Bird scarer petition

I think they've been a round a very long time so guess we are blaming someone historical for their development!, afaik anyone over the age of 16/18 can purchase them
 
RunToEarth said:
Then go to your LA's environmental health and complain of noise nuisance which is a perfectly reasonable and valid complaint if they are indeed going off during night time regularly - they can provide you with a noise box in the same way as they do with neighbour disputes - honestly I think that is a perfectly sensible piece of advice in your circumstances and I can't understand why you wouldn't explore that option if the landowners are being so uncooperative.

I live in the middle of arable Lincolnshire so I do understand that they can be a pain in the daytime and that they should not being going off at night. I also wouldn't mind legislation on them at all because we follow the code of GP and don't put them near houses/PROWs - I just object outright to a ban on them because they are very effective.

The rope bangers which Ester has posted I really dislike - and it is scary how easy they are to get hold of - at uni someone set one off at a ball inside a bottle and it caused some serious injuries to my friend.
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I too just want legislation to control how and when they are used. I don't think you understand why I do not wish to complain unless they are breaking the law, which they are not. Legislation would in the vast majority of cases remove the NEED to complain. That is why I support it. The petition calls for a ban OR legislation. We all know they would NEVER be banned, so I really don't see why people are worried about that. You don't have to sign a petition you do not agree with. I am not asking you. But stop trying to tell me what I should do about my situation because you are not in my shoes. I am content with only reporting the times that one malfunctions and goes off at night because that is easily understandable. But until legislation is put in place to properly regulate their use, complaints are futile and even detrimental.
 
cobgoblin said:
Actually, I think Pale Rider has just summed up the opinion of most people about farmers. Most do not live in the countryside, they live in urban or city areas and this is precisely how farmers come across in the media. Frankly this is often how farmers come across in person. The farming community is very bad at public relations.
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Why are they bad at public relations, possibly because;
a) they are a rural minority being told how to conduct their business by an urban majority.
b) they are constantly berated for what they do, people move to the countryside with a perception which is often not met, they then set to trying to change things.
c) many work incredibly long hours and have low living incomes, yes, farming gives you a nice place to live but for many, especially tenant farmers it can be a very hand to mouth existence.
d) many young people going into farming are educated to degree level, and need to be.
e) Jo Public wants cheap food, they don't care where or how it is produced, supermarkets provide this, you don't see the supermarkets taking a cut in income. Who takes the cut in income when BOGOF's are on offer, not the supermarket. A farmer will grow a crop under contract to a SM who can then walk out of the contract because they can inport the product cheaper, leaving the costs to the farmer.
f) we are expected to control a disease by culling only 1 of the carriers.
I could go on.

So, remember when you buy your bread, eggs, sugar, milk etc etc, where it comes from. OK, we could all walk away from the countryside and let it turn back to brambles and nettles and import our food from countries where animal welfare and safe chemical use etc is not really very important, and when there is an issue with transport by air or sea there will be no food.
Why are farmers always so defensive.....

ps, we use gas guns, and use them considerately.
 
It seems to me that if you are worried that the owners will increase the nuisance if you speak to them (although if you are already complaining to the operators when you've switched thm off at night I'd have thought that they were the people most likely to be willing and able to increase the nuisance) then you need to set up a recorder in your house and record for a coupe of nights so you have an accurate record of the situation and then speak to the owners. If they are not receptive to your request and you feel the noise / frequency increases then record again and compare. You will have useful evidence at that point to take to the Environment Agency.

You might also find that your life is improved by the purchase of some ear plugs.

As to the horse that was killed, had it not "thrown it's rider" the rider might have been able to pull it up, if not then I doubt anything much would have been done, horses bolt for all sorts of reasons. At least your horses, used as they must be to such bangs, would be unlikely to react in similar fashion. My own horses don't react to the bangs of the bird scarers, although the first boats they saw on the river here sent them into utter panic!
 
I'm not sure how they can increase the nuisance. You've already said they go off several times a minute all day, and often in the night as well.
If this really is the case I think you'll find they ARE breaking the law. It doesn't need specific legislation concerning the gas guns, it will come under noise pollution laws.

I do actually agree that they are a real pain in the neck, like many other things in life. Sometimes you just have to understand why things are necessary.
 
Wagtail said:
If there was proper legislation and it was being ignored, then I would feel I could complain. As it is, I do not feel I can because it is all a matter of perception. The attitudes of some on this thread illustrate exactly why it would be fruitless to complain. As I have said several times, if they go off at night then I do go out and turn them off and report it the following day, very politely.
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I do hope you aren't trespassing to do this.....
 
Aleka81 said:
I do hope you aren't trespassing to do this.....
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Thank you for bumping my thread.

No, they are not in the least bit worried about us going on the land. I do have a good relationship with them which is why I only mention the problem of the bird scarers if they go off at night. The first time it happened they asked me to identify which one it was as they cannot tell during the day. The game keeper actually told me how to switch it off.
 
Wagtail said:
Thank you for bumping my thread.

No, they are not in the least bit worried about us going on the land. I do have a good relationship with them which is why I only mention the problem of the bird scarers if they go off at night. The first time it happened they asked me to identify which one it was as they cannot tell during the day. The game keeper actually told me how to switch it off.
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So why not just speak to them...I am absolutely baffled by this. And no I'm afraid I wont be signing the petition
 
are you sure its the bird-scarers going off 'several times a minute'? and all year round??? We're farmers and only use them at very specific times of year maybe once (twice at most) a day.

I really don't see what you intend to achieve as quite frankly you live in the COUNTRYSIDE and believe it or not farmers use various things that make noise (either purposefully or not) for a reason not just for their own amusement.
 
All subsidised by the tax payer who has to pay through the nose again at the blooming supermarket. With all the advantages these people have, inherited wealth, tax breaks and agricultural exemptions on everything they touch, they still can't be profitable without massive hand outs from the state. Tell them that they cannot do something, and the sky is falling in on their pea brained heads, idiots.[/QUOTE]

massive handouts from the state? Inherited wealth?Tax breaks and Exemptions on everything we touch? I don't know what planet your living on but I sure wish it was like that here on planet earth. Pale Rider I don't know what your issue is with farming/farmers but classifying people who work very hard day in day out every single day of the year, for generations from the word go until they are cold in their grave as 'pea brained idiots' is quite frankly offensive and disgusting.
 
Wagtail said:
As it is it would be pointless talking to the owners about the situation because their attitude would be '**** off'. They may even increase the nuisance to boot.
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Wagtail said:
they are not in the least bit worried about us going on the land. I do have a good relationship with them which is why I only mention the problem of the bird scarers if they go off at night. The first time it happened they asked me to identify which one it was as they cannot tell during the day. The game keeper actually told me how to switch it off.
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You're completely contradicting yourself.
You daren't just go and speak to your neighbours in a reasonable manner, because you think they don't care and would probably just increase the nuisance as 'payback.'
Yet you claim to have a good relationship with them to the point where you help them to identify the problem gun and they tell you how to switch it off?

So which is it?
 
Patterdale said:
You're completely contradicting yourself.
You daren't just go and speak to your neighbours in a reasonable manner, because you think they don't care and would probably just increase the nuisance as 'payback.'
Yet you claim to have a good relationship with them to the point where you help them to identify the problem gun and they tell you how to switch it off?

So which is it?
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Totally agree! I am so confused with where the OP is actually coming from.....
 
I am all in favour of EU legislation to make farmers behave.

My farming neighbour puts one right beside the randonee to our farm (french bridleway). It fires at one minute intervals for 6 weeks of the year. It forced me to close my trail riding business as we could not pass it safely in one minute. It is an enormous and very noisy cannon. He refused to move it or change the interval. French friends advised us to avoid him, he is known locally as the "beast".

I did a great deal of research, which states that a cannon which fires more frequently than 20mins has little affect on birds who get used to it. My farmer refused point blank to alter the interval.

A friend in Scotland used a local bridleway frequently. Unbeknown to her, a farmer installed a cannon beside this route but hidden by a high hedge. She had just passed it when it went off. Her horse bolted, she was thrown and badly injured.
 
ribbons said:
Where do I think the country side will go ?

Under a pile of housing estates, that's where.
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Well people need to live places so of those homes will need to be in the countryside this country desperately need to increase the housing stock and increase the number of modern built homes with modern insulation etc
The countryside is and always will be an industrial landscape people who live there need withinreason to embrace this .
But that's no reason for ignorant farmers to keep people awake all night or site bird scarers where they impact the safety of using rights of way .
 
Goldenstar said:
But that's no reason for ignorant farmers to keep people awake all night or site bird scarers where they impact the safety of using rights of way .
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No you're right it's not. However Wagtail says she's been shown by the gamekeeper how to switch them off, which implies there is a malfunction with the ones near her, and if he took the time to show her how to work them then it doesn't sound like he's being ignorant :confused3: it sounds like he's trying to stop the problem, no?

Tbh I don't really 'get' threads like this. Surely the answer is just go and speak to the farmers (which I can't figure out if you get along with them or not) and ask them to limit the use of them or contact the Environment Agency and make a complaint about the noise.
 
Wagtail said:
Run to earth. The way I choose to deal with it is to do all I can to get proper legislation put in place. . . . The proper way is to get legislation put in place first. Then everyone knows where they stand. I find it very strange that you all seem so terrified of it quite frankly.
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But Wagtail, there IS proper legislation - it covers noise pollution (which covers your situation). I don't think anyone's terrified of further legislation . . . but personally I feel that more legislation is like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut . . . why, instead of using the mechanisms of law and public order already in place, should we put in place yet more red tape for farmers to have to navigate?

I don't question or doubt your (justified) frustration . . . but I do question your method of remedy - I think it's excessive.

P
 
Wagtail said:
I too just want legislation to control how and when they are used.
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In your situation the issue you have is more geared towards a neighbourhood dispute - with someone who you have a very good relationship with who, if questioned will tell you to **** off...

I am all for supporting the need to place gas guns in sensible places, but I maintain that your issue is a noise nuisance one.
 
Spring Feather said:
Why do you think that? Because people have questioned OPs contradictory comments? Surely people are just trying to get as much info as possible to try to advise the OP better?
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Because the thread is really just about signing a petition! Not about quizzing OP in detail.
Sorry , but this is HHO at its worst.
 
For those poor confused souls who think I am contradicting myself, not at all, it is simple:

Ask them to turn off a bird scarer that is going off at night - saves them money so no problem.

But when they are going off during daylight hours, all be it very early in the mornings - different situation entirely. I'm surprised you farming folk do not realise that!
 
Two Christmas's ago we had several gas gun bird scarers going off every 15 minutes from about 6.30 a.m. to 8.30 p.m 24/7. (I do appreciate that birds do not take Christmas off). Despite double glazing they could be clearly heard within my house.
The day after Boxing day I contacted the landowners/farmers by phone and advised them that their gas guns had been going off all over Christmas. One of them did move them but the other did not and this is where the problem lyes. If they are not prepared to co-operate then nothing can be done about them. Unfortunately a small minority of landowners/farmers will end up spoiling it for everyone if these devices get banned.
Landowners/Farmers need to be more sensible when positioning these devices and place them well away from Public Highways and Public Rights of way and where they are placed close to them put up warning signs. It is not only some horses that are scared of them but also some dogs.
There have already been a number of serious accidents caused by these devices and if more are to be prevented then people should be sensible where they put them.
 
I think OP has very specific problems with her local gas guns and that is skewing the argument somewhat. OP is saying they go off several times a minute; frequently malfunction and go off at night; and are used for months and months, in which case I agree that is a noise nuisance and should be tackled through the local authority.

I, however, as stated in my first post live in a high bird-scarer density area and don't experience the same problems. There are frequent bangs because there are so many but thanks to the varying distances they are away, some are far less intrusive. Most seem to be set at 30 or 40 minute intervals.

I think there is frustration in this thread that the OP does not seem willing to use existing legislation to tackle the problem, rather than seeking new legislation which will affect everyone and not just those causing a nuisance to her.

ETA - because it is windy this afternoon, I can't hear them at all at the moment.

I would be interested to know where people who are experiencing real issues live, just in case there is a geographic pattern. I am in the vale of York.
 
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PeterNatt said:
If they are not prepared to co-operate then nothing can be done about them. Unfortunately a small minority of landowners/farmers will end up spoiling it for everyone if these devices get banned.
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As stated numerous times on this thread you can report them for noise nuisance if they are genuinely an issue - both the EA and environmental health follow a lot of current legislation to control noise pollution, which is what gas guns create if they are being abused - the legislation is already in place should the OP wish to use it, which she has stated she doesn't, she appears to just wants to complain about things?

The industry encourages farmers to abide by the code of practice and to be fair most do - it is (as with the actions of most equine people) a small few who get people a bad name.

http://www.fwi.co.uk/articles/14/07...-to-follow-bird-scarer-advice-or-risk-ban.htm
 
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