Body Cage Back Protectors and Rotational Falls

I think these body protectors are a brilliant idea. My brother was in motorsport and has been frustrated for years that equestrian safety gear is so inadequate in comparison. I would have bought one sooner - the price is nothing when you think what it protects you from.

I thought I would see them around at tackshops so I could try one on but never saw one. I forgot about them until I had a slow rotational fall in February and it was a complete fluke that my horse didn't land on me. I didn't ride for ages and am still seriously considering giving up competing, but recently decided that I would like one of these body protectors for if I do ride XC or back another young horse in the future.

My local saddlery, Matlock Saddlery (Derby House), didn't have any in stock and didn't seem to know if they could get hold of them. I've been in various saddleries in the last few years and never seen one. I'm not prepared to buy without trying it on and I have been frustrated. I had been planning to contact you direct to find out how to get hold of one when I read the article in Horse & Hound.

I am really sorry to hear that you have made losses because the product deserved to make you a substantial profit. I recall, though, how long it took for people to accept that a safer riding helmet might have to have a larger profile than old fashioned caps and skulls. When I've discussed potential innovations in safety gear with my brother (also an engineer, nearly set up in business to do this) one of my main concerns was that it would not be profitable because (1) riders are reluctant to change, for various reasons, and (2) the governing and safety bodies are not quick to adapt and support, particularly when a product does not slot neatly into existing processes, systems and rules.

I still believe that the technology and design in motorbike wear could be well used in eventing - helmets, gloves and clothing. It is a shame that a company which is willing to innovate to provide significantly safer gear is being rewarded with losses rather than encouraged to innovate further. Given the paranoia in eventing about safety and deaths you would think it was a pretty obvious way forward.

I would still like to buy one of these and I will find a saddlery who will stock them so I can try them on first.
 
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The patent is granted for 20 years, so there is a good % of that still running, I can't remember the exact dates without checking - but it is in the region of c. 15yrs to run, however the patent is about who has the controll, the licence is about who can manufacture against that patent - and that is up to the RDA / Woof Wear etc.

I see where you are coming from - competition does help consumers, but it is the simple maths of it - if this product cost over £1 million to develop you need to have the potential for a very large financial return to allow a number of companies to compete with their own products - it just will not happen economically, it is not commerccial sense

yes, it would be ideal to have a number of people doing it - I just can't see the maths stacking up...


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See your point entirely. Out of interest, you talk about a niche market for this - why is that? Is the market for a BP considered to be a nice market? I would consider the product to be of interest to anyone who owns a Beta 3 BP.
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OK your primary audience is eventers and XC riders, but I'm interested in one and I rarely pop a small jump! I would imagine that in theory it would appeal to the masses - not just because it protects from horse falling on top of you but also from a kick or a hoof in the stomach - something that I would imagine was a lot more common in everyday riding accidents among "the masses".

Not to mention if you can get it into the racing industry.

anyhoo, just thoughts - as I said earlier, I hope it does take off
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SC, i hate to say it, but just how long do you think they'd stay there without getting nicked!
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(oh, sorry, "driven off with by accident.")
You'd have to get £300 deposit every time someone waltzed out the door in one.


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Hmm you're right, maybe you could get them to leave a valid credit card number, and could maybe do one-off covers stitched onto the basic cover that made it really unattractive, like "PROPERTY OF SO AND SO STABLES DO NOT REMOVE" in dodgy colours
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Or maybe its the wrong route to market - I wonder if Alistair or WW considered getting a team of reps to go and hold "have a go" sessions at riding club events, eventing, horse camps and the like? Maybe tag it on to BHS riding and road safety tests etc etc. Once it was into the market a bit more widely spread people would try their friend's ones on etc a bit.

Then again what was the launch process for BPs? I seem to remember they were slow coming out and catching on. How did the first company to launch that product get around it?
 
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SC, i hate to say it, but just how long do you think they'd stay there without getting nicked!
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(oh, sorry, "driven off with by accident.")
You'd have to get £300 deposit every time someone waltzed out the door in one.

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Seems reasonable to me - I've hired mountain boards before now - £20 for the hire and full cost of board put on my credit card and then voided when I returned it. Works fine, isn't difficult and solves the problem.

As for colours - I agree, wouldn't bother me in the slightest as number bibs are black and cover most of the BP anyway. However Airowear now do a 'colour swap' pull on thing to change the colour of your airowear BP - would not be too hard to do a similar thing for the body cage http://www.airowear.co.uk/colour_swap.php
 
Leaving a credit/debit card with the shop whilst you schooled would make people stop 'frogetting' about them I would have thought
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I think they are a wonderful invention, If I ever actually start eventing (more and more unlikely) I would very seriously look at buying an EXO, I think they are an amazing invention and it just surprises me that it took until relatively recently for a working design to actually happen.

Lets just hope now with the RDA taking over the patent that development will be able to continue. What they really need is a equine friendly millionaire that could 'donate' a large sum to the RDA (seeing as the benefit now goes to charity not a business) with the specific caveat that it is for R&D for the EXO!
 
Obviously you are always going to have the odd wrong'un who swans off with them but as mentioned, if you leave a deposit and become liable for the full amount then there is no reason why a ride and try before you buy shouldn't work. Might just get a few more people interested and save another life as a result?

Afterall, works for ski hire places and many others
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Some great ideas here about being able to try them... worth pushing these to Woof Wear...
Bodycage (the company) has always been in R&D, the manufacturing / sales of the final product has been with Woof Wear...

daisycrazy
- if you have difficulty finding one - contact Woof Wear directly, they have always been terribly helpful in the past.
ultimately the losses are not important - only money
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more frustrating is the belief that the product can help people but is not doing so - can you imagine how I feel every time I read of tragic accidents which might possibly have been avoided? Can be very sad - but the flip side is that there are those who have been helped, that is very rewarding.

I think that you are very accurate in your perceptions about adoption of safety wear. The reality is that an American study showed that you are 20x more likely to end up in hospital from a horse, than from a motorcycle! ... but you are more likely to have severe consequences of your accident on a motorcycle than on a horse... but it makes you think.



naturally
- is it a niche market or not? well, it depends, if you look att eh number of people who ride - it is not, if you look at those who event it is, when you look at the reluctance of many riders to wear safety kit, it is even more niche - how many of us know riders who continue to wear their 'comfortable' hat for 10 / 15 / 20 years, it is comfortable because the protective material has broken down and will be of no use! How many riders, despite their helmet coming with a warning to replace it after any damage / knock / accident, continue to ride in it - it is a reluctant market...

also, with the way the market is made up the equestrian companies out there are mainly small to medium size companies there are very few who are 'big companies' (think nike / adidas / etc.) who have the R&D money needed... If more than £1 million needs to be spent - who has that money? For us, it was private money from directors / venture capitalists etc. we were the only venture capital backed equestrian startup company (not sure whether that still holds true...), but a VC wants a return on their money, and within 5 - 7 years, so you need a product which will hit a big market so that even if it develops slowly the return is sufficient... there was c. $30 billion of VC money waiting to be invested when we got our investment 5 years ago, but the investors mainly want to buy into big investments (e.g. when the AA was bought - multi billions), not invest in a high-risk, start-up company, with a product looking at safety (liability always comes to mind!), in a market they don't understand - isn't horses lots of mothers with little girls
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so the situation is difficult, we were lucky to get investment, and it will not be easy for others...

racing industry is different - weight is v. important, and crushing accidents are less frequent, maximum ability to roll is high on the agenda to avoid hooves from following horses (you can still roll, but concern that it could slow down the roll is always in their minds) - the Chief medic of the Jockey club has had an Exo for testing a number of years ago.


Santa_Claus
Is your name fortuitous?
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are you offering! I am sure that the RDA would be interested...

regards

Alasdair Kirk
Managing Director
Bodycage
 
Daisycrazy makes some really valid points about the fact that riders (and governing bodies) are SO slow to change.
When I started going out with someone 14 years ago, he was into motorsports, and truly could not believe that the best skull cap on the market was about £50. He said a motorbike/racing one would be £300+.
I remember hunting in the early '80s and being the only one in the entire field in a skull cap. (Mum wouldn't let me go otherwise!) It wasn't until another follower with the same hunt, wearing a beagler, had his horse slip over on the road with him, and died, that more people started thinking "forget what it looks like, i need the protection."
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i fear it is the same with body protectors. i reckon in 10 years everyone will be wearing an Exo for xc.
 
I had a rotational fall two years ago at Open unaffilliated level and have since stopped xc this particular horse. I was lucky enough to be relatively uninjurd after being strechered to hospital.

If I was going XC again though this seems a brilliant idea however I have never even heard of them before.

Has any promotional / advertising work been done?

Cost should not put anyone off. I would much rather have whiplash than die and there is no chance you would have chance to roll in a rotational fall. I had a rotational fall and then the horse rolled back over me to get up, there was no chance I could move to get out of the way.

My only concern is that all unaffiliated events will not need to have the necesaary allen key but could this be somehow safely attached to the protector so the rider always had it on them.
 
DebbieLewis, there are 2 allen keys attached to the Exo already, according to the manufacturer (in an earlier post.)

Must admit, the more I read this thread, the more I think the PR company did a truly terrible job! I cannot believe people have never heard of them, or have been unable to find a stockist to try one on!
 
Debbie, sorry to hear of your fall. The body cage does have two allen keys on it, under patches with a green first aid cross on - so no danger of you not having one as there is one each side.
 
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Santa_Claus
Is your name fortuitous?
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are you offering! I am sure that the RDA would be interested...

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If I had the money I would, sadly the name cmoes from my old pony not the size of my wallet, although I think some people who may have previously been reluctant to invest might think about doing so now as the main beneficiary is 1) all the lives saved and 2) a worthwhile and deserving charity! Anyone know anyone with some spare money they could donate!?!?!
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I think some people who may have previously been reluctant to invest might think about doing so now as the main beneficiary is 1) all the lives saved and 2) a worthwhile and deserving charity! Anyone know anyone with some spare money they could donate!?!?!
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what a very very odd idea, not to say rather insulting to the people who set up the company and have invested (and lost) a LOT of money. (neither of whom i know from Adam, btw.)

i'd rather the money i spend when i buy one (when they are available in carbon fibre) went to the inventor/designer than to r.d.a. to be totally honest!

(btw i used to do a lot with a r.d.a. group, and although the charity itself is hugely wealthy, i know that our group (and all the others) had to pay affiliation to the organisation, and none of the money given to r.d.a. organisation (from wills etc) filters out to the groups - they have to do their own fundraising, and are frequently run on a bit of a shoestring.)

if one penny of the money from the sale of Exo body protectors actually makes a difference to a group, (which is where all the actual riding is done, of course) I will be impressed!

i know they are not alone in this, Guide Dogs for the Blind is another hugely wealthy charity but the low number of guide dogs actually out with people (which i think is where people who donate money, expect that money to go!) really shocked me.
I think if we found out the salaries that the big cheeses of these charities are paid, we'd have heart failure tbh.
*rant over*
 
When you think of the investment in and hype about fence innovations such as the frangible pin, the understandable paranoia about rotational falls, particularly in the US, and the tragedy of rider deaths and serious injuries, it makes no sense not to support this product and encourage innovation in other safety products as well.

It's all very well changing fence design and construction and it's crucial to educate riders to approach fences reasonably safely, but it is quite clear from the accidents that do happen that rider ability and fence difficulty/build do not entirely prevent these accidents. They help prevent accidents and/or reduce the severity of the consequences, but Darren Chiacchia's accident is a case in point.

I was wearing a beta 3 body protector in the rotational fall I had in February - ironically at a Lucinda Green XC the Safe Way clinic - I hit the deck very hard indeed, apparently directly on to my front. My ribcage felt crushed and I am still in pain where my ribs join my sternum. And that was without my horse landing on me (to the best of my knowledge). I suspect I would still have had a similar injury wearing the body cage because the crush injury was caused by the sheer force of impact (the same impact which broke my horse's neck).

Fortunately, however, I was able to get up and walk away. If my horse had landed on me I would almost certainly have been killed or at least very seriously injured. The sensation of a crushed ribcage, albeit a much milder version of what I would have experienced if he'd landed on me, was enough to remind me how easily people are damaged and killed. The cost of the bodycage is nothing and it would save you. As Kerilli says, the comparative cost of safety gear in other sports makes this product incredibly good value. Given the cost of eventing, a decision not to purchase this product based on its cost is a false economy.

Rather than waiting 10 years for everyone to start using this, I think the FEI should make them compulsory for international events. Given the cost of competing at international events I think anybody who is in a position to enter them is also in a position to purchase this piece of kit. Would that be fair? Then its use should filter down to national competitions fairly rapidly.

I would have thought that just as Goodyear have been a willing safety partner to BE, surely there must be a motor company willing to partner these sorts of developments? Most of the big manufacturers prepare cars for rallying, as well as other types of racing. Or alternatively companies which manufacture motorbike safety gear could be encouraged to develop their products for the equestrian world. Surely there would be some synergies to be gained for the partner and for riders?

Might the Express Eventing be a good platform for it?
 
I agree with you BUT some people will not part with their money as said above if it is a commercial venture. I can imagine the work that was done to find VC's willing to contribute.

I do though know people who are far more willing to donate when its all part of a charitable cause.

end of the day you have £15,000 you have to give away (not to a personal friend/family etc). You have option to invest £15,000 in a might but might not go somewhere company that might give you a return in a long time but may result in nothing at all (as the VCs would have put majority money in before product was past initial design concept) OR you can give it to a charity to help fund an existing product that is shown to save lives and can continue to. To me its an easy choice.

Though to be honest 'IF' I had the money to 'spare' I would have given it anyway at the initial stage because I believe in the worthiness of the product.

Yes perhaps my wording is bad but what I mean is it is a far more attractive donation prospect now there is a viable product that is proven to work. Yes I agree the designer should get the money as at the end of the day its a brilliant ingenious idea but maybe that was half the decision, give the patent in full to try and encourage further donation??
 
kerilli,

kind of you to be supportive - really appreciated
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- but I am not insulted at all by the comments - to be honest the reason why I have been prepared to talk to H&H now, where I was not before is that I have moved on from this company with my other companies, yes money has been lost, yes it is a shame, but - I would rather look at / see energy put into ways of helping people avoid injury or worse, rather than worrying about who gets rich from it...

I know nothing about the finances of the RDA (or the guide dogs!), when we looked for a organisation to whom we could donate the patent I liked the energy in the RDA and their desire to help those who perhaps are less able to ride otherwise - I also know one of the trustees for whom I have a lot of respect, and so it made a natural choice...

I am sure that it will be a safe pair of hands - and I am sure that many people will discuss with them what might be done - hopefully constructive decisions will come from that...

regards

Alasdair Kirk
Managing Director
Bodycage
 
My friend rides in one, she had a bad fall a few years ago and docs told her if she fell and hurt her back again she would prob be in a chair the rest of her life. She didnt take any notice and now rides in one. She says she feels very safe and once she rode in it a few times she got used to it and if it keeps her riding and protects her she will always wear one
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riding in one will be like riding in anything else new, you just have to adjust. i remember when skull caps were made compulsory loads of people bitched about the weight and the restricted vision cos of the harness and other such nonsense. sometimes people need to be led from on high. too much freedom of choice is not always a good thing.
 
Santa_Claus,

some of that is right - people do often prefer to give money to voluntary causes - in fact we are a good nation when it comes to supporting charities...
but, if you look at where innovation / R&D / new products come from - it is rarely from the charity scene, maybe some of the cancer / medical charities would argue an exception to that statement, but in reality more innovation still comes from the Drug companies who make a commercial return than from the charities.

If we look at cancer as an example, we would all say that we would want any breakthrough cures / drugs to be available to all, but which would we prefer:
- a breakthrough of a commercial nature the R&D company making a profit from it - but able to save lives
- a breakthrough from a charity - but in reality less chance of a breakthrough because there is less money...

yes, we would prefer it from the charity, but most important is that the breakthrough happens at all.

In reality, commercial gain drives R&D (and we are probably the best nation in the world for R&D - UK innovates / USA funds / Far East perfects & makes), so by having a commercial return there is more money to allow further investment...

If a charity invests in a product, but makes no gain - they will no longer have the money to invest in product no 2.
In effect by making it commercial the consumer who is gaining the advantage from the product is sharing the development cost, plus putting a little bit more back into new products

it just makes more sense...

What is also interesting to note is that we had ideas for a raft of other products - had we made the money on Exo - there would have been new products hitting the market. We developed the only stirrup to prevent damage to the meta-tarsals through a sideways rotational fall (developed to the stage where it was ready to sell), ideas elsewhere as well... some may pop up in later years, but for now those new products are lost because of the impossibility of getting the Exo to sell... no commercial return on product no 1 means no products no 2 / 3 / 4 / etc.

So, I understand what you are saying, but the decision to close down Bodycage was taken first and foremost as a commercial decision - if the company does not look likely to bring in a commercial return appropriate for the money / time / effort being put in, it is not worth running, I own a couple of other companies, so it has been more important to put my time to those. Once that decision had been made, then it was a matter of saying - lets protect the value inherent in the product, we don't wish it to die - so we donated it to the RDA.

The decisions were pragmatic - not based on encouraging further donations - what happens now is really over to Woof Wear / RDA / riders (the market!)

regards

Alasdair Kirk
Managing Director
Bodycage
 
The issue that strikes me is that BE spend a great deal of time and money looking at the safety aspects of eventing. I don't think there is anyone of us who would deny that riding cross country is incredibly dangerous and for whatever reason appears to be getting moreso. So why on earth are they not supporting the use of this BP? I see the point re. whiplash injuries but surely this pales into insignificance when compared to crush injuries....

I was aware that the Bodycage had come onto the market, but didn't really consider it at the time because they were not easily available (in tackshops) and so I forgot about them.

I also don't buy the comfort or weight factor arguments. I remember riding in the historic back protectors that were just that, they just strapped around your middle with velcro and covered your lower back. Everyone complained about them then but people do adapt - even event riders! But only if they have to.

The fact that BE didn't throw their weight behind the Bodycage makes no sense to me, the allen key excuse is bizarre and by the sounds of things totally inaccurate! Am I missing some crucial piece of information here?? £300 to protect your life to the best of your ability along with the cost of affiliated eventing is nothing..... I really think BE are at fault and would be really interested in their honest take on this....
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Thanks to Bodycage for his honesty and the information he has provided.
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Eccles,

thank you - I am not going to say anything about other organisations, other than to say that while there were individuals who were fantastically supportive in virtually every organisation, if you want to dig for the logic - then you right, you need to look beneath the surface comments...

there are some very perceptive comments from forum members above
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Alasdair Kirk
Managing Director
BodyCage
 
I'm really surprised so few people have heard of the Exo. I'm a bog standard riding for hobby type person, no horse so don't compete etc and even I've heard of the Exo BP.

Knowing that so many riding schools require BPs for jumping lessons, wonder whether it'll ever come in that no woman can ride in an underwired bra?
 
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The issue that strikes me is that BE spend a great deal of time and money looking at the safety aspects of eventing. I don't think there is anyone of us who would deny that riding cross country is incredibly dangerous and for whatever reason appears to be getting moreso. So why on earth are they not supporting the use of this BP? I see the point re. whiplash injuries but surely this pales into insignificance when compared to crush injuries....

I was aware that the Bodycage had come onto the market, but didn't really consider it at the time because they were not easily available (in tackshops) and so I forgot about them.

I also don't buy the comfort or weight factor arguments. I remember riding in the historic back protectors that were just that, they just strapped around your middle with velcro and covered your lower back. Everyone complained about them then but people do adapt - even event riders! But only if they have to.

The fact that BE didn't throw their weight behind the Bodycage makes no sense to me, the allen key excuse is bizarre and by the sounds of things totally inaccurate! Am I missing some crucial piece of information here?? £300 to protect your life to the best of your ability along with the cost of affiliated eventing is nothing..... I really think BE are at fault and would be really interested in their honest take on this....
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Thanks to Bodycage for his honesty and the information he has provided.
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Eccles - my take on this is that it was a political decision - BE have 3 BP manufacturers amongst the sponsors listed on their website, let alone all the pros who are sponsored by them. Can you imagine the outcry if BE effectively forced the market into a monopoly situation where only one company made a required piece of safety kit? Personally I think BE has been downright irresponsible in this too, and I agree with Kerilli that it is onyl a matter of time before these are standard wear XC.

FWIW I think those behind BodyCage have shown a great deal of strength of character by allowing the patents to be donated to the RDA - it would have been very easy for them to pack up shop and this to sink without trace, as it is, at least there is the potential for the lifesaving benefits to be utilised in future by riders.
 
America - now that is an interesting one
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Liability insurance is very expensive...
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but...

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/competitionnews/article.php?aid=257286
(for those who don't remember this - a family is suing over the death of their daughter from a rotational fall - not directly related, but still...)

Interesting article, and will be very interesting to see what comes of this, won't be long before this response is common over here... we are seeing an increasing amount of litigation in every part of life...

There are certainly people in the USA who have bought Exos from the UK...

regards

Alasdair Kirk
Managing Director
BodyCage
 
I think this has been one of the most informative threads I have read on this forum. I mentioned this to another livery on our yard tonight........who turned out to be Spotted Cat! I also discussed it with my teenage daughter, who I honestly thought wouldn't ever consider wearing it (because she still refused to wear a back protector out hunting) - but after an fatality at an event near to us, she definately thinks they are a good idea. I am actually impressed with the price. I had thought they were nearer to £500 - just under £300 is a small price to pay for more reasurance. As someone else remarked on here, possible whiplash (if that has been proven) is a better outcome than what could happen. I for one will be looking for the nearest distributor.
 
I think it is a great shame that the company has decided to close - albeit handing over the design and patent to the RDA. I think this is a great product - in theory as I cannot comment on it in practice although it is something I have considered for myself recently. There can be some sniffiness in eventing about new safety products - like it makes you less brave or something or it diminishes the sport in some way. This is rubbish - making our sport safer is a way of preserving it for years come! If there were issues or concerns about this product it would have been wonderful if users could have given their feedback to the company and perhaps this situation could have been avoided, but it seems some quarters have set out to discredit this product and I think that is a great shame
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