier says!
I've been thinking of trying barefoot for a while and tomorrows the day....they're coming off! Now, I'm not one of those fluffy tree hugger sorts who think all horses should be out 24/7 ruggless with no shoes but why spend the money of shoes when you dont have to!

We are going to give her a 6 week trial period and any signs of footyness (thats not a word) then I'll just put 'em back on. If this all goes to plan then I will still have farrier every 6 weeks to check and trim.

Now for everyone who has done this.....is there anything that I should look out for which would indicate that shes not comfortable?
 
251libby said:
wow I haven't posted in months and now two posts in an evening!

My horse has been only shod in front for years now, her back hooves are fine, shes never showed any signs of being even a bit foot sore and her hooves are strong no cracks, perfect little feet as my farrier says!
I've been thinking of trying barefoot for a while and tomorrows the day....they're coming off! Now, I'm not one of those fluffy tree hugger sorts who think all horses should be out 24/7 ruggless with no shoes but why spend the money of shoes when you dont have to!

We are going to give her a 6 week trial period and any signs of footyness (thats not a word) then I'll just put 'em back on. If this all goes to plan then I will still have farrier every 6 weeks to check and trim.

Now for everyone who has done this.....is there anything that I should look out for which would indicate that shes not comfortable?
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f she has been shod for a while, she will be uncomfortable to start with, you might have to give it a bit more than 6 weeks for her feet to adjust.
 
My 2 have gone the full winter with no shoes on although they have literally just stayed in the field as we had snow for 10 weeks!! I rode them both the other day for the first time all seemed fine. Before this winter they have both always had shoes on. I would say you will have to give your horse a bit longer than 6 weeks maybe 12 would be better unless she thinks she cant walk and it doesnt get any better! I have decided that i will get hoof boots if either of mine show signs of being foot sore
 
qualified bare foot trimmer....

Stick with your farrier hun.
You will have a period of adjustment. this could be anything from a day to 6 or 8 weeks. If her feet are strong and healthy and shes not doing excess roadwork I think you will find she will cope fine
But please stick with your farrier!

Lou x
 
As above, 6 weeks isn't long enough. Going barefoot is like breastfeeding, hurts like hell for the first 6 weeks, after that you can go on forever :)
 
If you're sticking with your farrier make sure he's familiar with the latest thinking on barefoot - it's about so much more than having a good, balanced trim. Diet is crucially important as is the type of exercise your horse does. Diet needs to have as little sugar in as possible, some horses cannot tolerate even the smallest amounts of grass without becoming footy - that does not mean they have 'bad' feet or cannot do barefoot it just means you have to be more picky with what you feed them. Few farriers will stress this massive link between diet and barefoot soundness. If you are not fully aware of the implications of diet - and of the affect wormers and vaccinations, other drugs, and in fact so many variables - then you start with a disadvantage because your mare might go footy one day... there will be a reason for this that is solvable but only if you understand the processes causing it. The first question your farrier should ask if a previously sound barefoot horse has gone footy is has there been any changes in diet. And the first question he should ask when you take the shoes off at the beginning is also 'what do you feed?' Plus he should be warning you about the impact of grass. He should also advise you on all the different sorts of hoof boots, advise which will work best for your horse, measure you up for a set of boots and tell you where you can get them from. I would also hope he would advise you on supplements to feed - most importantly magnesium, which is vital to many horses in this country and can be the difference between a sound horse and a footy horse.

I would also say if you give your mare a fixed time for transitioning to barefoot then your chances of success are limited. That's like saying I'm going to get fit for the London marathon in six weeks and if I'm not fit enough after six weeks that's because I'm not a good enough runner, rather than the fact you haven't given yourself enough time. You need to be flexible - your mare might be 100% sound straightaway or it may take six weeks or it may take six months. Some horses (the ones most sensitive to sugar) will always needs hoof boots. Because of the massive influence of diet the strength of the feet can change - so a sound horse may become footy for a few days (after being worming for instance) but then come sound again. If you intend to slap the shoes back on at the first sign of footiness then it's probably not worth taking the shoes off at all.
 
Just to add to what Mr Darcy says above - 6 weeks may well not be long enough. Your horse may possibly be even more footy than normal over the next few weeks simply because the grass is very soon going to be coming through. I have a barefoot endurance horse who has never, ever been shod. He's coming up 10 this year. I know that in the next couple of weeks this horse, who can normally canter happily over the flints around here, will become very slightly footy for about a fortnight due to the spring grass. It happens every year. I monitor him and know that he'll be fine - but I just wanted to make you aware that if where you are you get a sudden flush of new grass - then any footiness displayed by your horse might become more exaggerated. Be aware that this could well be the case before you rush to put shoes back on again.

I won't take part in the farrier vs. trimmer debate. I firmly believe there are both good and bad farriers and trimmers. It's a matter of finding who's best for you.

Good luck.
 
i think you need to give it about 3months really,a few weeks to get used to it and then a couple of months to see how she adapts long term :)
and im no fluffy bunny hugger either...mine are all clipped, rugged and live in at night all year round......my TB (yes TB!!!!) is currently competing BD novice, schooling medium and does all his work incl hacking and competing BF. im no hippy but like you i just think that if they dont *need* shoes then why bother,much eaier to go without as no isssues with lost shoes before shows/standing on nails/ripping half their foot off etc and much safer in group turnout.

i personally DO use a qual trimmer, but have also seen some suberb barefoot work by farriers (as well as shocking barefoot work by both) but my one caveat would be that if she appears footy after a couple of farrier trims, please do try a trimmer and see if it makes a difference, so then you've given it the best shot/covered all options etc.
 
My lot (TB, Pure bred Arab, ID/TB/Arab/Connemara) are all barefoot. We had the Heinz57's mother when we took all shoes off - she was in her 20s with a history of tendon problems and although she had abscesses in all 4 feet - poor little mare was like the victim of Chinese footbinding after 20 years in iron shoes - she never had another problem with her tendons due to the improved blood supply to her feet. Her hooves actually expanded and in the 8 barefoot years before she died, she went up 2 hoof boot sizes.

I'd recommend sticking with it even if he is a bit footy - buy a pair of hoofboots for in front (I use Old Macs - they do 2 different sorts so it's easier to fit from their range, and they are really quick and easy to put on and take off) and put them on if you are going to be hacking on flinty/rocky ground, or doing any really long distances to start off with. Smooth tarmac shouldn't be a problem - even my flat footed TB can do tarmac without any footiness; the other 2 seem to be impervious to anything.

Good luck with it - it honestly is much better for the horse - as well as your pocket!
 
When I bought my tb earlier this year we went barefoot, it’s now been 7 weeks and he’s doing really well. Even in the first six weeks he showed a marked improvement walking over stony ground, being an ex-racer he’s probably been shod since he was at least two (He’s six now) so even if it didn’t work long term it would be nice to give his feet a break.

EP has been impressed with how well he’s doing, initially she said that having been told he was an ex-racer she fully admitted she didn’t think she’d even remove the shoes yet, she was pleasantly pleased on the 2nd trim with how well they are doing.

Those that state stick with your farrier can I ask why? I did a fair bit of asking around about the EP I was wanted to use and had nothing but good reviews regarding her, where as some of the local farrier’s it’s a very different story (although EP had nothing but praise for the farrier that I had used previously, who I wouldn’t hesitate to use again if we needed shoes).

Plus having a rather accident prone tb, removing four bit of metal flailing about on the ends of his legs can only be a good thing!
 
My Charlie (exrace horse typical tb) has been barefoot for now for just under a year. I can quite honestly say that it is the best choice that I have made for him. Initially he was very picky with his feet at first, but with time (I think about 3 months) his soles began to harden up and he will hack out and gallop barefoot on stonier ground. The majority of time he is in old mac g1 hoof boots in his front feet and renegades on his back feet. This combination works very well for him and allows us to go for longer distances. I would never see another set of shoes put on him.
 
My 6yr old gelding is currently without shoes, he has good feet and does absolutely fine without them, I was considering getting them put back soon for the summer as a lot of the hacking where I am is all weather tracks which is quite gravelly and could wear down his feet quickly and make him sore but I think I will try hoof boots instead. Are they easy to fit, comfortable ect?

I would definitely try him without shoes, my boy was fine on most surfaces straight away the only thing was a few chips around the bottom of the front feet, he doesn't even get this now.
 
Everything on my yard has been barefoot for about thirteen years now.

Only had one slight problem and that was frankly my own stupid fault anyway. I was Hunting on a 13.3 Welsh with tiny hooves (I'm a small adult) and he slid on a steep grass riverbank into the backside of a rather large cob with an angry owner!

I feed about one tenth the recommended Top Spec to everyone who's ridden and beside the odd chip in the outer wall have no problems. My partner became interested in hooves and learned to shape them, so we haven't had a blacksmith here in years. Jumping, hacking, cross country and everything - it's fine.

Good luck!
 
My 17 year old has been barefoot for 12 years and has no problems. The best thing I did was get a qualified barefoot trimmer to see them every 3 months. I started doing this about a year ago. Don't get me wrong, my farrier was fine, but always trimmed them "ready for shoes" which is different from podiatry trims for barefoot horses. I have no problems with farriers, and his feet were fine when the farrier did them, and if I ever get a shod horse I will have the farrier again...but....for trimming feet for a working barefoot horse I feel my horse is happier with the barefoot trimmer. Something about angles/levels/balance/shape of the foot left in contact with the ground etc.
 
I don't think they all take long to "adjust". My horse is shod from spring - autumn but over the winter his shoes come off and my barefoot trimmer does him. He doesn't take time to adjust at all - he's perfectly sound and in fact so much happier not shod. It really depends on the horse. My other pony who's barefoot trimmed (and never shod) took months to "adjust" but he'd had numerous hoof problems in the past.
 
OP, I have been in a similar situation to you. My horse had been shod all round for many years, about 18 months ago I knew that he was going to be out of work for a few months, so I had shoes off (he lives out 24/7) and he was fine. Had fronts put on when I started riding again, he was fine bare behind, but he is a bugger for climbing fences and ripping shoes off, so we went naked all round, fine on tarmac but a lot of our tracks are rough. I borrowed a pair of Old Mac G2's, trialled them on his fronts, and we've never looked back. If is saving me a fortune, think £20 for a trim rather than £65, and I never have the frustration of a lost shoe! I'm also a lot more confident on him when riding down steep tarmac hills.

The longest ride we've done was last August, nearly four hourss riding, and he had his boots on for about 10 hours - no rubs from the boots at all!
 
Have a look at Pete Ramey's stuff - online and books. I've just got into reading him and it's really interesting. My three all came out of shoes and went straight into barefoot work with no problems, but they do all wear hoof boots on occasion even now they've been barefoot for several years each.
 
I have my belgian warmblood barefoot, he was diagnosed as having navicular disease, and i was advised to pts...

1yr on his heels have expanded and opened up, he is ridden daily and is back to competing in showjumping competitions!

My farrier trims my horse, but he is very aware of the difference in trimming for shoes or for ridden work.

The most important things when trimming are to not touch the sole, this needs to be left to harden and callous. Leave the frogs alone, these again must not be trimmed except for any raggedy bits, they need to develope into a strong pad.

6wks isnt really long enough to let all these changes happen.

You will also need to do gradual amounts of roadwork to allow the horn to toughen up.
 
mrdarcy said:
it's about so much more than having a good, balanced trim.
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I agree. A horse has to be worked to get used to the new balance and learn to work without shoes. This obviously has to be done carefully and with regular monitoring of how the horse is coping- there is no fixed exercise regime for every horse.

mrdarcy said:
Diet needs to have as little sugar in as possible, some horses cannot tolerate even the smallest amounts of grass without becoming footy - that does not mean they have 'bad' feet or cannot do barefoot it just means you have to be more picky with what you feed them. Few farriers will stress this massive link between diet and barefoot soundness. If you are not fully aware of the implications of diet - and of the affect wormers and vaccinations, other drugs, and in fact so many variables - then you start with a disadvantage because your mare might go footy one day... there will be a reason for this that is solvable but only if you understand the processes causing it. The first question your farrier should ask if a previously sound barefoot horse has gone footy is has there been any changes in diet. And the first question he should ask when you take the shoes off at the beginning is also 'what do you feed?' Plus he should be warning you about the impact of grass.
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If a horse goes footy due to even the smallest amounts of grass then it is laminitic! Every horse should have a diet controlled for quantities of sugar and starch. The fact is that many, many horses are lept on unsuitable grass which has been grown to maximise meat and milk yield in livestock. Horses have evolved to live off totally different nutrient requirements, yet few are kept that way. That is what causes the footiness! It is not that sugar itself is awful, its that TOO MUCH sugar is the culprit. Rye grass (grown for cattle)hay/haylage is common, many people feed mollassed cereal feeds (some cool/leisure mixes have up to 50% starch!) and these combined with the wrong grass mean that the horse is overloaded very easily. Theres a feed suppliers near me that supply italian ryegrass hay and haylage to everyone. Of course the horses love it but its rocket fuel and totally unsuitable for most horses.

I wish barefoot followers would stop saying that all sugar is bad, thats not true. The horse can have some, its just that in many ways of modern management the horse gets too much and that is the problem.
 
teddyt said:
I wish barefoot followers would stop saying that all sugar is bad, thats not true. The horse can have some, its just that in many ways of modern management the horse gets too much and that is the problem.
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Where did I say all sugar was bad? In fact I don't know any of my fellow barefooters who say that - I always say to my clients to reduce the amount of sugar in the diet as much as possible. In fact I tell them exactly what's in your post. Not sure why you made that last comment? Odd.
 
mrdarcy said:
Where did I say all sugar was bad? In fact I don't know any of my fellow barefooters who say that - I always say to my clients to reduce the amount of sugar in the diet as much as possible. In fact I tell them exactly what's in your post. Not sure why you made that last comment? Odd.
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It may be odd to you but its not odd to me! The way i took your post was that you implied that horses need as little sugar as possible and some horses cant tolerate it because of the sugar itself. If a horse cant tolerate even the smallest amounts of grass without becoming footy then it needs veterinary assistance, shod or not. If a horse is that close to lameness then it needs a low sugar diet, shod or not. To me its not about if its not got shoes on then it must have a low sugar diet, that should be the aim for all horses.

I have heard many times from barefoot people that sugar must be avoided, even to the extent that one lady was convinced a handful of hifi light had made her horse lame because of the sugar content. She scoured the ingredients on a packet of treats because she had learned that the horse couldnt have any sugar. :confused: (She had done a couple of courses somewhere.)

IMO you werent saying that an excess is what causes the problem, more the sugar itself, thats the way it came across to me anyway.
 
some horses are fine stright away others can take 6 months
mine are all shoe-less- ISH, TBxWB and KWPN
they are all fine hacking out and doing everything they did with shoes on
you will have to be careful of grit getting up the white line and remember they need trimming as regularly as they did when shod.
mine all get done every 5-6 weeks to keep them in good shape.
getting them balanced helps prevent splits and chips.
 
All mine are barefoot ( one laminitic shetland who hasn't had a bout for over 8 years) all out 24/7 apart from coming in for farrier or being ridden, all absolutely sound as a pound!

Agree entirely with what teddyt says, mine are carefully monitored ( they are on a grass track system, so intake of grass is limited, but no hay fed unless they are in)
all fed Fast Fibre and Kwikbeet

From another forum which I found interesting

http://www.trotonline.co.uk/forum/s...tal-pulses-and-fat-scoring....interesting-day!
 
teddyt said:
It may be odd to you but its not odd to me! The way i took your post was that you implied that horses need as little sugar as possible and some horses cant tolerate it because of the sugar itself. If a horse cant tolerate even the smallest amounts of grass without becoming footy then it needs veterinary assistance, shod or not. If a horse is that close to lameness then it needs a low sugar diet, shod or not. To me its not about if its not got shoes on then it must have a low sugar diet, that should be the aim for all horses.

I have heard many times from barefoot people that sugar must be avoided, even to the extent that one lady was convinced a handful of hifi light had made her horse lame because of the sugar content. She scoured the ingredients on a packet of treats because she had learned that the horse couldnt have any sugar. :confused: (She had done a couple of courses somewhere.)

IMO you werent saying that an excess is what causes the problem, more the sugar itself, thats the way it came across to me anyway.
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You misunderstood me then. Every horse - shod or not - should be fed a low sugar diet. The dietary restrictions for laminitics (less than 10% sugar/starch) would be well applied to all horses in fact. It is excess sugar that causes the problem but what is excess for one horse might be fine for another so that is why when giving general advice I say avoid any feeds with sugar/molasses in. For most people it is hard to control their grazing (because they are on livery yards) so cutting out as much sugar as possible in the feeding they do have control over is all they can do. Better safe than unsound - so why feed chops that contain molasses when you can buy ones that don't, and why feed treats that contain sugars when you don't have to? When barefoot people talk about avoiding sugar that's what they mean - avoid sugar where you can to make up for the areas where you can't. I think we're saying the same thing aren't we?
 
I think so; Feed manufacturers don't make life easy though; for instance Dengie Good Doer you would think is low sugar, although low in energy its in fact 8% sugar.
Some feeds labelled as no mollasses, but they have a very high starch content.

So reading and understanding labels in very important!
 
AngieandBen said:
All mine are barefoot ( one laminitic shetland who hasn't had a bout for over 8 years) all out 24/7 apart from coming in for farrier or being ridden, all absolutely sound as a pound!

Agree entirely with what teddyt says, mine are carefully monitored ( they are on a grass track system, so intake of grass is limited, but no hay fed unless they are in)
all fed Fast Fibre and Kwikbeet

From another forum which I found interesting

http://www.trotonline.co.uk/forum/s...tal-pulses-and-fat-scoring....interesting-day!
Click to expand...

Yes - very interesting. The fructans thing is contrary to what has been observed in pratise - so I'm not sure what to think. I wish I'd been there to ask the question. Both what Jaime Jackson observed with a group of wild horses trapped in a lush pasture area (most came down with lami where lami had never been observed in these wild horse groups before - the only difference being the fact they were trapped in this lush pasture area) and what many people have observed repeatedly themselves - horse goes footy, remove from grass, horse becomes sound - doesn't seem to tie in with what is being proposed. But scientific research is well known for contradicting itself (red wine is good for you, no it's bad for you, no it's good for you is just one example) so I'll stick to what works in practise.
 
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