Bloody hate backyard breeders

[TwyfordM]

So when my Nan passed away, I took on her little dog. He’s a jack russell x chihuahua and has absolutely inherited the worst traits of both breeds. I dread to think what his parents looked like, as we took him on as a year old dog that owners wanted shot of ?
He has bad problems with bladder stones (he’s had to have op to remove twice)
Hip dysplasia in both hips, plus luxating patella’s in both meaning both sides had to be operated on and he doesn’t look right still but a huge improvement.
Both elbows have some degree of problems but not yet enough to warrant surgery (thank god!)
He has seizures every now and again but thankfully not too common.
He struggles to jump a bit, but can still make it onto the sofa and usually have to carry him home on longer walks (hyper greyhound needs longer walks, so when he stops and sits down I carry him for a bit)

His body is far too big, think jack Russell build body on chihuahua legs ?

Thankfully he’s still happy and thriving (currently barking at the window at the cat that’s dared to come into his garden, but that’s only possible due to his small size. If he was a larger dog there wouldn’t have been much they could do.

It honestly makes me cringe when I hear of people buying these crossbreed dogs because I see the absolute horrendous outcome of when it goes wrong on a daily basis.

He’s cute as anything though (which is the bloody issue!)

Grr rant over!! Pic of said difficult beast if you made it this far ...

 

[windand rain]

I agree simple cross breeding can result in the best of both breeds but just as often the worst of each breed poodle crosses are usually the worst as dogs that are not health tested are often used to breed from and a lot are money making opportunities. The idea that a single cross is healthier is ridiculous. Now a good old fashioned heinz 57 may have hybrid vigour but thats because the crosses are numerous

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

He certainly looks bright.

A friend has a Golden Retriever prone to kidney stones, she has a special diet, prescribed by the vet, with no deviation allowed but seems to do well on it. If your vet hasn't mentioned it, it might be worth enquiring about the best diet for him.

I do despair about these 'designer' breeds, I really don't understand why people support these 'breeders'. My neighbour has a cockerpoo and it is such a peculiar dog, very lacking in confidence. But then her daughter has a Spanish 'rescue' Spaniel - and I despair about that too.

 

[TwyfordM]

He certainly looks bright.

A friend has a Golden Retriever prone to kidney stones, she has a special diet, prescribed by the vet, with no deviation allowed but seems to do well on it. If your vet hasn't mentioned it, it might be worth enquiring about the best diet for him.

I do despair about these 'designer' breeds, I really don't understand why people support these 'breeders'. My neighbour has a cockerpoo and it is such a peculiar dog, very lacking in confidence. But then her daughter has a Spanish 'rescue' Spaniel - and I despair about that too.

Far too clever for his own good - thinks he’s 10x his size and a guard dog, but also small enough to squeeze out the garden ?
Yeah he’s on special struvite food but he’s a terror for stealing. Greyhound is fed in the kitchen, there’s a gate on the door but he waits for the opportunity to dash through when someone opens it and dives headfirst into the food - Lucy doesn’t even stop him she just lets him carry on ??‍ Follows small children around and waits for them to drop food too!

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I’m a member on a cockapoo fb group and the number of posts about puppies with luxating patella (and a lot from the same breeder that breeds 200+ litters a year) is heart breaking. The most recent one is a 17 week old pup going through surgery for it ?.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I’m a member on a cockapoo fb group and the number of posts about puppies with luxating patella (and a lot from the same breeder that breeds 200+ litters a year) is heart breaking. The most recent one is a 17 week old pup going through surgery for it ?.

Grrrr!

 

[Goldenstar]

Don’t you all know they are invincible because they are cross breeds, designated crosses or mongrels ?

 

[cobgoblin]

What happened to proper heinz 57 mongrels though? I've had a good few and they were wonderfully healthy dogs. It seems that as soon as humans get involved everything goes to pot.

 

[GSD Woman]

My first dog, all those years ago, was a mix, maybe beagle x. Good little dog.

Cockerpoos have been popular over here for at least 50 years. They're still a crap shoot though. In the south you don't find many heinz 57 mixes. The dogs in the shelters are hound mixes or pit bull mixes. And not healthy. The dogs that people buy seem to all be "doodles". Vomit.

 

[cobgoblin]

I don't really have anything against doodles in themselves, the trouble is that all the pedigree breeds now have various health issues, so it's hardly surprising that the crosses have multiple problems.
Breed standards haven't had the effects that were hoped for, or maybe looks were always more important than health and temperament.

 

[GSD Woman]

Where I work we see a lot of doodles. Most of them are stupid and ill mannered. Our clientele is mostly very well off and they spend big bucks on these things. They spend more than I spend for well bred German Shepherds and that a friend sells her well bred mini poodles for. A lot of these doodles can't be the mixes they're supposed to be. Such as the merle bernerdoodle. If you want the low/no shed get a poodle.

 

[CorvusCorax]

The parks and walking routes around here are packed at the moment and I've come across several really poor-tempered doodles (I'm assuming lab or retriever crosses as they're massive/leggy).
I met a bloke walking two yesterday and their reaction to my dog (walking beside me on a short lead, neutral, ball in his mouth, not even looking at them) was as extreme as I've ever seen, screaming, snarling and lunging. Because they're fluffy and cute looking, people will give them a by ball. If my dog had been doing it, you can imagine what people would think.

A well bred, lab/retriever/poodle from generations of health tested parents is infinitely more healthy than a straight cross with nothing behind it.
For me the biggest reason for the decline in health is the trend for purely pet/handbag type dogs/breeding for colour/looks.
In the past unhealthy/unsound/poor tempered dogs couldn't work or wouldn't fit into a busy family home and therefore were either not bred from or were permanently removed from the gene pool...even in the show ring, shy dogs were excused. No one wants to make tough decisions any more.

Showing has a hell of a lot to answer for but if winning dogs were taken in the round and held up as examples to be bred from, not just 'the prettiest dog on the day' and if judges actually judged to the standard instead of calling in favours and following the trends, we'd not be in this position.

 

[SOS]

People don’t care anymore about the health of their pet. They want cute and on trend. If it doesn’t work they can just sell it on.

Doodle crosses are so popular and I truly believe they are not a beginners dog due to commonly crossing a high energy dog with the notoriously stubborn poodle. You’re breeding a bit of a behavioural nightmare for the inexperienced owner. As a lot come from backyard breeders/have no breed health standard yet fetch such a high price they are bred in high numbers. So high that many have health issues and most have behavioural issues. Anxious and nervous cockapoos are very common. Labradoodles/golden doodles can be overly boisterous and are huge dogs. As always msnyof these problems are created by the owners training, or lack of, of the animal.

There’s also a trend for putting pug in things. Jack Russell’s and chihuahuas being a common victim. Which often results in shortening of the spine, shortened muzzle and a overshot jaw with teeth that look like they’ve been smashed in. What is the desire for a dog that looks that way?

French bulldogs and English bulldogs are also forever common and fetch a high price as a puppy.

I find it very hard to understand the mindset of looks before health. This thread is making me want to do a simple study where we ask owners why they chose that breed, why they felt it would be suitable for their lifestyle and what health concerns did they have about the breed.

 

[millikins]

What happened to proper heinz 57 mongrels though? I've had a good few and they were wonderfully healthy dogs. It seems that as soon as humans get involved everything goes to pot.

It's one reason why so many people, myself included go for foreign rescues. The "happy accidents" that used to fill UK rescue centres have all but vanished.

 

[TwyfordM]

It’s just so frustrating isn’t it (I’ve never met a nice doodle either!) the pug crosses are terrible too. He has the chihuahua collapsing windpipe too although it only happens if he gets too wound up ??‍

My friend breeds Griffin Bruxellos (probably spelt wrong) for pet homes and her dogs are the healthiest little dogs with the nicest temperaments. I just wish I’d known her before Nan got the pipsqueak as they are the perfect little lapdog, but relatively unknown over here.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

It makes me so sad to hear of the poodle crosses that everyone on here seems to meet. I don’t actually know that many people with poodle crosses and don’t see many on my walks but the ones I do know are just as well natured and well behaved with other dogs as any other breed I meet. But then the two I know are owned by horsey people and I think in general that gives the owner the upper hand in terms of teaching manners!

We went to a very basic puppy training course when Mabel was 12 weeks to 18 weeks and she was the top student by a mile. But then I didn’t actually learn anything on that course. She’s my first dog but I already had her doing sit, stay, backing up, recall off lead, down, roll over etc. I thought everyone would have the basics done at home but apparently not! Some people had pups of 16 weeks that hadn’t even done sit.

We then changed to a different trainer and skipped the puppy classes and went straight to a dog obedience class and even though she was younger than the other dogs by years she held her own. The trainer said some of the cleverest dogs she’d seen were cockapoos.

I guess the point to my (biased) ramble is do the owners of the neurotic, rude, aggressive poodle crosses people see bother with any of this? Or do they buy the pup, treat it like a teddy bear and not know enough about dogs to know their dog is doing wrong? I think I probably already know the answer to that ?

 

[paddy555]

this is copied from one of my facebook group.




WORDS OFF A VET WHO'S PUT IN THIS POSITION. ...SADLY IT GOES ON DAY IN AND OUT WAKE UP PEOPLE ....
From a vet
Today a man brought his dog in to me. The dog was a large, boisterous adolescent puppy. He hurtled into the room, bouncing up to me excitedly, wagging his tail all the time and nudging at my hand with his muzzle. His big squishy paws crashed against my chest each time he paused to greet me, as he bounded around the room investigating all the smells. He was an unusual cross, very striking to look at and obviously a bright and energetic dog. He was adorable.
The history went like this:
The dog had been bought as a tiny puppy by a couple who were told it was a "designer" cross between two specific small breeds. Now, if the people who bought this puppy had had the slightest inkling about what they were doing it would have been immediately obvious to them that this was most certainly not a cross between two small breeds. But anyway, they didn't have a clue so they bought the cute little puppy from this dubious source (probably at a cost of several hundred pounds) and took it back to their family home, complete with toddler.
The dog grew a bit and it became clear that it was actually going to be really big. It was bouncy, energetic and destructive. It kept racing around and knocking over their small child. So they rehomed it to a family member.
The family member also had children but they were slightly bigger children. The family member really wanted to do the right thing, so they tried to "discipline" the dog. The dog began to show occasional signs of aggression and was completely hyperactive in the home, destructive and unmanageable. I was not surprised to hear this, since it was obvious to me from this dog's heritage that it was the sort of dog which had significant needs in terms of exercise and stimulation. In an attempt to magically resolve the issues the family member had the dog neutered. Which unsurprisingly made no difference.
Today the dog was brought in to be put to sleep. It had growled very aggressively when a child had put its face near his, and between this and an imminent change in circumstances the family member felt unable to manage the dog any more. He had tried local and national rescue organisations, all of which were full. He had nobody to care for the dog overnight tonight. He was not able to take the dog home, partly because of safety concerns and partly because the decision had been taken together as a family that it was the right thing to do.
So I put this healthy, affectionate, vibrant dog to sleep while it munched on treats and the third owner in its short life cried into his fur. Then when it was just me and the body of this poor puppy I had a good old cry myself.
I know there will be people who think I was right to put down a dog who has shown any signs of aggression under any circumstances. I disagree.
I know there will be people who think I was wrong to put down a dog when I could have taken it and found it a new home. I disagree.
I also know that there will be many many people who have no idea that this is happening all the time in this country because of irresponsible ignorant greedy people, selling dogs to irresponsible ignorant feckless people, who then pass them on to naive and thoughtless "rescuers" who eventually get to the end of their tether and bring them to me for euthanasia. All the time.
These are the dogs who bite children in the home due to a total lack of knowledge, reasonable expectations and effort to socialise them adequately.
These are the dogs whose owners can afford four figure sums to buy the latest random mongrel "breed" with a stupid made-up name, but cannot afford fifty quid to get it vaccinated, far less any money at all to treat even minor illnesses.
These are the dogs who clog up rescue centres all over the country, waiting along with thousands and thousands of others for the home with no children, no other pets and eight-foot fences, with an owner who has experience of managing behavioural problems, works from home, has stainless steel furniture and can write blank cheques to pay for the inherited illnesses the dog suffers from. Homes which don't actually exist.
These are the dogs who I have to put down because I know that it is more responsible of me to painlessly take their life than to condemn them to wait with the rest of the enormous population of "difficult" dogs sitting in rescue kennels all over the country.
Please, please, I implore you. Get advice before you take on a dog - from a vet, a qualified positive behaviourist, the Kennel Club, the Blue Cross, the Dog's Trust, the RSPCA - the information is there for the taking, there is no excuse. Go to a decent breeder, who has a waiting list, or a rescue centre which really grills you thoroughly before matching you with a pet. Find out how to bring your puppies up properly so if you do find your circumstances change then at least they are rehomable. Make sure you can afford to pay for the unexpected. Make sure your expectations are fair.
Please, because I can't keep having to do this.

 

[windand rain]

I think I an probably biased as someone I knew had a toy poodle dog and working cocker bitch she bred them kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad and kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad/grandad etc. Because people paid a lt of money for them and it was a nice little earner
The above statement applies to all animals though don;t take on what you cannot deal with and don't pass on anything that has tried to hurt you. Deal with it

 

[cobgoblin]

I think I an probably biased as someone I knew had a toy poodle dog and working cocker bitch she bred them kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad and kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad/grandad etc.

This is the sort of thing I really don't understand. After the first cross, basically incest!

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I think I an probably biased as someone I knew had a toy poodle dog and working cocker bitch she bred them kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad and kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad/grandad etc. Because people paid a lt of money for them and it was a nice little earner
The above statement applies to all animals though don;t take on what you cannot deal with and don't pass on anything that has tried to hurt you. Deal with it

What on Earth! A stud fee is what, a few hundred?! Poor poor pups.

 

[blackcob]

I find it very hard to understand the mindset of looks before health. This thread is making me want to do a simple study where we ask owners why they chose that breed, why they felt it would be suitable for their lifestyle and what health concerns did they have about the breed.

I'm really hoping that the Generation Pup study is going to tackle some of these questions, they are naturally focusing on long term behaviour and health outcomes but as a participant they definitely asked questions relating to purchasing choices so I hope they pursue this in a future paper.

 

[deb_l222]

Have you tried him on Chappie for the bladder stones / struvite crystals? I've had two springers (one current) with bladder stones and my vet has always recommended Chappie over the prescription diets.

As for back street 'greeders'. While ever there is a market and people are stupid enough to pay big money for cross-breed or pedigree dogs, they will continue to breed. It's a self perpetuating business.

Most buyers don't give a rats about health testing or the living conditions of the dogs. All they're concerned about is getting little 'floof' through the door as quickly as possible

 

[CorvusCorax]

I think I an probably biased as someone I knew had a toy poodle dog and working cocker bitch she bred them kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad and kept a girl puppy bred her to her dad/grandad etc. Because people paid a lt of money for them and it was a nice little earner
The above statement applies to all animals though don;t take on what you cannot deal with and don't pass on anything that has tried to hurt you. Deal with it

When dogs aren't papered and people breed multiple litters and sell to local people, there is no way of knowing if subsequent matings are between close relatives.

 

[TwyfordM]

Have you tried him on Chappie for the bladder stones / struvite crystals? I've had two springers (one current) with bladder stones and my vet has always recommended Chappie over the prescription diets.

As for back street 'greeders'. While ever there is a market and people are stupid enough to pay big money for cross-breed or pedigree dogs, they will continue to breed. It's a self perpetuating business.

Most buyers don't give a rats about health testing or the living conditions of the dogs. All they're concerned about is getting little 'floof' through the door as quickly as possible

Hadn’t thought of chappie, he’s a fussy git plus the constant dry food clogs him up a bit. I’ve tried soaking the dry food but he doesn’t eat it, but somehow he’s still on the larger side despite small portions and no treats ??‍ He’s lost a fair bit of weight since I’ve had him but he’s still carrying a bit more than I’d like on his dodgy legs.
He’s on the specific struvite management at the mo, costs me nearly as much to feed as the greyhound ??‍ But hasn’t had any stones or problems since I’ve had him

 

[Clodagh]

When dogs aren't papered and people breed multiple litters and sell to local people, there is no way of knowing if subsequent matings are between close relatives.

But a girl at work was horrified when her bitch was impregnated by her brother, she was sure, being siblings, they wouldn’t fancy each other ?

 

[Clodagh]

The mutts when I was a child were all terrier or collie crosses, I presume they were the most free range and common.
Made nice dogs on the whole.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I'm really hoping that the Generation Pup study is going to tackle some of these questions, they are naturally focusing on long term behaviour and health outcomes but as a participant they definitely asked questions relating to purchasing choices so I hope they pursue this in a future paper.

I’d not heard of this before. Sounds really interesting and I look forward to seeing the results!

 

[wren123]

But a girl at work was horrified when her bitch was impregnated by her brother, she was sure, being siblings, they wouldn’t fancy each other ?

Dear God!

 

[CorvusCorax]

But a girl at work was horrified when her bitch was impregnated by her brother, she was sure, being siblings, they wouldn’t fancy each other ?

F

F

S

 

[splashgirl45]

when i was young, in the dark ages, pedigree dogs were quite unusual where i lived. most people had proper mongrels which could have had any parentage but many seemed to be black and tan, our first 2 family dogs were black and tan small terrier types and i now also have 2 terrier crosses ,one with 6 breeds in his parentage and the other with 3....my collie cross only has 2 so the purest of my lot....i found that vets letter so sad but very true. the poo mixes that are owned by any friends are all ok but friends are all horsey and a bit more savvy with how to train..the problem is when they are bought because people liked the idea of a non shedding cute looking puppy and have no idea about training...