Bitting advice - fussy WB

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EBHouse

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Just wondering what everyones thoughts are for the following;

We have a warmblood who is very fussy in the mouth - he was ridden by previous owner in a NS loose ring lozenge (not TA or verbindend) so we bought one that matched. He is happy in it in very loose side reins on the lunge but if any kind of real contact is picked up (either on the lunge or by a rider) he will try to do quite a lot to evade the bit, opens his mouth, lifts his head, or snatches his head down and pulls the reins out of the rider's hands.

He has had his teeth and back checked recently and no problems. The loose rings are not pinching him either. We put a flash on at instructor's recommendation but it made him even worse and it is becoming clear over time he is just not particularly happy with what is in his mouth.

I feel like it is time to start trying different bits but I would love to hear your suggestions as to what to try!
 
Have his teeth been checked? I use a Myler on my very fussy cob. We use the MB 04 (Hanging cheek with a low port) and she adores this! The hanging cheek mouth piece means that it is more stable than a loose ring. I would also suggest trying a Micklem bridle; this has been absolutely instrumental for helping us get more of a consistent contact. I would strongly advise against putting a flash on or anything which straps the horses mouth shut as it really is not addressing the root of the problem. My first port of call (If teeth are up to date), would be to try a Myler. The Bit Bank will be able to advise on a suitable one or I'm happy to try and advise as I trialled loads when trying to find a suitable one for my girl.
 
My WB is exactly the same. Everything has been checked, so tried him in a straight bar rubber snaffle and he improved massively. So going to try a range of non metal bits and see which one he goes best in. Quite fancy trying the nathe bits they look great. Hopefully someone will come along who has tried these.
 
I would also try a straight bar bit of some sort, he may not have much room in his mouth especially if his tongue is big, and putting a flash on in that situation would be very uncomfortable for him.
 
My ISH is similar. I had a lesson with Ginny Oakley a few weeks back and she went straight to her bit bag and pulled out a Mullen eggbutt snaffle for him and he was instantly happier. He is already ridden in a Micklem and he's happier in this too and she just suggested keeping it a bit looser for a while. I have since bought a Myler version of the Mullen eggbutt and he seems very happy in this, with the Micklem still.
 
What's the reaction in just a plain loose ring nathe?

Mine has a tiny mouth, barely 5" but a big tongue/very fleshy and adores the NS turtle top.

I actually prefer a loose flash and the bit is nicely supported by it. Particularly for Fig with a low palate and big tongue this makes sense and he much prefers this set up to a plain cavesson and even no noseband at all.
 
Thanks everyone for your ideas :)

His teeth were checked recently and he has no problems there.

We did try a flash when we first got him but he was immediately worse so we took it off, he is also more unsettled if the cavesson is done up with any degree of tightness. I have had horses that they do seem to work for but for him it was a definite no and he is such a kind and willing chap generally that we do not want to do anything to jeophardise that! Ahh if only they could talk...

Would be keen to try the micklem as a lot of people seem to really rate them but they are a lot of money to find there is no improvement - will keep an ear out if anyone local has one we could get a shot of and see.

Really interesting the amount of votes for a straight bar/mullen type mouthpiece - it wasn't something I'd considered simply because of potential steering issues - although my little sister who rides him should be turning using her legs now ;) Has anyone had problems with this?

Seems to be a good idea to try a more fixed cheek as well - again was a little worried that he might lean on it as he can be quite on the forehand at times but it perhaps seems like a good place to start.

Have just had a look at Mylers and they seemed to be aimed at providing relief to the tongue which seems like it would benefit our boy who does have the standard large wb tongue. Can anyone recommend a bit bank that would lend them out?

Nikki I haven't tried one - unfortunately the yard where we are has nothing but loose ring lozenges and the local tack shop wont trial them out so I will have to beg/borrow/steal/buy to try. Have also heard good things about the turtle top!
 
I posted a few months ago with same problems. Chomping on bit. Head tossing. Rein yanking. Nightmare. Tried all bits that I could beg, borrow or buy. He's a 17 hands warmblood. Shall 5" mouth with big tounge . Straight happy mouth was big no no. French link he chomped on. Better in simple snaffle. Best bit of all was the myler comfort snaffle with a roller. The myler bars were not as wide as the French link as its curved it took pressure away from tounge. Chomping on the bit was much better but the rein yanking and head tossing continued. I'd have spit in my face. I'm an experienced rider but was really struggling. Trot wasn't so bad but the walk was far worse. I then had a dresssge instructor show me why I was having problems. The horse was stiff and tense. He needed to bend and flex from the poll. He was short striding. Problems with the front end was a mixture of him avoiding the contact and going above the bit and it was the way I was riding. My position just not good enough. It took months of tweaking. Now, 3 months on, he's a different horse. if I hadn't had help from my instructor, we would still be having problems with his mouth and head.
 
I have used a Nathe straight bar on a fussy horse in the past and it worked well. The horse learnt to take a contact. As time went on he became strong in the Nathe so I changed to a thick but lightweight stainless steel straight bar and then later back to a jointed bit. I am having problems with my youngster at the moment with tension and reluctance to accept the bit.She was in a french link. Put the Nathe in today and she was a very different horse. Ok not completely cured but nevertheless much happier.
However when I first used the Nathe there was very limited choice in regards to bits. The bit must be about 30 years old! So there may well be something better available today.
 
I've found that my very fussy-faced WB prefers a single jointed, skinny snaffle hung lower in her mouth than I would usually fit it. But that was only after trials with double-jointed bits, fat bits, high bits, leverage bits, etc, etc. When her bit fit wasn't right, it didn't matter what I did because she was too distracted to take any note!

Your vet/dentist may be able to give you some idea of his mouth's conformation as a starting point, or check out this article: http://horsebitbank.com/mouth-conformation-how-assess.shtml

If you don't have access to a range of different bits to borrow and try, I'd definitely suggest using the Horse Bit Bank or Horse Bit Shop to try out different mouthpieces/cheeks until you find the right combination.

Edited to add: you might try a copper or sweet iron mouthpiece (or one inlaid with such), as well as different shapes and fits, to see if he's more accepting of that.
 
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I had similar problems with my cob when I first had him - tongue over the bit, chucking head around etc. I tried all sorts of lozenge type bits on the basis that the thinner mouthpiece would give more space for his fat cobby tongue, the loose ring would be less restrictive etc...

Went ok in a myler full cheek, ok but not as well in myler hanging cheek, bit better in a drop noseband, objected to flash...

Eventually realised he liked fixed cheek, and the less moment in the mouth the better, so went for a happy mouth eggbut. Looks too big for his mouth, but soft and quiet, mouths and actually salivates a little, and unless we're doing something where I might need a little more control, can school without any noseband - and went up to out first elementary in it 😃

So the bit I thought and was told would be least suitable...is the horse's favourite!
 
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