Bit advise please

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jsr

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I've starting doing alot more with my cob in the last year and he's got quiet a talent for jumping and is proving quiet a little XC star!! But discovering this talent we found he was getting extreamly strong and brakes were a issue, I decided to change his bit as he's always been ridden in a french link fulmer. He's now in a gag with french link mouth piece but only ridden on the main ring unless jumping when I move to the middle ring, I won't use the bottom ring. My question is, can anyone recommend another bit that would be kinder I could try, I always thought gags were quiet harsh? I don't really know though because I've only had horses in snaffles until now. He does go nicely and I'm having alot more success with his flat work and for the first time ever we have topline and muscles so I'm happy but I'm always striving for the kindest bit possible, so if anyone can advise I'd appreicate it.
 
Just so I understand - you are now using a french link bubble bit on the middle ring and the horse is going well?

If so, why change?

The ideal is to use very light aids, rather than try to get back to a snaffle.

Otherwise if the middle ring is a bit much, you could try a beval as a slightly milder alternative
 
To answer this question we'd need to know exactly what your horse does when he gets "strong".

The solution will vary depending upon what his particular evasion is.

So what snaffle were you using and when you felt the brakes were lacking what happened? Did he lean? Open his mouth? Stick his head in the air? Put his head down? Tuck it into his chest?

I would be inclined to see whether a change of noseband to a drop or grackle (not a flash unless you use a standing martingale) or adding a martingale helped before changing the bit if they horse is normally settled in his mouth.

How does he go in the gag? I assume you mean a dutch gag. Do you use it with a curb strap to stop it rotating too far? If he is happy in it and so are you then stick with it. If you feel it is a bit strong, perhaps he is dropping behind the contact then bits with a similar action that aren't quite as strong would be a wilkie, a hanging cheek snaffle, a cartwheel snaffle or a myler with slots.

If I was looking at your issue from the start I'd probably start by trying a different snaffle before I looked at gags and curb bits. Maybe a hanging cheek or maybe thinner mouthpiece or a twisted or cherry roller mouthpiece.

Unless your horse actually needs the lifting action of a gag type bit I'd go for a kimblewick rather than a gag if the snaffle didn't work. These are great for strong horses and ponies, only need one rein but have a curb. You can get them with slots and if you use them with the slots you get a bit of leverage.

If you aren't up to riding with two reins then I'd avoid gags and pelhams as roundings give very mixed messages.
 
Also if you want to do any dressage you will need to get him working in something dressage legal. A gag or pelham is not dressage legal, you would a snaffle.
 
Thanks Katt. Sorry bit more detail, yes it's a dutch gag. He's got a tendancy to put his head to his chest and lean into the bit when he's excited during jumping. Out hacking if he gets the wind in his tail he has started to evade by dropping his head and as he's quiet a spooky boy who LOVE'S gallop it was unnerving the first time because he felt very much like he was going to buck...something he never has does!! He leans on the bit when schooling too but I've been having lessons to improve our flat work which is definately helping. I ride without a nose band and don't really want to change that. I have never used a martingale and again I'm not keen to do so really. He's a very responsive forward going cob who does love his work so I'm really just wanting to keep the bounce but regain some feeling of control when necessary, I love his character and am very aware of his forgiving nature, unlike some horses he won't tell me if he's uncomfortable so I need to ensure the bit is working for us both.

Edited to add, yes I'm hoping to do more dressage during winter which is why I've only schooled on the snaffle ring as I'm aware I'll have to change the if we enter any comps. Would you suggest 2 bits one for fast work and one for schooling?
 
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I'd go with two different bits, a snaffle for flat work and something stronger for everything else. You need him to be used to and happy in his snaffle for dressage.

If he was ok in his original bit in the school then I'd go back to that. Or you could experiment with a hanging cheek snaffle as something a bit in between the snaffle and the gag.

For the fast work it sounds like the dutch gag is the right sort of thing for him as he drops his head as an evasion. As I say if you don't feel you need quite so much you could look at some milder leverage bits. You could also consider trying the dutch gag with a curb strap and two reins. Read up about bits on the sustainable dressage website it has some really clear explanations.

Be aware that you will need a cavesson noseband for competitions even if you don't bother the rest of the time. A nice loose cavesson won't make a difference to your horse's way of going though.
 
I am interested in this post as he sounds exactly the same as my cob. For flatwork and hacking he is ridden in either a kk ultra with lozenge or the neue schule verbinend bit, both are loose ring snaffles with a lozenge. For jumping and cross country he has a dutch gag ridden on middle ring. However am looking into a different bit, have been recommended the neue schule universal as a good alternative.

Don't know if it is similar to a gag or not?
 
As he tucks his head down cross country then a running gag would be idel to lift his head again. Use with two reins so that you can ride on the snaffle until he gets too strong then you have the other rein to lift his head.

A Fulmer does encourage a horse to lean - being very static its general use is to instill confidence in the bit. He might be lighter in a a loose ring, with a french link or lozenge in it.

Using anything with a curb chain or equivalent will encourage him to drop lower.
 
Thank you everyone, great to know it's likely we've got the right bit but I'll definately try out what's advised to ensure I'm doing the best for him. I really appreciate your help.
 
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