breaking roller/saddles

siennamum

siennamum

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I'm paying particular attention to threads about breaking horses at the moment and have noticed something which suprises/horrifies me.
I have always had it drummed into me that potentially the worst thing that can happen is if your roller/saddle slips back. You don't neccesarily tighten them as much as you would if you were on board, especially when you are getting them used to the sensation, and they are likely anyway to hoon around increasing the chances of the roller slipping back.

If they slip back of course they become bucking straps and are likely to cause the horse to panic. The results could be absolutely catastrophic.
I always add a breastplate of some sort, even on a deep horse.

this is not directed at anyone, tbh I have seen about 5 instances lately, so no-one stands out.

Just an observation/word to the wise.
 
siennamum said:
I'm paying particular attention to threads about breaking horses at the moment and have noticed something which suprises/horrifies me.
I have always had it drummed into me that potentially the worst thing that can happen is if your roller/saddle slips back. You don't neccesarily tighten them as much as you would if you were on board, especially when you are getting them used to the sensation, and they are likely anyway to hoon around increasing the chances of the roller slipping back.

If they slip back of course they become bucking straps and are likely to cause the horse to panic. The results could be absolutely catastrophic.
I always add a breastplate of some sort, even on a deep horse.

this is not directed at anyone, tbh I have seen about 5 instances lately, so no-one stands out.

Just an observation/word to the wise.
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I think its more of a training problem than a tack one IE you should get a young horse used to having things like ropes and rugs around his hind quarters and legs before you saddle up for the first time then if something slips or makes a noise it hopefully dosent end in a wreck....
 
I have to disagree, (in the nicest possible way =)). Even though you will have your horse used to rope/whip etc round it's back legs & it should trust you enough not to panic if things do feel odd - a roller or saddle round the loins will cause the steadiest of horses to freak. I don't think you can ever really train a horse to accept something like that.
 
siennamum said:
I have to disagree, (in the nicest possible way =)). Even though you will have your horse used to rope/whip etc round it's back legs & it should trust you enough not to panic if things do feel odd - a roller or saddle round the loins will cause the steadiest of horses to freak. I don't think you can ever really train a horse to accept something like that.
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ok example for you.. take the meanest horse that has been bred to buck for the rodeo, the first thing they do after the cowboy is launched onto the ground is someone gets the bucking strap off because guess what if they leave it on the horses get used to it and wont buck properly anymore and a valueble horse is ruined !!!!!!
 
I quite agree, siennamum, it was drummed into me when I first started out working with horses to always use a breastplate/girth when breaking. I think a lot of safety measures have been forgotten and are just not taught anymore.
 
perfect11s said:
ok example for you.. take the meanest horse that has been bred to buck for the rodeo, the first thing they do after the cowboy is launched onto the ground is someone gets the bucking strap off because guess what if they leave it on the horses get used to it and wont buck properly anymore and a valueble horse is ruined !!!!!!
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By the time your 3 year old has had a saddle banging up and down on it's kidneys as it careers round hysterically bucking, it will quite possibly not allow you near it with a saddle again.
That's kind of best case scenario. Worst case is it is sufficiently panicked it goes through fences etc.

Just not worth the risk IMO.
 
mainpower said:
I quite agree, siennamum, it was drummed into me when I first started out working with horses to always use a breastplate/girth when breaking. I think a lot of safety measures have been forgotten and are just not taught anymore.
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I didn't think I imagined it, it has dropped off the radar as an essential safety measure it seems.
 
siennamum said:
By the time your 3 year old has had a saddle banging up and down on it's kidneys as it careers round hysterically bucking, it will quite possibly not allow you near it with a saddle again.
That's kind of best case scenario. Worst case is it is sufficiently panicked it goes through fences etc.

Just not worth the risk IMO.
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oh you english riding people are funny!!!
 
perfect11s said:
oh you english riding people are funny!!!
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I know, quaint is the word you were probably looking for, why would an American breaking method be different in this regard tho' surely a bucking strap is undesirable unless you want a horse to buck and why would you provoke a young horse to buck?

(So long as a few people have read this thread and it makes them review their methods, then I'm happy tbh'...)
 
siennamum said:
I know, quaint is the word you were probably looking for, why would an American breaking method be different in this regard tho' surely a bucking strap is undesirable unless you want a horse to buck and why would you provoke a young horse to buck?

(So long as a few people have read this thread and it makes them review their methods, then I'm happy tbh'...)
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you would want to avoid any bucking if possible, the horse understanding excepting your training methods and trusting you and ending any training session carmer than when he started.. my point was that is better if you could desinsitise a horse to scary things rather than avoiding them. because one day your horse might be in trouble and blow up or spook,
 
siennamum said:
How would you desensitise a horse to the saddle/roller slipping back when it's trotting on the lunge.
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huh ??? you would do it as part of his early ground work standing still , then if something slips later perhaps when he's moving its not a big deal to him because he is used to the sensation..
 
perfect11s said:
huh ??? you would do it as part of his early ground work standing still , then if something slips later perhaps when he's moving its not a big deal to him because he is used to the sensation..
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The sensation would be quite different though if the horse were bucking and that caused the saddle to slip surely you couldn't mimic that. Nor surely would you want to when it's something that's so easily avoided by using a breastplate...

I understand what you are saying interms of desensitisation btw. I have extremely calm & sensible horses who you could pretty much do anything with, they are used to all sorts being done to them and I am far from precious. Mine was backed on a concrete yard with flapping plastic, engine parts and a landscape gardening business within 15 feet. I still managed my risk though and avoided anything which would upset the horse unneccesarily.
 
mainpower said:
I quite agree, siennamum, it was drummed into me when I first started out working with horses to always use a breastplate/girth when breaking. I think a lot of safety measures have been forgotten and are just not taught anymore.
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I wish we had a nodding head smiley! Absolutely agree, anything less is foolish IMHO.
I also wouldn't dream of not using a breastplate for fast or XC work of any kind for the same reason and at least hopefully, if the worse happens, your saddle doesn't get destroyed in the process; I've caught too many horses out hunting that did not have breastplates so end up with saddle either underneath or acting as a bucking strap; not fun trying to catch those!
 
I'll put my hand up (partly to stop the squabbling! :p ) and say I have a newly backed horse and don't wear a breastplate...the thought of it slipping and becoming a rather lumpy 'bucking strap' hadn't even occurred to me :eek:

I will now duly wear one :D but is a breast girth or a hunting breastplate best?

...Surely if the girth is sufficiently loose to allow the saddle to slip back, the saddle could also theoretically slip sideways and end up under the chest?- with some types of breastplate this could make undoing it and getting it off infinitely more complicated!! :o

Which type of breastplate is recommended to prevent the carnage occuring??
 
If it's me, I prefer a proper hunting breastplate as it does have the central girth strap which gives it some restriction. OK, it still might slip to the side but it won't go underneath as the others can; they are just basically circular so can still slip under the stomach.
No, not more complicated just helps if you have someone to hold horse still!
 
I must admit, I have never herd of this but will defo be using one when Oscars ready for backing :D Sadle slipping back is not what i'm going for lol :)
 
I'm not actually a complete obsessive - honestly, it's just something that I thought I'd mention.

I rarely use a breastplate day to day. Generally I have fatties & the saddle isn't going backwards without the girth expanding by about a foot.

When introducing the saddle/roller tho - it did use to be de rigeur, which is why it suprised me that people don't.

Personally I don't have a breaking roller and am too tight to buy one. I go straight to a saddle with a hunting breastplate. When I'm on board the breastplate allows me to hold on surreptitiously, without anyone noticing....
 
I actually back/train all horses bareback first and I always make sure the saddle is tight, the worse thing you could do for a youngster is let them have a bad experience with a saddle slipping etc.
 
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