Blue and white - do they grey out?

Mine hasn't, at 16 he is still very definitely coloured. However his patches are roan. I've seen a few where the patches are dappled and they have greyed out. Sorry not an awful lot of help, the gene thing leaves me a bit :confused:
 
Pie's mum said:
Mine hasn't, at 16 he is still very definitely coloured. However his patches are roan. I've seen a few where the patches are dappled and they have greyed out. Sorry not an awful lot of help, the gene thing leaves me a bit :confused:
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We have two on our yard - the one which was dappled has greyed out (at 12) and the patches can only be seen when the hair is wet (pink skin / black skin). The one which is roan is still roan (at 16).
 
I have 2, my 15 year old is now all white- patches are just visible when wet/clipped and my 2 year olds markings are mainly still lovely and dark. I don't know about the gene bit either but I guess it depends if it's roan or grey? Drummer faded at about 7 or 8 years old - still gorgeous though!
 
Hmmm it seems so hard to tell as it seems they grey out at such a mature age! So basically by the sounds of it if they're roan they should stay 2 tone... Is there any way to spot a roan over a 2 tone grey?! Thanks for your comments guys, by the sounds of it it's hit and miss!
 
Yes they can do it the horse has the grey gene. One of my ponies at work is now white (apart from a black star), started as blue and white. He is not 18 I think and you can only see the where the dark patches were when he is wet and you can see the dark skin. If they dont have the grey gene then they wont grey out. No way of finding out if grey gene or not but looking at the parents can help as the grey gene is dominant, so if both parents were NOT grey then the horse will not grey out.
 
Yes, my shetland has at 7. When he's bathed, you can see the black skin and pink skin clearly, but to look at dry, he's grey.
 
Depends what you mean by 'blue and white'. It's such a broad non-specific description!

If he's grey and white then yes, he'll grey out. If he's blue roan and white then no. There are other colours some people call 'blue' too though.
 
When I bought my girl 8 years ago as a 6yo she was white with large very blue dappled patches on her neck/shoulders and sides. She is now pure white - the black around her muzzle edges (rest is pink) is the only colour you see - unless shes freshly clipped or bathed when the patches are there... She's pink skinned apart from those old dappled areas...

At her 5 stage vetting the vet didn't even bother drawing the coloured parts saying "she'll soon be pure white anyway" - still bought her though!
 
If your horse has the grey gene it will grey out over time.

So how do you know whether or not your horse is a grey when you never met the sire or dam?

The Roan gene.

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^ Here is a blue roan foal (black + roan), this foal will stay blue roan all it's life. Note the way that the roan gene does not effect the points (ignore any white markings on the face or legs if the horse has them) so the head, lower legs, mane and tail are left black.

Here is a blue roan tobiano (black + roan + tobiano).
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If you imagine him without the tobiano - you can see how he would be like the foal above.


Strawberry roan (chestnut + roan) again note the chestnut points.
strawberry-roan.jpg


Bay roan (black + agouti + roan) can you see how this foal would be bay without the roan gene?
ClassicRoanBay.jpg



The Grey gene.
Greys are always born a colour and then grey out over time. Think of how human hair goes grey as the person gets older. Some horses go fleabitten, some get dapples but they all get greyer as the years go by. A grey foal often has grey goggles around it's eyes. A roan has a solid coloured head - so wouldn't have goggles in this way.
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My grey filly was often called a strawberry roan and many people were surprised when I said that she was in fact a grey (see photos below).

Flossyfour.jpg


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Can you see how the above horse is definately grey and white tobiano and not a blue roan tobiano? It will continue to grey out as it ages.
 
Faracat - could you help me with mine?! He started off as brown and white as a foal. 3 and a half years later, the majority of his brown bits have faded to grey with the odd brown bit still remaining. His ears are very dark grey too!

Does this mean he will eventually go completely white?
We're unsure of his breeding - mum was def a steel grey Sec A, and we are thinking sire was a coloured cob of some sort as pony currently standing at 13.3hh. Poor little guy went straight through the auctions at 2 weeks old at foot with his mum off the Welsh mountains. Can send pics if it helps!

I'm baffled by colourings so would really help :)
 
CS - he definately sounds like he has the grey gene.

Greys 'grey out' at different rates and yes, they do get paler as they age unless they start to get fleabites as these tend to increase in number as time goes by. The brown bits are just showing his original colour and will grey out in time.

He sounds like a lucky boy to have found you and I'd love to see a photo. :)
 
This is my boy, I bought him at 10yrs and you wouldn't guess from a glance he was ever coloured. The only way you can tell is from his passport, when he's just clipped and when he's wet.

It's such a shame they fade, I bet he looked lovely before... and easier to keep clean!!!

Here's a picture, you can just make out his patches.

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My old boy was apparently liver chesnut and white as a foal, and was a sort of blue/strawberry roan and white when I bought him aged 4. His patches became more dappled and paler over the years, and when I sold him 6 months ago aged 8 he was almost completely white, which is a shame, as he was very eye-catching. He's still a lovely horse though! :)
 
Faracat said:
CS - he definately sounds like he has the grey gene.

Greys 'grey out' at different rates and yes, they do get paler as they age unless they start to get fleabites as these tend to increase in number as time goes by. The brown bits are just showing his original colour and will grey out in time.

He sounds like a lucky boy to have found you and I'd love to see a photo. :)
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This is interesting and I have another question. Kal was very dark grey - heavily dappled/steel at some point but a lot (probably half) of his fleabites and some strands in his tail are very bay/dark chesnut coloured - does this mean that's what colour he was when he was born? Or is it more likely he was born black?

P
 
PS - Do you have any close up photos of his fleabites? Does he have any on his legs and if so what colour are they?

My grey has chestnut fleabites. Her sire was also born chestnut but he is currently dapple grey. This is her sire.
Calameershow.jpg
 
Faracat said:
PS - Do you have any close up photos of his fleabites? Does he have any on his legs and if so what colour are they?

My grey has chestnut fleabites. Her sire was also born chestnut but he is currently dapple grey. This is her sire.
Calameershow.jpg
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Oh my goodness he's gorgeous!

Yes, he has fleabites on his legs . . . they are both black and chesnut/bay. I don't have any closeup pics but I can probably take some if that would help.

P
 
PolarSkye said:
Oh my goodness he's gorgeous!

Yes, he has fleabites on his legs . . . they are both black and chesnut/bay. I don't have any closeup pics but I can probably take some if that would help.

P
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Photos would be great. :) If the fleabites were brown on his body and black on his legs, then I would have guessed that he was born bay. However with them being all mixed up... he sounds interesting. ;) :)

Here's Floss' sire as a foal (proving that he really was chestnut) showing that he's not just a pretty face and that he's helpful in the kitchen too! :D

flossyssire.jpg
 
Faracat said:
CS - he definately sounds like he has the grey gene.

Greys 'grey out' at different rates and yes, they do get paler as they age unless they start to get fleabites as these tend to increase in number as time goes by. The brown bits are just showing his original colour and will grey out in time.

He sounds like a lucky boy to have found you and I'd love to see a photo. :)
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Oh no! Gutted as love his colouring at the moment. Thankyou though for the clarification! Colours and genetics fascinate me but I just cannot get my head around them :)

Couple of pics, first as a foal (you can see mum in background!)

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And yesterday, not a good pic but showing his colouring! He's just started ridden work at beginning of June :) He's pulling faces as he currently can't stand any form of puddle, which is a bit difficult in today's current climate!

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Faracat said:
Photos would be great. :) If the fleabites were brown on his body and black on his legs, then I would have guessed that he was born bay. However with them being all mixed up... he sounds interesting. ;) :)

Here's Floss' sire as a foal (proving that he really was chestnut) showing that he's not just a pretty face and that he's helpful in the kitchen too! :D

flossyssire.jpg
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Alrighty . . . will have another look at them tomorrow and take some piccies. Beautiful foalie.

P
 
Cobrastyle said:
And yesterday, not a good pic but showing his colouring! He's just started ridden work at beginning of June :) He's pulling faces as he currently can't stand any form of puddle, which is a bit difficult in today's current climate!

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He's got the grey gene. :D

I've had fun with the puddle issue too. I found that making my two year old go through the ford a few times helped no end... as it was either that or the much deeper stream! ;) :p
 
Faraday that is so useful thank you so much! Now I understand much better! Apparently this horses sire is still a striking "blue and white" at 12, but judging by the other posts on here he could still grey out - which doesn't help me guess whether the offspring will or not! Currently the horse is 6, his leg and face markings look more similar to the roan you posted, but he has a large blaze. He has dark grey rings around his eyes. His tail is white however, which from your post makes me think he carries the grey gene as if he was a roan tobiano would he have a black tail? *think* I've got my head around it! Guess when he gets older we will only see his fetching patches when he's clipped out lol! X
 
His tail is white however, which from your post makes me think he carries the grey gene as if he was a roan tobiano would he have a black tail?
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Not if the tail is white because of the tobiano gene. Look at the skin on his dock (part the tail hair) is it black or pink?

Black skin and white/grey fur = grey gene

Pink skin and white fur = a 'coloured' gene eg tobiano, sabino etc...

If he has grey/white hairs on his head (not face markings eg star or blaze) then I would guess that he is a grey.

Do you have a photo?


Colours are hard to get your head around. You have to think of them in terms of the base colour (black or chestnut) and then everything else alters or modifies the base colour.
 
This is really interesting – no one seems to know what colour our yearling is. From a distance he looks sort of light bay with a brownish mane, however get up close and he has loads of whitish hairs all over (except his mane) with two patches which are more whitish – if you look carefully you can see there is a definite difference between the “browner” bit and the “whitish” bit. His dam is a mahogany bay and father blue and white (paternal grand sire was piebald). Unfortunately I’ve tried taking pictures but the colour just doesn’t show up he just looks a washed out bay! Anyone any idea what he’ll end up as.
 
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