BBC2 HORSE PEOPLE - PLEASE RING THE BBC AND COMPLAIN

I think it explains it in my post above, but i say again, I don't think watching the whole programme would have changed my opinion, showing that way of killing a horse can not be put in a different context. And i don't believe that killing a horse in that way justifiable, whatever your culture
 
TheaL, I am quite shocked you would complain about a programme you admit having watched for only 3 minutes. Talk about a knee jerk reaction.

If you had watched more of the programme, you would have seen the presenter extremely distressed by the slaughter method. It was in no way suggested that this was a good or acceptable method of horse slaughter. Nonetheless, it is a method that has been used for centuries and continues to this day.

You can put your fingers in your ears and go 'la la la' or you can try and learn a bit more about other people's way of living and THEN make a judgement. Please don't try and prevent intellegent, if disturbing, programmes being broadcast for the rest of us.
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When the mare hit the ground, i flicked to the next channel as it was obvious what was next. i came back to see it being sl
skinned. I think it was an excellent insight into how these people live. They seem a very good natured bunch leading a very hard and desolate life. They don't have the luxury of nipping down to asda to pick up some pre packed meat so have to do it themselves. They are obviously very fond of their animals and have a close bond with their horses. However, these are not 'pets' like most of ours, they have to pay their way, or end up on the table.
It is not our way of doing things, but it is theirs and that is how they have lived for many generations.
I don't think there is a need for complaint. If you don't want to see how people from other cultures do things, then watch the football or eastenders.
 
How were they supposed to kill a strong, wild horse without a gun then?
They had to get hold of her by the neck and subdue her, unfortunately the only way to do this (it seems) is to cut off the air supply and start to render the animal unconscious. I would have thought they've had a lot of practice at it; through experience maybe they have concluded a couple of quick blows to the head is the quickest way to kill a large animal. Slitting the throat would take too long and it is probably difficult to get through the thick coat and skin (incidently, it was noted earlier in the programme that their skin & fur is very thick).
 
We have to remember these people rarely see outsiders. Input from other so called civilised countries is low. Don't forget how angered we are in the UK when newcomers try and enforce their ways of life on us.
I'm sure they would be open to a more humane way of slaughter, if they saw theirs as in-humane.
Bear in mind it couldn't be drug induced because of the meat and cost. Guns, maybe, but they cost money plus you need bullets. The nearest gun shop is probably Moscow for these guys. How do they afford to drive there, buy the bullets and drive back? The distances involved in Russia are huge. It's not like taking a trip to the nearest UK town.
 
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TheaL, I am quite shocked you would complain about a programme you admit having watched for only 3 minutes. Talk about a knee jerk reaction.

If you had watched more of the programme, you would have seen the presenter extremely distressed by the slaughter method. It was in no way suggested that this was a good or acceptable method of horse slaughter. Nonetheless, it is a method that has been used for centuries and continues to this day.

You can put your fingers in your ears and go 'la la la' or you can try and learn a bit more about other people's way of living and THEN make a judgement. Please don't try and prevent intellegent, if disturbing, programmes being broadcast for the rest of us.
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This.
 
Quote - We slaughter animals in a humane way, and there are regulations to make sure the animals have a good way of life before they are killed.

Hmmm, so you think that stuffing thousands of chickens in a barn so they can barely move is humane? Importing pork from abroad where the sows are kept in such a way that they can't move other than lie down or stand up (where a lot of supermarket pork ie bacon comes from) is humane? Also that they are castrated as piglets with no aneasthetic. In the UK their tales are cut off with no anaesthetic as piglets.

I'm pretty sure these men didn't have guns. Why else would they resort to dogs and traps to kill the wolves? If the wolves got the Horses then death would be a LOT more inhumane...ie they start eating while the animal is still alive. I suspect there are reasons why they aren't allowed guns.

I agree it was shocking. But it was reality and normal to them, has been for a very long time.
 
I also thought that it was a fascinating programme - and equally found the killing of the mare incredibly difficult to watch, but felt at the end of the programme that I'd learnt a lot about a completely different culture, and had enormous respect for these guys who live incredibly tough lives and care very much for their horses.

I think that the conditions under which many of our meat animals are killed in this country very possibly cause them much longer distress, with all the travelling and arrival at a strange premises, and the smell of blood and fear - (and by the way I believe that shooting often doesn't work that efficiently first time).

I don't think that there was any unnecessary lingering on the mare killing, but the film did show the stark reality of what the herders life involves. Sometimes its no bad thing for us to be reminded in our very safe and cosy existence in the west how brutal and tough life can be for people in other parts of the world. And I bet that the BBC are just waiting for all the complaints to come in, so you could argue that it was actually a brave programme to air ....
 
Personally if I contact the Beeb it will be to congratulate them on showing such an open documentary about a different culture and way of life, I could not live how they do and could not kill animals in the way they do, but found it fascinating insight into how people live in such a desolate place. As for using guns, why change how they have lived for centuries - non of their animals are allowed to suffer, yes the mare was distressed but not left to suffer for years as many animals here are allowed to do.
 
I found the manner in which they killed the horse absolutely appalling - and really can't comprehend that this manner of killing still goes on. I won't comment on the trapping of the wild animals as it will result in a ban from HHO.

It doesn't warrant a complaint to the BBC though, obviously. This is the way these people have lived for many 100's of years. And will not doubt change very little over the intervening years.

In the meantime, though, if someone could introduce them to the principle of a gun - that would be great.
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Agree we have no right to judge those people. It was harrowing for us to watch but we have free will as to whether we want to watch. Totally agree with with SS's Mum that we (and other countries) subject our animals to far worse long term cruelty) What would those men think of how we treat chickens pumping them full of drugs, keeping them in tiny cages or horses left neglected in fields/ stables with no food / water or transporting horses in a lorry to another country hundreds of miles away just to be slaughtered there, where it is frightened and starved of water and food for many hours if not days and so on and so on and so on...

In the absence of a gun, probably the quickest way for the horse to die although not pleasant. And as somone rightly said a wolf would not thin twice about eating it alive to feed itself and family..
 
QR-I watched the entire programme and was prepared for the killing of the horse from the start as there were plenty of warnings (ie, these people breed their horses for meat....here is where they keep the foal meat....these are the foals that have been bred for meat) so TBH I think I would have been disappointed if they didnt show the slaughter after all we had seen every other aspect of their lives.

I did not watch the killing of the mare as I was eating my dinner but I would have done if I hadnt been eating. I have recorded it and will be watching what I did not see tonight when I get home from work.

I cant see that any aspect of the programme warrants a complaint as I found it very interesting and higjly enlightening.
 
QR

Why on earth should we complain?
There were plenty of warnings and as happyhack says, hints.

What is this, the Daily Mail website?
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Personally if I contact the Beeb it will be to congratulate them ...

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Same here: I thought it the best thing done by the BBC for quite a while. An honest and utterly non-judgemental potrayal of a way of life completely alien to most of us. Yet in that harsh environment (-27C) they love and care for their horses - the animals looked very well.

Where's the programme based next week ? I'll certainly be watching.
 
Well me and the OH got nestled down to watch it with our spag bol on my laps and a glass of wine and .......hmmm well not really the content I expected, well wanted to watch when eating my dinner.

I did find it interesting purely because that is real life and Alexandra was shown the warts an all, it wouldn't be the same just letting her ride around in the pictures scenery and not expecting her to see the end result of what they do, she was a very brave lady and I take my hat off to her, I'm not sure I could of stood there and watched it happen in real life, although I did surprise myself and managed to force myself to watch the killing on TV, despite my OH saying ''please turn it over this will upset you for days'' (as I am very soft) but I thought no, I have watched the horses lead a very natural and stress free life, I have watched the men take care of them, I have watched and understood why they do it, so now I must watch final process.

Yes it was horrible, but at the same time there are horses out there that are intentially ill treated, starved to death and lead very stressful and painful lives even in this country and at end of the day all wild animals are hunted down by predators, except this time the predator cared for the animals first.

Many horses that are bound for the meat trade encounter terrible conditions during live transport, being hauled across counties without food or water, with horrific injuries and beaten off the wagon and no doubt killed in more horrific ways in some cases, which I think if far worse that what those guys were doing, although I do wish there was another way they could kill them.
 
i too watched up until i was fully aware of how upsetting the next scene was going to be for myself personally.
so i too chose to turn over.
we all had a choice
 
From hearing these posts I am just glad I didn't watch it. I had a pretty good idea what sort of programme it would be to be honest, it mentioned about bullfighting in the summary of the episodes so i thought definitely not for me.

Yeah sure this way of life goes on and has been for years but personally I wouldn't want to see it. I agree you had a choice whether to watch it or not - I chose to watch the BBC 1 drama instead, much mroe light hearted!
 
I haven't read the entire thread, so apologise if this is a repeat. I was sickened by the scene. No matter how poor these people are, (and they are developed enough to have satellite tv in their wilderness!), there is absolutely no justification for how that horse suffered. I am realistic about horse slaughter, and have absolutely no problem with people eating every part of a horse. However, seeing that terrified mare strangled to the point of collapse, then suffering several blows to the front of her head with an axe whilst still alive, is a sight and sound which will haunt me for a very long time. And yes, I did lose sleep over it - it was the most barbaric thing I have seen. There are several charities which help educate people, and these men clearly care about their horses. Can a captive bolt gun be used on a horse? I don't see the point in complaining to the BBC - this is what happens, and maybe showing it will help get the method of slaughter changed.
 
I missed the beginning of the programme and was looking for some light hearted background tv while i was writing my dissertation....saw 'horse' in the title and switched it on. I am perfectly accepting of people eating horse meat, in the same way that we eat other meat and love learning about other cultures. I knew the horse was going to be killed for meat but was expecting it to be shot, I was absolutely horrified and sickened by what i saw, the obvious fear and distress of the animal were the biggest issue for me, I found it extermely upsetting. I carried on watching (all be it hiding behind my laptop!) because I wanted to see it in context. I wouldn't complain because I appreciate reality and honesty and I thought the presenter did a great job of showing that, but I hope to god they find a faster method that causes the horse less distress soon!!
 
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Personally if I contact the Beeb it will be to congratulate them on showing such an open documentary about a different culture and way of life, I could not live how they do and could not kill animals in the way they do, but found it fascinating insight into how people live in such a desolate place. As for using guns, why change how they have lived for centuries - non of their animals are allowed to suffer, yes the mare was distressed but not left to suffer for years as many animals here are allowed to do.

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Please could people contact the bbc and congratulate them on this program! The form is here:
https://faq.external.bbc.co.uk/templates...earchString=%24
 
It was brutal but again, I can't really think imagine a quicker way to kill a large, wild, panicky animal without a gun. Slitting her throat would have taken longer. Cutting off the air supply started to render her unconscious, so they were able to safely get her to the ground to kill her. I'm not trying to provoke here, I genuinely would like to know how else would people suggest they do it?

This thread was about the complaining about it, which I still think is unnecessary. It was unpleasant to watch but the documentary did what it was designed to; it presented life as it is, not gratuitously or sensationally, but recorded the facts as they are.
 
Culture is best defined as "The way things are done round here". And that is how the Herders slaughter a horse. It is not a method they use because it is traditional like Morris Dancing and they don't want it to die out.

Why don't they use a gun? Guns cost a lot of money which they don't have. This method of slaughter is free. (by the way, weapons do work in such temperatures, you just have to use a different gun oil).

I thought the programme was excellent and I echo the opinions of many others on here that it is one of the best things the BBC have done in an age.

Alexandra Tostoy was outstanding. She made it clear what she did and didn't like and was honest about it to the herders. I also thought the fact that horses are central to the culture of North Siberia was compelling viewing. These are tough people with an incredibly matter of fact view of life and death - but probably because they live closer to the reality of death (theirs as well as of animals) than we can possibly imagine.

The call to complain about this programme is a bit of an over-reaction (especially when you only saw it for 3 minutes) and if anything the BBC should be congratulated for showing a very balanced portrait of how life actually is in some parts of the world. The trapping and skinning and eating of intestine was vivid and not always to my taste, but no less interesting.

I saw no cruelty. Upleasantness, yes. Cruelty, no. I think the next programme in Spain which includes a segment about bullfighting from horseback will be more disturbing. I believe bullfighting is cruelty wrongly justified by "tradition". But I doubt I will be complaining as it will highlight a genuinely cruel sport with absolutely no point to it. Only by showing it in all its vulgarity can you truly get opinion to change.

Total support for the programme and content from me.
 
QR - Im going to add my twopence worth, as I saw it all the way through. I thought the way the herdsmen cared for their horses was commendable - they all looked happy and in excellent condition. The riding horses looked fab, how amazing did it look when they went hacking through the woods to find the trapped hares!
The slaughter did disturb me at the time - I thought to myself why the hell cant they get a gun? BUT - The horses, other than the ridden ones, are extremely wild, so much so that the presenter moved her arm a fraction and they fled. How then are the herdsmen meant to get a correct and lethal shot to the animals head, when its pelting round a corral? I think the only way they would have to catch it was in the manner shown, these horses look extremely strong, and surely it would cause them more distress to be rounded up into say a cattle crush type thing, and then have someone attempt to shoot it, probably miss and cause great suffering and pain.
Yes it was distasteful, but a fact of life. I have far less an issue with the Siberian horse people than I do those on the continent, whose horses are left dehydrated and in appaling conditions being hauled across thousands of miles to be inhumanely killed.
Right up until the end that mare looked so healthy, scared yes, but I feel that the slaughter is a small price to pay for the outstandigly amazing free and happy life she had lived up until then. Over there horses are their only way to survive, most are still wild, they are not pets. I wonder if the issue would have been raised if the herdsmen had cows instead of horses?
 
I watched this programme and whilst I found parts of it disturbing, I alo found it fascinating. I turned away from the screen and blocked my ears when they killed the mare, cos I didn't want the image emblazoned on my memory.

I think it was a great programme and I will be watching next week.
 
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Can't believe what I just saw .... was almost sick when they showed a mare strangled / beaten to death and then skinned. Was it really necessary to show this in such graphic detail - even if a warning was given at the start of the programme. Please please ring up the BBC and log a complaint.

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Don't be so ridiculous ring up and complain about what?? different cultures and ways of life..

I found the programme truly fascinating yes at time a bit grim but the whole world is different if you don't want to learn about other cultures turn the TV off
 
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I didn't catch the very start of the programme so didn't get the benefit of the warning beforehand, otherwise I would have chosen not to watch. But are you seriously saying that the scene needed to be shown in such a detailed manner, with close ups of the distressed animal? you may be comfortable with being "educated" in this way, but I was not. Common sense?
Just a final thought; if they showed a dog in china in the same manner; how many thousands of complaints would the bbc get?

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They did a few years ago (or was it C4) and that is what brought the plight of the dogs and cats into the public eye. Perhaps you should refrain from watching any real life documentary's and stick to eastenders
 
if anyone particularly muffinio had bothered to read my posts at no point do i say i have any problem with these people or their culture, nor that they kill horses.
What i have a problem with is the graphic portayal of the animals demise when there was no need to show the entire scene. as many people have said if you watched it all it would have been obvious what was going to happen. I have vociferously stuck up for things like bull fighting on this forum because i do believe that their our other cultures to ours and we understand them little. I am alos well aware as Cherish says that these cultures aas portrayed on the programme loved and cherish their animals and do their best for them.
that does not change the fact that i didnt need to see the act in its entirety just so i could be 'educated' and see 'reality'. I found those few minutes to be entirely distressing and i am probably the least tree/bunny hugging person i know. Particualrly as the promotionals for the show made it sound like a jolly excursion for a pony girl.
Once again though in this thread i see certain people have resorted to snide digs and sarcasm instead of reasoned debate, and others who do not read comments properly.
 
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