Breeding Appaloosas

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cloppy

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What colour foal would you expect to breed from a lepoard spot appaloosa and a grey mare (sorry base colour not known) . I have been told that any foal born with spots will grey out but wondered how long this would take. Many thanks
 
Not sure, but I know they're not keen on introducing grey, probably for that reason. However, I used to have a blue & white mare with black spots on her quarters, what may be known as a pintaloosa. I had her for 3 years, during which her colouring didn't change. When i saw her several years later she still looked the same. Don't know how she was bred.
 
Hi,
Not sure of the correct answer as im only recently into spots!!
When I asked if my knabstrupper fillys legs would grey out I was told it depended on if she had the varnish gene. If she does they will grey out just like a iron grey looses its black legs over a matter of years. I dont know if this is the same with the spots. Not for mine as her spots are black (apart from 1 brown 1!)
Will be interested to see what the spotty people on here say tho
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Everyday I tell mine to keep her black legs please, lol, fingers crossed!!
Vicki
 
All depends if your mare is hetrozygous or homozygous for grey.

If she is homozygous then your foal will go grey.
If hetrozygous then you have a 50/50 chance of it not inheriting the grey gene.

I did this cross and my foal was born black with white markings. He was very striking. By the time he was weaned he was white with black spots.

I am fairly certain he is grey though.

You may of course just get a solid colour foal which hasn't inherited the grey or the spots.
I had 2 foals born last year both leopard spot to leopard spot. One solid bay the other chestnut.
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I was not amused!
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We are trying again this time.
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this is all very interesting, so no written rules really as i dont know her base colour. Thank you very much for your replies so far please keep them coming.
 
You are talking several different genes here, but the big issue is the Grey Gene.

It depends what you are breeding for, If you want spots on a part-bred that will not itself be entered into an appaloosa breeding program then no problem really only that if your foal inherits grey then you will not see the spots for long! Grey will obliterate all the spots eventually just like it does on a solid coated horse i.e. your mare and you have at best a 50/50 chance of her foal inheriting grey. The obliteration of the spots can take 2-6 years but they will all go, depending on the depth of each hair folicle. There was a recent thread here about the health issues involving the grey gene in that it is linked to Melanomas, which can shorten a horses life, so you also need to bear that in mind.

Appaloosa varnish / roan should never be confused with the grey gene, it will itself never obliterate the spots on an appaloosa. However it can help to hide grey already in some Appaloosa coat patterns but with the new test for grey I suspect more societies will follow the knabstruppers in constructively eliminating grey from the breed registries. That is why fading in an appaloosa should not be referred to as greying as it is misleading.

Re Appaloosa markings, a leopard is not your best bet for getting appaloosa markings, especially on an outcross mating. To increase the chance of appaloosa coat patterns you would need a true fewspot or certain extended snowcaps, which will limit your choice of stallion. The series of genes involved in appaloosa coat patterns are very complex and a coat pattern can never be guaranteed.

So if you are considering breeding from this mare you would be better off breeding for type than a colour that cannot be guaranteed and if you do get it it might not last for long, unless of course the leopard you had in mind is the best stallion to compliment and enhance the conformation and temperament of the mare.
 
thankyou karynk that is so interesting. I havent decided what to do with the mare yet it was just an out loud thought as to what would happen with that cross as i think appys have super temperaments as well as been attractive. thanks again x
 
If it helps your thinking any, I have now got a half bred appy colt after using a graded British Appaloosa stallion.

I have a 3/4TB chestnut mare, a real allrounder with the most superb temperament - she is my horse of a lifetime, a real tryer at anything you want to do from showing to endurance to eventing and driving, and being a happy hacker and part time dressage pony lately.

As I bred her myself and she was coming up 15, I decided to carry on the line and breed myself the next generation so started scouting about for stallions locally. Several times I had a particular stallion mentioned to me not for his spots but for what a fabulous horse he was turning out.

Initially doing BD and getting points, they were eventing him and so I went a visiting! He's "just up the road" as it were so I arranged to go and see him even though I was actually not convinced about the spots - he's a leopard. But I adored him when I met him - he has a lovely temperament, was one of the most laid back stallions I've ever met - and he moves beautifully.

So I used him, in a way despite the spots, though he is stunning to look at. He complements my mare, was the size I wanted, and was just ideal. I knew from the start (and from help on here of course) that any foal from him as he's chestnut based - could be anything from a plain chestnut like mum, to a leopard like the sire, or something in between.

I got the something in between as I have a chestnut with a white blanket, now 6 months old, and though he can be a naughty boy like any of them can, he is just what I wanted, even had he been plain chestnut he'd have been perfect - the spotty botty is quite literally the icing on the cake!

See pics in sig... hope that helps!
 
He's called Lambrigg Valentine, and stands at the Grange Stud in Ugthorpe near Whitby. But he was bred by the Lambrigg stud in Cumbria, by Negative Nugget and out of Fenjays Royal Flash (I think!)

But he's graded and registered with the British Appaloosa Society.

I'm just registering the Finn-troll at the moment with them...
 
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