Brave Pants Advice Required

[Whoopit]

A bit long winded so please bear with!

So, my steed (Zangersheide) went off to be backed. Went with fitted tack, had been sat upon - went well. The week before he was due home I went down to ride him all week. Hacked out really nicely in company and alone (with a pedestrian buddy) and then I rode him in the round pen just for something different.

He threw me off after one trot round. Make no mistake - I did not fall. He bronked and bucked and threw me off. Bullseyed me into a (wooden) wall, had head and neck pain for about 10 days. Damaged my little finger to the point I wish he’d broken it as I now have problems with my hand.

He was ridden the last week by the lady who backed him with zero issues either hacking out or in the round pen (very very reputable person) and he came home the following week. Was horrendous to try and tack up (always used to put his head down and open his mouth for the bit) and was just an awful twit but spelt with an A.

So I’ve persevered with tacking up and he’s back to normal - dead easy, exactly how he was before he left (end of March he went to be backed - was away 6 weeks). Now, just to point out I am fully aware he is a baby. He’s 3, only gelded 6mths ago and 17hh (sold as “to make 16.2” ? ) with some growing, I suspect ?

I finally got round to sitting on him - literally that was it - and when I got off I was shaking like a leaf. I hadn’t realised the throwing off had bothered my subconscious so much (I am also a mother of going child and I kid you not, majority of my established gung ho attitude has evaporated since having little person!). I have also noticed that even tacked up and going for a walk, he never has his ears forward - he always looks a little bit worried about thing.

Where do you re-start yourself with the particular horse? I only intend pottering to the end of the lane and back - not even a mile round trip but I’m feared of getting on the bloody thing! Anyone else been here before or have any advice?

 

[AdorableAlice]

You will hate me for this, but my thought would be to move him on before your confidence takes a possibly permanent hit.

 

[shortstuff99]

What is the reputation of the person who backed him? I know young horses can be unpredictable but if he had been started well then he shouldn't have acted like this in my opinion.

It might be worth finding a new trainer to work with both you and him and to take it back a few steps.

 

[webble]

Get everything checked and maybe some time off? Hes young for such a big horse maybe he needs more time?

 

[Old school]

Agree with Adorable Alice. I was the exact same as you. Had a three small children and my confidence was shot. I persisted with the wrong horse for far too long. Once I got my steady neddy and allowed myself some time, things improved. Recently had a nasty rotational fall (off different animal). Very surprised at how it has not knocked my confidence. Shocked, to be honest. So your confidence could or should return by sitting on the right animal and by being patient with yourself.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I would have thought that a round pen was too small for a young horse of his size, so I'm not surprised that he reacted badly to being ridden in there. I would keep to straight lines/shallow loops on such a big youngster. If you particulary want to make it work with him, I would take a few steps back and find a helper to be present whenever you work with him.

 

[Jellymoon]

What is the reputation of the person who backed him? I know young horses can be unpredictable but if he had been started well then he shouldn't have acted like this in my opinion.

It might be worth finding a new trainer to work with both you and him and to take it back a few steps.

These are my feelings too. I think he’s not happy. There are quite a few hints in your post that you feel the same way, eg. you mentioned saddle and bit, not wanting to be tacked up, grumpy face etc.
I wonder...as he’s still only 3...would turning him away for a couple of months be a good idea? Then perhaps starting him up again almost as if he has if he hasn’t been backed yet, after you’ve checked and double checked that his saddle is comfortable and he likes his bit..
.Also, could you do all that yourself, so he gets to know you and you get to know him, and you know it’s all been done calmly and patiently without upsetting him.

 

[pistolpete]

I agree with everything said so far. Would also Chuck in for good measure there are tons of confidence building courses available BUT this boy needs you to be confident first or you’ll both suffer. Your gut feeling is right at the moment it’s trying to keep you safe!

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I would either sell him or turn him away for a bit he is 3 and his basically been backed and might benefit from a break until his a bit older.

 

[Lucky Snowball]

Might be difficult to sell as many potential buyers will expect the current owner to ride before they have a test drive. Maybe a few more weeks with the person who previously rode the horse then sell from there (sales livery) or bring home and stick to gentle hacks with a horse or pedestrian companion. Personally I would not turn away until this issue is sorted.

 

[Melandmary]

I would turn him away till next spring, 3 is very young and have some lessons/find a confidence giving share till then. Restart him slowly next year and be part of the process. It wl give you time to think about whether you want this sort of horse. I do believe when horses are sent away to be trained they can find it stressful and a bit rushed. The trainer might be confident enough to push them through but if he is relying on you for that and you aren't feeling it, it is a recipe for disaster

 

[OrangeAndLemon]

Not only is he young at 3 but he's a big horse at 17hh, it'll take him time to grow into himself and build the right muscle to be able to support himself and a rider to trot around a round pen.

Did he have a break after being backed? That might be what he needs as others have suggested.

 

[Carrottom]

Would it be possible for the person who backed him to come and ride him out at your home. I would do this and then maybe ride him for a short time with them present. Then probably turn away for a few months.

 

[irishdraft]

My thoughts would be he is a very young horse who has recently had to take alot on board if you can find a way to safely and confidently continue with a bit of easy hacking ie employ someone else for a month to see how he copes and if alls well then turn away and restart next spring. If your still having problems then reassess.My experience of young horses is they can do things which don't always have a logical answer but do come good after time . Depends how much you want to keep the horse .

 

[Regandal]

Are you 100% sure that the saddle fits?

 

[eahotson]

One of the things I

Agree with Adorable Alice. I was the exact same as you. Had a three small children and my confidence was shot. I persisted with the wrong horse for far too long. Once I got my steady neddy and allowed myself some time, things improved. Recently had a nasty rotational fall (off different animal). Very surprised at how it has not knocked my confidence. Shocked, to be honest. So your confidence could or should return by sitting on the right animal and by being patient with yourself.

One of the things I personally regret is persisting with an unsuitable horse for far too long.

 

[Lady Jane]

I would get him checked out physically and address any issues and then turn away until the Spring and restart where there are better facilities - big menage, good surface and off road hacking. I know that may be easier said than done. In the mean time if you could find a staedy Eddy type (anything that you feel confident on) to ride occassionally and build your own confidence in the mean time. Good luck, keep us posted.

 

[paddy555]

I finally got round to sitting on him - literally that was it - and when I got off I was shaking like a leaf. I hadn’t realised the throwing off had bothered my subconscious so much (I am also a mother of going child and I kid you not, majority of my established gung ho attitude has evaporated since having little person!). I have also noticed that even tacked up and going for a walk, he never has his ears forward - he always looks a little bit worried about thing.

Where do you re-start yourself with the particular horse? I only intend pottering to the end of the lane and back - not even a mile round trip but I’m feared of getting on the bloody thing! Anyone else been here before or have any advice?

you are not going to like this but your post screams out the problems. He is 3, very young and has a lot of growing mentally and physically to do.
He is nervous. Someone has to be in charge handing out the confidence, telling him life is OK, good and it's fine to march on, there are no dragons.
At 4 he is going to be more confident and probably a lot more naughty, 5 could well be not much better and will need a strong confident rider to push him on, encourage him as he will be " kevin the teenager" by that stage to get on.

On your side you have lost your confidence and you need him to look after you. If he knows you are scared of getting on him and riding down the road it is simply going to make him terrified.

I would sell him now. Lots of riders who would give him the rest of the year in the field, re start him next year and love to have him.
I know this is not what you want to hear. I suspect it is going to take a very long time to get your confidence back even if you get to the stage of being able to push on this size of youngster. This is meant to be fun. If you keep him you are going to hinder him and reduce yourself to a nervous wreck. If you sell and find a confidence giver of a horse you can enjoy riding and start to rebuild your confidence.

 

[cauda equina]

Trotting a huge 3 yr old in a round pen sounds quite a big ask, he probably hasn't got much in the way of balance yet
I wonder if the broncing was him losing some balance and panicking; my youngster does this if he slips on the lunge (I don't have a school so have to lunge on grass)

A gut supplement might be worth a try, given his general worried look

 

[Lipglosspukka]

I'm assuming he must have just turned 3 and in theory as he was broken in March, he will have still been 2?

To me, he needs to be turned away now to mature and when restarted, I wouldn't be using a round pen. Lots of quiet, gentle hacking. Working in a circle will be hard work for such a young, immature and likely unbalanced horse.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I echo all the others - at rising 3/just turned 3 nd 17hh he is going to throw challenges your way however nice he is. Young horse can buck, bronc to regain their balance, then the rider on top can scare them more if they also lose balance or grip or hang on so it ends in a wreck. Then THAT scares them too as being fallen off the first time is very scary for a horse. You absolutely need to project calm confidence with a baby. And never view it as 'naughty', just as reactive to new experiences, unconfident, unsure etc. Just think how some horses get freaked the first time they take a step forward and realise they need to balance a rider as well as themselves. Plenty of horses who are fine being leaned over, sat on then get stressed when they take a step forward and feel the weight of the rider shifting slightly. You need to educate and reassure. You are not able to do that so I'd either turn away and let someone else bring back into work when he has strengthened up a bit. Or recognise a huge baby is not a good fit for you right now and sell. He sounds totally genuine - as in calm and willing when feeling ok about things but just loses the plot when outside his comfort zone. So he could be a lovely horse for someone. I don't agree with those saying you need to 'sort this issue'. As far as I can tell from what you've written, there isn't really an issue. He's just a baby horse doing baby horse things.

 

[Upthecreek]

If he’s 17hh at 3 years old I’d be turning him away for at least a year.

 

[littleshetland]

Ditto all the above. Perhaps before you turn him away again, finish on a good note - to benefit both you and the horse - finish on a good, positive and calm lunge session, perhaps use an arena so he has more room rather than a lunge pen, and then maybe someone laying across his back, make a big fuss of him and leave it there until next spring. I'm a big believer in taking a step back (training wise) if it's not working out. 3 years old is very young, and if he's a WB (?) they do take a long time to mature, mentally and physically. Just sounds like a big baby to me!

 

[PSD]

Echo what others have said. I personally wouldn’t touch a horse of that size until rising 5, but that’s personally choice. I would either sell now as lightly backed or turn away for 18 months.

 

[AdorableAlice]

It is interesting to read the differing thoughts, all of which are right and valuable. I do think we all change in terms of confidence as we age, have families or illness and added responsibilities. All have to factor into our riding and enjoyment of horses. I am so old now that a humped back and tail swish is enough for me to be getting a younger person on it first !

I have had big horses for years, they do need lots of time and a careful incremental education with a good proportion of it done outside the arena. There was one piece of guidance I was given decades ago by a man who broke horses for a living. 'Never fall off a young horse, it unnerves them and sets you and them back'.

Easier said then done of course, but it is still very sound advice. Backing and riding away is an art and finding the right person for tricky horses is even more difficult. Confidence is a fine balance and easily lost for both horse and rider/owner. I firmly believe if true fear is felt, not just a tingle of nerves, before getting on a particular horse, the horse is the wrong one for the needs of the rider.

 

[cauda equina]

Or to put it another way, the rider is the wrong one for the needs of the horse, for now anyway

Littleshetland's suggestion (get on, get off, turn him away) sounds very sensible
The horse might not gain much from the 'sit' but the OP will be set up for next year with something good under her belt

 

[littleshetland]

It is interesting to read the differing thoughts, all of which are right and valuable. I do think we all change in terms of confidence as we age, have families or illness and added responsibilities. All have to factor into our riding and enjoyment of horses. I am so old now that a humped back and tail swish is enough for me to be getting a younger person on it first !

I have had big horses for years, they do need lots of time and a careful incremental education with a good proportion of it done outside the arena. There was one piece of guidance I was given decades ago by a man who broke horses for a living. 'Never fall off a young horse, it unnerves them and sets you and them back'.

Easier said then done of course, but it is still very sound advice. Backing and riding away is an art and finding the right person for tricky horses is even more difficult. Confidence is a fine balance and easily lost for both horse and rider/owner. I firmly believe if true fear is felt, not just a tingle of nerves, before getting on a particular horse, the horse is the wrong one for the needs of the rider.

I agree. Our confidence is the finest gift we can give to a horse so its so important that we look after it, but I think in this instance the OPs horse is such a big baby he needs a proper chance to grow and mature a bit more and then in time he'll prove himself to be the lovely boy he (hopefully) is.

 

[Ownedby4horses]

I agree with the posters who have suggested turning away. OP, always set yourself up to succeed, not to fail. Take all the pressure off yourself, turn away, go and find a super confidence building horse (riding school/friend’s horse) just to ride occasionally and set yourself up for when you bring your boy back into work.

When you’re ready to bring your boy back into work, perhaps get a pro to come to you, so that you can see how the pro does things and get them to work with you once you are back onboard.

 

[celeste-izzy]

I don't think you should consider selling him, he's baby and babies have blips. The change in behaviour is most likely his confidence, if he picks up you're heart rate is slightly higher etc he won't feel as relaxed.
Given his height, I don't think hopping on and pottering him around for now is such a bad idea. Lunge him before hand if you need too, he won't break being lunged for 10-15 mins. It will help you gain your confidence back and build a relationship under saddle. I've backed many big 3yos and lightly kept them going until 4 and none of them have come out worse for it.

 

[Ossy2]

Has he only turned 3 this year? If so I’d personally turn away till next spring. If turning 4 this year I’d be tempted to get some decent at home help. You need to be filling a baby with confidence, little and often sessions don’t struggle on your own.