Body Cage, BE AGM and Eventing Safety

I would like to ask how many of you advocating the EXO be compulsary have actually worn and ridden in one. I have I found it unbearably claustrophobic, a bit like your entire body being encased in a ski boot. I also found it very heavy.

B would not want to wear one as she needs to cut down all excess weight on the pony (she can't get herself any thinner - 5'6" size 8-10 and 8.5st. A friend uses one (it was hers I tried) and it really affects her jumping position - she is 'heavy' in the air as she can't fold easily.

I think alot of research neds to be done on the construction and how it affects all body shapes and abilities of riders.
 
Thistle, I've just had a chat with a friend of mine who has one. She said that the only time she has been aware of the weight was when she was held on course for 45 minutes somewhere. she is about 5'10" and i'd guess she weighs about 8-9 stone. she said that it doesn't affect her position at all.
i must admit, i haven't ridden in one, but i intend to. if this will probably save my life in a rotational, i'll adapt my riding style to wear it, if necessary.
even a pony probably can't tell really the difference another 4lbs will make, i should think, since that's probably about 1% of his bodyweight! (the equivalent to us carrying a handbag around, at a vague guess.)
 
I have worn one but not ridden in it - did you actually go XC in it? Just that things often seem uncomfortable when you put them on (I hate wearing a stock
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) but once you are off and runnung you don't notice them - actually ski boots are a good example, horrible to walk/sit in but fine when you're skiing.

FWIW it seems hard to believe that the EXO should prevent you folding properly if it is correctly fitted, perhaps your friend's wasn't very well fitted
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i agree with this. i've worn one for 5 mins on a tradestand, not to ride in, unfortunately. i agree that kit feels uncomfortable until you get going (i put my bod protector on at the last minute, and take it off the moment i dismount) but as soon as i'm riding, i forget it completely.
 
Agree with all that - both Kerilli's angle on safety and regarding uncomfortable kit - I hate my stock as I can't bear tight things round my neck, but it is amazing how quickly I forget it.

I'm afraid that if someone can go round a 3* as LauraT did (Bramham) and do it well in one then the rest of us messing about at Novice etc have nothing to whinge about!

I don't necessarily think they should be compulsory right now, but I do most definitely think that BE should be backing them and putting some of the research effort that has gone into trawling that portable round the place and implementing then repealing rules like one fall and E into getting the body cage to the next generation model with more sizes and lighter materials. That said, if I find the short version fits me then I will buy one tomorrow - I would rather be the tale from Spring Hill than the tale from Hartpury, and as I never win any rossies anyway I won't worry about the effect it has on how well I do, as I think it'll be minimal.
 
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SC you have summed up alot of what I think, the present model would not suit us but an improved, lightened, better fitted one probably would - in which case I would buy it.

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And that is the point I intend to take to the AGM - with the resources Goodyear has at its disposal, and the backing of BE, how long would it take to go from something which works now, to a better version?
 
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SC you have summed up alot of what I think, the present model would not suit us but an improved, lightened, better fitted one probably would - in which case I would buy it.

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And that is the point I intend to take to the AGM - with the resources Goodyear has at its disposal, and the backing of BE, how long would it take to go from something which works now, to a better version?

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Yes, absolutely.
On the other thread, Bodycage says that they need to sell now as they are to generate the money for more investment in a lighterweight version etc... but I'll bet i'm not alone in not wanting to spend £300 on something which will possibly be obsolete in a year or two... i'd rather be able to get my hands on the lightweight one!
 
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SC you have summed up alot of what I think, the present model would not suit us but an improved, lightened, better fitted one probably would - in which case I would buy it.


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And that is the point I intend to take to the AGM - with the resources Goodyear has at its disposal, and the backing of BE, how long would it take to go from something which works now, to a better version?

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I completely agree with this and Kerilli's point re the misconception/theory of attempting to eliminate horse falls being impractical.

Furthermore re Burghley, I wonder if you'd have seen so many accidents at the mushroom if it were constructed of prolog material. Maybe there is a call for construction of this kind at certain types of fences, that said; can a few types of fence be identified that are inextricably linked to rotationals? Research, research, research...

SC, you have my backing, a great idea.
 
<font color="#666666"> </font> Not taking it personally at all!
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I would try to save for one if I could get one to fit whether they were compulsory or not. Anything that could save you life has got to be worth it. However, due to personal circumstances, I work part-time, and my horses ('competition horse' and his companion) are run on a shoe-string budget. They don't want for anything, but don't have much they don't need! So it would be difficult to save that money - what I save on entry fees in the winter goes on bedding and feed instead!

Anyway, that's getting off topic. I would like to see them made more widely available to the masses - they would have to fit everyone before you could make them compulsory! <font color="#666666"> </font>
 
Shaab, the trouble is, ANY fixed fence (and as i've said above, even a show-jump!) can cause a rotational. If you've seen Darren Chiacchia's fall, at an innocuous fence, you'll see what I mean. Small fence, very experienced rider, horse jumped the previous fences well and cleanly... then, out of the blue, truly horrifying fall.
The horse only has to get it horribly wrong, be distracted, misread the fence, misunderstand, ignore over over-react to the rider's input (which may not be perfectly judged anyway!) and a rotational can result. Although certain types of fences are more likely to cause one, it can happen at any fence, even a simple log.
 
Kerilli, I completely understand that view point, and Darren Chiacchia's fall is a good example of when an innocuous fence can cause an horrendous fall.

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Although certain types of fences are more likely to cause one, it can happen at any fence, even a simple log.

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However, this is more what I'm getting at.. If certain types of fence can be linked with an increased percentage of fallers surely research into the options available regarding collapsible type fences would be viable? I'm purely suggesting research into the types of fences that seem to cause relatively more horse falls. I understand we'd be unlikely likely to see anything implemented at grass roots level (I'm sure the costs involved in reproducing prolog fences are big to say the least) but perhaps future, potentially fatal accidents could be avoided, like at the mushrooms (although thank goodness there weren't any true rotationals) at Burghley, with a fence seen to cause problems in previous years.
 
The idea of this is sound and would definately work in theory, but realistically, for example at Burghley, you would have needed, how many mushrooms, sitting in a trailer ready to replace each one that got landed on. and it'll still be a simple innocent looking fence that still catches someone out. The fact that a rotational fall can happen over ANY solid fence really means that unless ALL fences are made of this stuff, then the protection needs to be installed in the constant (the rider), rather than the variable (the fence). If there is a fence that is identified as having a particularly high risk of causing a fall, then that fence, really needs to be rethought entirely, not just to make it out of breakable material or stick a frangible pin in it. Does anyone know what was the problem was with the mushroom? why were so many horses falling at it?
 
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If there is a fence that is identified as having a particularly high risk of causing a fall, then that fence, really needs to be rethought entirely, not just to make it out of breakable material or stick a frangible pin in it.

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Point taken Baileyhoss, I also think this is a further point for more research into specific fence types that cause problems too. I do understand that a rotational can happen at any fence but in juxtaposition certain fences now have frangible pins for a reason too.. Re the replacement of a fence on multiple occasions, I'd rather be replacing a fence 50 times than one rider at all, but I do see your point from a cost perspective. Out of interest has anyone actually seen a Prolog? I'm personally expecting them to be a lot tougher than many people expect. I'm not suggesting collapsible fences are an answer or even a viable option, just advocating further inquiry/investigation into the whys of horse falls and the hows of protecting riders..
 
Just a thought to those who want to wait until a BodyCage Exo is released in a lighter material - are you not going to be eventing until then, as every time you leave the start box you DO risk a rotational fall, or indeed any other type of fall.

I would say the oppertunity for making the sport safer should be taken, then if in the future the Exo is released in carbon fibre, maybe a return system with a reduction in purchase cost of the new Exo.
 
I would quite happily back a proposal to BE that we want more research and development on this proposal, Being 5'2 7 stone and having a bad should make the current version a poor fit and too heavy for me, however I would defiantly buy a leightweight version that could be taylor made like my current BP had to be.
 
Baileyhoss has hit the nail on the head, that was what I was trying to convey. The final fence at a certain horse trial, PN/N has, to my knowledge, caused 3 serious falls (iirc one of them was fatal). It's not a coffin, skinny, related distance, optical illusion or anything else, just a pretty normal-looking fence.
Crazymare, I am going to contact WoofWear and see if there is a local stockist, now that I know that the Exo weighs only 4lb more than a normal bp (i've lost more than that since I was last eventing anyway!) and try to get hold of one in my size for my remaining few events, fwiw.
 
I don't event so forgive the dumb question, but how big is Novice? My filly *may* event in future, depending on how big she is and if I am allowed to event her.

I've just been reading this as I'm interested in the safety aspect.
 
novice is up to 3'7" xc. sj is a course of mostly 3'7" ish fences (first one lower) with an upright and a spread allowed to be 3'9".
For Intermediate, add 2" to all these. For Advanced, add another 2".
Of course, the fences get much much wider at the higher levels too...!
 
Plenty big enough then!!! I do love watching events, and have done the odd unaff ODE which is great fun!

Will be interesting to see how the Exo stuff progresses with BE and weather BP's are made compulsory for SJ - I had a nasty fall SJ when my mare hit a filler and we scrambled around trying to find legs before both hitting the deck. A BP may have prevented or lessened my massive brusing.
 
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novice is up to 3'7" xc. sj is a course of mostly 3'7" ish fences (first one lower) with an upright and a spread allowed to be 3'9".
For Intermediate, add 2" to all these. For Advanced, add another 2".
Of course, the fences get much much wider at the higher levels too...!

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Funny, when you say it like that they don't sound all that big at all. Amazing what a difference an extra 2" makes!!

I think I will try one on next time I spot one - does anyone know about stockists in Northampton?

Wouldn't wear one unless it really fitted properly though.
 
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Amazing what a difference an extra 2" makes!!


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PMSL............ you don't say.......
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Seriously I have been a fan of the Exo concept from the word go...was gutted to find out that it didn't come in larger sizes.
As has already been pointed out rotational falls can come over any type of fence.

Remote chance of whiplash, versus death.....hmmmm give me .2 of a millisecond to think about that......
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IF I were registered with BE which I am not, I would be pretty hacked off to have a compulsory rule like what form of protection I chose to wear when eventing for something that needs a lot more "road testing" shall we say.

I love the concept dont get me wrong and I do believe they could save lives, however, without further R&amp;D I am not 100% there is not room for improvement or that there could be other issues.
 
Just to add my pennies worth ...

I am a full time event rider and have been competing in an exo for three seasons now all the way up to advanced.
Yes they feel odd to start with, but get on a horse and start riding and jumping and you really don't notice. I have had several falls in mine, thank god nothing dreadful but I can guarantee that you can definitely roll well in one and it works! This is yet another myth that seems to have grown legs and run.
The key issue is ridiculous. you only have to use it in a real emergenecy if the paramedics could not move you after a fall. Not only do they carry allen keys but there is one inside a pocket on the actual body protector at all times. On a day to day basis I can put it on and take it off myself by simply clipping it on.
It is a crying shame these have not been taken more seriously and so many rumours have been run with.

I certainly won't be changing back any time soon and am more than happy to answer people's questions from a riding point of view.
 
that's really valuable info for those of us who've never ridden in one, thank you.
just out of interest, roughly how tall are you and how much do you weigh, and do you feel the weight of it at all once you're riding... i'd guess not.

apparently the reason that competitors have to tell the secretary they're riding in one, etc, etc, in spite of the Exo having 2 allen keys in pockets on it anyway, is that someone turned up at an event with one having removed both allen keys... there's always one, isn't there!!
 
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Just to add my pennies worth ...

I am a full time event rider and have been competing in an exo for three seasons now all the way up to advanced.
Yes they feel odd to start with, but get on a horse and start riding and jumping and you really don't notice. I have had several falls in mine, thank god nothing dreadful but I can guarantee that you can definitely roll well in one and it works! This is yet another myth that seems to have grown legs and run.
The key issue is ridiculous. you only have to use it in a real emergenecy if the paramedics could not move you after a fall. Not only do they carry allen keys but there is one inside a pocket on the actual body protector at all times. On a day to day basis I can put it on and take it off myself by simply clipping it on.
It is a crying shame these have not been taken more seriously and so many rumours have been run with.

I certainly won't be changing back any time soon and am more than happy to answer people's questions from a riding point of view.

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THis is very useful input. Is there any way you might consider going to the BE AGM to discuss this issue? Spotted Cat is tabling a question but is keen to have some moral support in case she seems weird and isolated (she's not!
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) One or two of us have volunteered to go along with her but the thing is none of us so far who have said we'll go are actually riding in these things so our position is somewhat weakened if people put forward arguments we cannot refute. Any chance? Could manage a few drinks too to justify the journey, no doubt
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I am tall, 6'0 and weigh about ten and a half stone. Would have to check what size mine is but had to have the long version to get the full benefits.

The only time I notice the weight is whilst xc schooling if I am in it for a protracted period of time, this is only really if I go with several others or do several back to back. However this is mainly because of an old broken collar bone on one side which is raised - but that's my problem for being wonky falling off and getting bust years ago!

I do remember feeling odd in it when I first tried it on but now an old school one feels flimsy and ridiculous.
 
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