Blood testing help

[Maxidoodle]

Hi all, old user here but can’t log in, so have had to set up a new account.

Lovely H&H folk, I need your help please.

I live in the EU and am returning to the UK with my British born ponies. I have two ponies who are not studbook registered, so have to have Coggins tests. One of the ponies is elderly and very needle shy, to the point of he will injure himself, anyone in the attempt to get away. I’ve had him for 15yrs and he came to me feral. Ive worked so hard with him over the years, he’s ok with me pinching his skin, putting an empty biro up to him and pretending to inject him but the moment a stranger appears, he reverts to completely feral. Vaccinations have always been very traumatic, so we knocked his down to just tetanus, so less often and he doesn’t go anywhere.

I’ve just restarted his flu as he’ll be travelling and it was extremely traumatic, snapped a needle with his rearing and leaping and eventually I was able to get him standing with his head over the stable door (myself and vet outside), me standing blocking his backward view and vet crept up and quietly injected him behind me, the minute the needle went in he went nuts but it was obviously all done and dusted, so settled fast (he is still not speaking to me and gingerly accepts treats from afar ).

Can anyone think of a way to safely blood test him, can oral sedation be done before a Coggins test (would it even work if his adrenaline is pumping). I’m overthinking and worrying myself into a frenzy thinking will we have to PTS if we can’t get the Coggins done and can’t bring him home, he’s 33yrs old but healthy for his age and enjoying life, so that would totally be the wrong thing to do, apart from the fact he’s family and my absolute world. Leaving him here just isn’t an option.

We’ve no transport (trailer has just been sold to help with relocation costs) and we are very rural but even if I could get him to a big vets, the minute he saw strangers etc, he’d be absolutely besides himself to get away. The country we live in isn’t a cattle country, so no convenient farmers with a calf crush etc.

Can anyone think of a way to safely blood test him? I’m not sure the vets would be open to me trying to do under supervision and the minute someone else appeared, he’d be desperate to get away but I’m willing to do whatever needed.

It’s so annoying as I can do pretty much anything to him if I’m on my own, I trim him myself, I can sit on the floor in front of him and he’ll let me do pretty much anything to him, fingers in mouth, inspecting teeth, stroking his ears, he was so headshy when I got him as they used to twist his ears to do anything (I spoke to his very first owner many years ago and they were upset they had to re home him as they couldn’t cope with him after it took the heavily pregnant owner and 15 friends to round him up one day). He basically was passed from pillar to post, with multiple owners and his passport had multiple auction stickers on it, for 18yrs. I’ve had him 15yrs now and he’s my world.

H&H folk, I’m reaching out in ever approaching desperation, if you have any ideas please let me know or if I’m being a total numpty and missing something obvious, please let me know.

TIA.

 

[SEL]

Ever tried a twitch? Horrible to look at but usually means the vet can do the job quickly.

 

[sport horse]

Are you certain you need Coggins? What part of EU are you? Have a word with Shelley Ashman and check exactly what is required before you kill yourselves!

 

[stangs]

Would the vet be willing to do an appointment or several where they come over to practise the injection process - like how you desensitised him, but with them going through the process under your guidance?

 

[Maxidoodle]

Ever tried a twitch? Horrible to look at but usually means the vet can do the job quickly.

I’ve actually not, as they seem so brutal and he panics so much, it does concern me

Are you certain you need Coggins? What part of EU are you? Have a word with Shelley Ashman and check exactly what is required before you kill yourselves!

Yes, sadly we need Coggins to get back into the UK, its on the Gov website and it’s been confirmed by the transporter also. I didn’t think there were parts of the EU exempt? I’m in Scandinavia.

 

[Maxidoodle]

Ever tried a twitch? Horrible to look at but usually means the vet can do the job quickly.

sorry not sure what happened to my reply then. I’ll Have a look into one, it might be an absolute last resort.

 

[Maxidoodle]

Would the vet be willing to do an appointment or several where they come over to practise the injection process - like how you desensitised him, but with them going through the process under your guidance?

It’s a great suggestion and whenever a vet has been out to us for anything, we always ask if they will pretend to vaccinate or just fuss him and on every occasion he just is so terrified, the vet can’t get near him. He‘s even terrified of my lovely hubby when he’s not handled him for a while. Admittedly, he’s better with female vets but the female vet we just had out to do vaccinations, he absolutely hated .

 

[Fieldlife]

I think boxing to stocks / cattle crush makes sense. Maybe find a rural quiet location. Get there ahead of vet, hand graze first for a bit. Approach crush, get him in crush and feed treats until vet arrives.

You are going to have to do a bit of travelling practice before moving anyway?

 

[Maxidoodle]

Do you know, I actually thought we could possibly make a small cattle crush, hubby is an engineer and everything he builds is over engineered, so it would most likely contain something with the strength of a small dinosaur. Travelling however is not an issue, he absolutely loves travelling, he’s the one we’ve used over the years to help other load, as he‘ll load himself and absolutely loves it. We’ve no transport now, my box has gone

 

[Gloi]

Have you asked the vet if you can give sedalin before they arrive?

 

[Maxidoodle]

Have you asked the vet if you can give sedalin before they arrive?

yes, it’s one of my thoughts but I don’t have any knowledge as to whether you can sedate for blood tests, specifically Coggins?

I wanted to get as much info, so that we were armed with more info, so hubby can discuss it with the vets (the language barrier is difficult for me).

If You can sedate for bloods then maybe this is the way forward, I’ve got his second vaccination due, so I could sedalin him beforehand and see if it does help him.

 

[stangs]

Re crush, how big is your pony? Saw a DIY crush the other day that was just a hinged piece of plywood near the stable wall. I can't imagine it'd work for anything too tall and strong, but seemed to be an affordable solution for dealing with a Dartmoor youngster.

 

[SEL]

sorry not sure what happened to my reply then. I’ll Have a look into one, it might be an absolute last resort.

I had to use one on my draft horse who I'd spent a lot of time training to be ok with vets only to have that all undone by a vet launching herself at him like she was throwing a javelin. He used to pull tree trunks so it wasn't like we could control him in a panic.

Before we could get him back on track he needed sedation to look at an injury. I really, really didn't want to use a twitch on him but needs must and actually he went dopey very quickly and the vet got the needle in without any problem.

Horrible to look at but not as traumatic for them as it is for us. For pulling blood it would all be over in minutes.

 

[BronsonNutter]

He can have sedation for a coggins test - it tests circulating antibodies for EIA (and hopefully he should have none!). Would recommend domosedan gel over ACP (sedalin/relaquine) to properly conk him out if he's that bad to sample.

I would however question transporting a 33 year old that far if he finds life/new things exceptionally frightening and stressful - I know you say he is very well in himself currently but it is a big ask for a horse to travel that far (not just emotionally for him, but physically too). So think very long and hard about it.

 

[ponynutz]

I wouldn’t imagine sedation would cause any problems with blood tests. It’s often not the components of the blood they look at the but the components of the components of the blood or the quantity of certain components in the blood. Therefore they’d be able to segregate the sedation (or take into account the effects of it) if they knew he’d had some.

Re travelling, I’m assuming you took him from UK to Scandinavia originally and if he enjoys his travelling I shouldn’t imagine he’d struggle too much. WOULD talk to vet/transporter about sedation for any sea/air travel though just incase he does panic as it sounds like he’ stress himself out once he’s started panicking, bless him.

 

[Maxidoodle]

Re crush, how big is your pony? Saw a DIY crush the other day that was just a hinged piece of plywood near the stable wall. I can't imagine it'd work for anything too tall and strong, but seemed to be an affordable solution for dealing with a Dartmoor youngster.

That’s really interesting, I don’t suppose you have it in your watch history and could link it here. He’s about 32inches but unbelievably strong and determined. His thing is rearing and leaping, so if we could design something to keep his feet on the ground (across the withers maybe) that would help.

 

[Maxidoodle]

He can have sedation for a coggins test - it tests circulating antibodies for EIA (and hopefully he should have none!). Would recommend domosedan gel over ACP (sedalin/relaquine) to properly conk him out if he's that bad to sample.

I would however question transporting a 33 year old that far if he finds life/new things exceptionally frightening and stressful - I know you say he is very well in himself currently but it is a big ask for a horse to travel that far (not just emotionally for him, but physically too). So think very long and hard about it.

Thank you, this is really helpful to know that he can be sedated.

Yes, I take your comments onboard but he is absolutely fine travelling, he absolutely loves it and loves going to new places, he’s absolutely fine with someone to lead etc once he knows they have treats and is super easy to do (unless he thinks a vet is around). He was brought over by the same transporters just two years ago and skipped off the wagon full of beans. I wouldn’t make him travel if I had any doubts whatsoever about the stress on him. It’s not a straight run, they have overnight stops at yards.

 

[Maxidoodle]

I wouldn’t imagine sedation would cause any problems with blood tests. It’s often not the components of the blood they look at the but the components of the components of the blood or the quantity of certain components in the blood. Therefore they’d be able to segregate the sedation (or take into account the effects of it) if they knew he’d had some.

Re travelling, I’m assuming you took him from UK to Scandinavia originally and if he enjoys his travelling I shouldn’t imagine he’d struggle too much. WOULD talk to vet/transporter about sedation for any sea/air travel though just incase he does panic as it sounds like he’ stress himself out once he’s started panicking, bless him.

Thanks, that’s really helpful. Yes, absolutely loves his travelling, he’s always been used to load any difficult horses at every yard and then he gets frustrated when he finds out he’s not going. He came over with the same transporter and was absolutely fine on the sea crossing, he’s a well travelled little guy as he’s travelled everywhere I’ve been for the past 17yrs and been back and forth on quite a number of ferries in his time.