Bits for Horse with Huge Tongue and Fleshy Lips and Short Smile

sjp1

sjp1

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Yet another post about bits!! I have an Irish cob x shire x hackney who I have had since end of December. He came to me with a narrow saddle, a KK ultra lozenge bit and a grackle and martingale. He was high headed, and joggy. Have had bodywork done twice on him - he couldn't stand to be groomed or touched when I got him, and is happily groomed now with any brush. Have got a saddle that fits him now as it has been altered by template. He is very sensitive and very scared about being tacked up as well as strangers - unsurprisingly. We had the bit fit lady out - he nearly had a nervous breakdown - being bridled is not one of his favourite things and nor are strangers. I wasn't going to subject him to being ridden as well as having loads of different bridles put on so we never got to bits. I haven't ridden him very much since his arrival as he was in pain and then we were into lambing. Have just got a Bomber bit on trial which if I get a chance we will try later this week. I have a Horse Bit Fit bridle - I had bought one doing measurements myself as I was desperate and the consultant was very busy for weeks on end. Having finally got her out, I had the wrong headpiece so have the 'right one' now - again - haven't had a chance to try it as its just arrived. I just got the eggbutt Bomber Happy Tongue bit - but after having done lots of research - I think a stiller bit will be better still. His issue is bearing down on the bit and shaking his head side to side. Oddly he didn't do this in a grackle and a too tight bridle in the same bit, but he was super tense and rushing around at 100 miles an hour with his nose in the air, but I did read somewhere that grackles keep the bit stilller in the mouth. I am not a great fan of grackles so haven't been using it. I am wondering about Kimblewicks really. My friend has had a cob for around 20 years and has always used a Kimblewick on her - similar mouth conformation. I suspect lozenge bits that he has put too much pressure on his tongue, the Verbindend my appy had was even worse than the KK ultra. I have a peewee bit I could try - but just any similar experiences and a bit that suited?
 
i used a mullen mouth snaffle on my horse who had a big tongue and used to hang it out of the side of his mouth...he was much better and stopped putting his tongue out..
 
I have tried numerous bits, the latest was a Bomber happy tongue. Not bad, but still some tongue visible. Now in a hanging cheek HBF Orbit. Looking good so far, unlike my bank balance......
 
I tried the Bomber eggbutt Happy Tongue too, which is okay most of the time, but still some head tossing and tongue waving on occasion! I tried a Micklem and also a drop noseband for the same reason thinking that a bit of stillness and support would help but she hated it. I've been trying a Beris ported snaffle (the hard version) which seems pretty good - it's very light and moves slightly if they need to lift their tongues, which she likes. Although technically loose ring, it is made in such a way that it seems less likely to pinch, and also is pre-fitted with rubber bit guards. It's definitely worth a try. I also use a ported kimblewick for faster work and exciting days, with an elastic curb chain. Tried a Bombers Kimblewick with the Happy Tongue mouth, she wasn't that comfortable in it, seemed a bit too strong in comparison to the bog standard slotted kimblewick (which is technically too big for her, but she seems to like it that way).
 
I have mine in a low port myler hanging cheek, which she’s better in than anything so far... her tongue rarely makes an appearance now!
Why don’t you like grackles? Mine hates a cavesson noseband as it seems to press on the wrong part of her face. I’ve got her in a ps nirak, but I think if buying again (I MUST not buy another bridle!) I would consider a grackle. Her nose is quite short so a drop has nowhere to sit and be comfortable. I think she does need something to support the bit as she’s ok with no noseband but better in the nirak or a micklem.
 
SEL said:
NS turtle top suited mine who didn't have much room in her mouth.
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I was going to say the same, mine has very little room in his mouth and he's very happy in a turtle top after going through all kinds of bits, including a bit fitter recommendation.
 
I have found that most cobs go better in curb action bits - ported, straight mouthpiece and curb chain. For those not confident with two reins, a kimblewick or pelham with rounds can be useful.
 
Madam has a small mouth with large tongue - tried every variation of snaffle going with no joy - her favourite bit by far is her ported slotted kimblewick followed by ported pelham which I use with 2 reins.

I lunge in a Mullen mouth eggbutt atm which she tolerates 😆
 
The late Bisto was very tricky in the mouth, he had a huge tongue with a big muscle, very fleshy cheeks and although a broad forehead, he was very narrow in the jaw, we settled for a hanging cheek turtle top which seemed a huge improvement although we were still in the early days of getting used to it when I lost him. The TT Baucher (hanging cheek) sat higher in his mouth and the TT bit, because of the way it sits in the mouth, actually takes up less room than most as it sits flat. You can hire them so you don't have to send money only to find they aren't suitable. Rose is also in a TT flex, she's got a big tongue but otherwise she's more straightforward. FWIW, I was reading some research into nosebands recently and the Grackle came out as one of the kindest, the crank (properly fitted) also came out well, which rather turns around the traditional idea of what is comfortable for a horse. Also, nosebands need to be properly tensioned, not just loose or the bit isn't stabilised. The more I read the more I find my established preferences are challenged! Good luck I hope you find a bit to suit your boy, it sounds as if he's had a tricky start to life.
 
Thank you all so much for your experiences - I feel I am on the right track!! Bomber Happy Tongue was too big - going to go back tomorrow and have ordered the swivel baucher happy tongue instead to trial. I think stillness - and after all you have all said - is the right way forward. Shall ride tomorrow or Friday in the Kimblewick and see. Teeth have been done. Interesting about nosebands - I have always not been keen on drops, grackles or flashes - just because I wouldn't want my mouth strapped shut - but I do see that stillness of the bit is probably very important. Will keep you updated with our trials!!
 
So - a bit of feed back - tried the bombers swivel and he was much better in that than the KK ultra lozenge he came in but wooden so having sent the Happy Tongue Eggbut back I ordered the titanium hanging cheek happy tongue - because I thought he needed more stability in his mouth. Well, he absolutely hated it and I couldn't wait to get back from that ride!! I have now sent that very expensive bit back and just got the ultra comfy lock up snaffle to try. In the interim he has been very tricky to get a a bridle on - he has always been difficult to bridle and so have started to do some head desensitising for him which is working out well. He is head shy and his previous owner said he was a nightmare to get a bridle on. Am not convinced the HBF bridle suits him really - so, lots of work done on desensitising him head wise in the last 10 days which is going well, and have just bought a second hand Micklem bridle. I will get to the bottom of this - thought my appy was tricky bitting wise but he was a walk in the park compared to this lad!!
 
I have a Fell-same issue with mouth conformation as your horse, he's in a Cambridge mouthed Kimblewick and I school (not often lol) in a peewee.

Out of all the nosebands I like a grackle the best. I took a 17yo horse on a short term summer loan a few years back, I was determined to get him out of the flash as none of mine ever wear any kind of nosebands. But, he was 17 and knew what he liked so we compromised on an elasticated grackle-wasnt worth mucking about on a short term loan.
 
sjp1 said:
So - a bit of feed back - tried the bombers swivel and he was much better in that than the KK ultra lozenge he came in but wooden so having sent the Happy Tongue Eggbut back I ordered the titanium hanging cheek happy tongue - because I thought he needed more stability in his mouth. Well, he absolutely hated it and I couldn't wait to get back from that ride!! I have now sent that very expensive bit back and just got the ultra comfy lock up snaffle to try. In the interim he has been very tricky to get a a bridle on - he has always been difficult to bridle and so have started to do some head desensitising for him which is working out well. He is head shy and his previous owner said he was a nightmare to get a bridle on. Am not convinced the HBF bridle suits him really - so, lots of work done on desensitising him head wise in the last 10 days which is going well, and have just bought a second hand Micklem bridle. I will get to the bottom of this - thought my appy was tricky bitting wise but he was a walk in the park compared to this lad!!
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Just wondering if you found a solution? Im having the same problems as you .... thank you ?
 
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